Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Ottman Azaitar

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. Consensus is that the subject likely meets the GNG and was on the cusp of passing the WP:MMABIO when coverage ramped up over his breaking of the COVID protocol. -- Patar knight - ^chat/_{contributions} 14:02, 2 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Ottman Azaitar[edit]

[Hide this box] New to Articles for deletion (AfD)? Read these primers!

(Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)

Subject is a mixed martial arts fighter. Fails WP:MMABIO for not fought at least 3 fights in top tier promotion. Fails GNG as fight reports are mainly routine coverage. Cassiopeia^(talk) 00:14, 23 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Sportspeople-related deletion discussions. Shellwood (talk) 00:17, 23 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Martial arts-related deletion discussions. Shellwood (talk) 00:17, 23 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Germany-related deletion discussions. Shellwood (talk) 00:17, 23 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Comment: Hours before this nomination was posted, Azaitar was in headlines all over the place for breaching quarantine protocols before a fight. Examples: ESPN; TMZ; RT; Bleacher Report. I'm not an MMA fan, yet even I saw this on ESPN before stumbling across the nomination. It seems likely that this is what brought the nominator to the article, which is ironic, since the nomination cites a lack of coverage as a reason for deletion. And even leaving aside the litany of recent sources, the article has plenty of sources which go well beyond "fight reports"; in fact, only four of the 22 sources appear to be fight reports at all. --Usernameunique (talk) 03:32, 23 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Comment" - Fighter got released is a normal event as it is a routine fight report regardless of a loss of a fight, missing weight, violate of covid safely rules. Plenty of UFC fighters got released being passing having at least 3 fights in UFC with source reported of the release. Btw TMZ and RT is not considered reliable sources. Cassiopeia^(talk) 03:59, 23 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Keep per Usernameunique. Vaticidalprophet (talk) 04:01, 23 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Keep per Usernameunique. It wasn't "a normal event". Also, Azaitar (and his brother) has a harrowing, disturbing criminal history and "ties to some of the most notorious men in Germany." ref BloodyElbow.com: From Prison to the King’s Palace: Abu Azaitar’s UFC Hamburg debut marred by criminal past Kosbit4 (talk) 04:49, 23 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Speedy Delete Review WP:MMABIO Kent Bargo (talk) 06:04, 23 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Comment There are points to consider on both sides. It's true he fails to meet WP:NMMA, but he was only one day away from his third fight and had won his first two. He was suspended for breaking Covid protocol, but we also don't know what was in the bag. It's not unreasonable, though purely speculative at this time, to wonder if it was performance enhancing or otherwise banned substances. It's unlikely that the guy scaling buildings was the pizza delivery man. The article mentioned by Kosbit4 contains 1 passing mention of Ottman--it was his brothers Abu and Omar who got in trouble with the law. So it's not clear that WP:GNG is met. Because he was so close to getting his third fight, and likely more, I believe he would have easily met WP:NMMA if not for the incident that generated coverage. I'd say he was more notable as a fighter than some fighters that meet NMMA by losing 3 fights. Papaursa (talk) 21:48, 23 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

* Comment @Papaursa: so you are saying the page should be kept because this "incident" was very surprising. It does not seem like it, considering the UFC made ridiculous moves to bypassing the COVID-19 laws/health experts in other states just "open up UFC" leaving high number people infected with COVID 19 and Dana White has not worn a mask yet. They should listen health experts by remaining closed until it safe and to avoid further harming others. It does not seem it will get pass WP:MMABIO. Kent Bargo (talk) 00:03, 24 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

If I was saying that the page should be kept, I would have voted to keep it. I'm was merely pointing out that there are reasonable arguments on both sides. I haven't decided which side I'm going to come down on, or if I'm just going to stay neutral. Papaursa (talk) 04:08, 24 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Keep Due to his COVID-19 shenanigans, he definitely meets WP:GNG now.Victory in Germany (talk) 05:40, 24 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The COVID-19 rules were designed for Abu Dabi UFC. Its not significant and considering UFC bypassed ways to opened up despite true health experts and laws prevent it from doing soo. Yo saying i can create a page for a random person in the world who did same thing and have page kept. It has to passs WP:MMABIO Kent Bargo (talk) 23:56, 24 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Keep while it is true that the subject fails WP:MMABIO, that is largely irrelevant as the subject seems to pass WP:GNG. Opposed to what the nominator says, not all of the references in the article are WP:ROUTINE, with some being moderately in-depth. Hence a slightly hesitant keep is my !vote. Inter&anthro (talk) 04:09, 25 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.