Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Samwise Didier

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was no consensus. Essentially, I see a split between keeping and merging; what to do next can be done once this debate is closed. Ritchie333 ^(talk) ^(cont) 17:57, 31 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Samwise Didier[edit]

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Procedural nomination: this article was converted to a redirect in 2016, and was recently nominated for RfD. The RfD outcome was that the article should be restored and brought to AfD. The subject doesn't appear to meet WP:GNG; I was only able to find mere mentions and non-independent coverage. _signed,Rosguill ^talk 23:04, 15 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Artists-related deletion discussions. _signed,Rosguill ^talk 23:04, 15 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Video games-related deletion discussions. _signed,Rosguill ^talk 23:04, 15 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of California-related deletion discussions. _signed,Rosguill ^talk 23:04, 15 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Comment might meet GNG or even NARTIST through the frequent mention of his work in gaming-related sites like ign.com. Personally I think there's a big difference, in terms of originality and control over work product, between an independent artist and one paid to crank out games by a company. However my opinion doesn't impact our notability rules.ThatMontrealIP (talk) 00:57, 16 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
KEEP Seems like a notable artist. https://www.engadget.com/2007-03-16-samwise-didier-warcraft-icon.html and elsewhere gives him coverage. His contributions to the creation of a notable series like Warcraft if mentioned at Wired magazine. https://www.wired.com/2013/10/stay-awhile-and-listen-book/ He interviewed at https://venturebeat.com/2019/05/14/warcraft-at-25-how-blizzards-strategy-game-became-a-media-empire/ Dream Focus 03:03, 16 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep: I found a two-page profile of Didier in an Edge article about Blizzard: "Cold calling" (2004). There's also a capsule review of his 2017 book Grimbeard: The Last Dwarf in Starburst here. He's also got an art book, Brutal: The Art of Samwise, coming out later this year. No reviews yet, because it's coming out in October. I think there's enough here to demonstrate notability. — Toughpigs (talk) 05:38, 16 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete: Actually looking at the sources presented, I've an entirely different take. Even presuming that Engadget blogs are reliable, that source gives all of five gushing, fawning sentences about the subject; certainly not the "significant coverage" the GNG requires. The Wired entry just namedrops the subject in a single sentence. The Venturebeat item is an interview of the subject, which explicitly cannot be used to support the notability of the subject. And that two page profile in Edge is not about Didier: it is an interview where Didier discusses Blizzard's art direction. Does anyone have any sources to proffer about the subject that aren't namedrops, casual references, interviews of him and the like? Which of the criteria of WP:ARTIST does any keep proponent claim the subject meets? Ravenswing 07:14, 18 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Update: I found a profile of Didier from the Orange County Register called "His doodles turn into video game monsters: Now art director for 'StarCraft II,' Sam Didier has been creating orcs, elves and trolls for Blizzard for more than 20 years." (Proquest abstract) Ravenswing, I believe that this is the significant coverage that you were asking for. — Toughpigs (talk) 02:36, 19 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep: with the extra sources, seems like a slam dunk for criteria 3 and 4 of WP:ARTIST. Krinndnz (talk) 03:52, 21 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Sandstein 08:21, 23 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Keep per Toughpigs' source. --Ahecht (TALK
PAGE) 17:27, 23 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Merge to Blizzard Entertainment. Since his contributions are so enduring, there should be no issue paraphrasing them within the existing article on the topic. Ravenswing's analysis is spot on and I'm really surprised to see the lack of critical engagement with his points. As for the ProQuest abstract, that article is freely online. I wouldn't call it a profile and I'd note that it's from a local paper. Not seeing what significant coverage in these links would be used to build a dedicated article on the topic. Most of the actual coverage is about Blizzard art rather than the individual. Merger with potential to expand is the best compromise of the above points. (not watching, please {{ping}}) czar 17:32, 25 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for finding the full text of the OC Register profile; I used it to add more content to the article, and did the same with the Edge profile. As for Ravenswing's argument, I partly agree with it; I don't think that the Engadget, Wired or Venturebeat references would be that helpful, and I haven't used them in the article. But I think his view of the Edge article is wrong; saying that a profile called "The Art of War: Blizzard's art director, Samwise Didier" is not about Samwise Didier is an odd claim. Ravenswing complains that it discusses Blizzard's art direction, but obviously it would; Didier is the Senior Art Director, and it's discussing his work. The OCR, Gaming Illustrated and Edge sources are useful (and have been used) to build the article. — Toughpigs (talk) 18:34, 25 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

concur with Toughpigs — given that Didier has worked for a single employer for 30 years as an increasingly senior & influential contributor, how could one expect to see coverage of him that ignores the massive body of work he's created for that employer? Krinn DNZ (talk) 04:17, 26 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Keep per Toughpigs // Timothy :: talk 01:24, 26 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Merge per Czar. Namcokid 47 ^(Contribs) 00:43, 30 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep I don't see the problem with keeping the page, as he appears to pass WP:NARTIST, all four criteria are met._{ZXCVBNM (TALK)} 01:09, 30 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Update: Made further improvements to the article since its re-listing. Didier has a lot of work that wasn't reflected on the page which is now present. Particularly, I feel that the article now very, very clearly meets criteria 2 of WP:ANYBIO and criteria 3 & 4 of WP:ARTIST. Krinn DNZ (talk) 21:11, 30 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.