Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/Smile Lee/Archive

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Smile Lee

Smile Lee (talk+ · tag · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · spi block · block log · CA · CheckUser(log) · investigate · cuwiki)
05 March 2015[edit]
Suspected sockpuppets


BeachesParadise=BeachParadise as per this.

BeachesParadise has been primarily involved with the Heaven Sent Gaming draft and the article's AfD, as seen with previous socks. The account also redirected Heaven Sent Gaming related articles 1, 2, just like the blocked sock, DunDunDunt.

DocterCox initially created Little Anita's and Boba Tea Company, which was later picked up by Smile Lee. The account also was interested in the revival of the deleted HSG article. The user also has the same opinion as Smile Lee on a few AfDs 1, 2, 3.

I've blocked both accounts based upon behavior. Mike V • Talk 01:49, 6 March 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Comments by other users[edit]

Accused parties may also comment/discuss in this section below. See Defending yourself against claims.

  • I did not want to have anything to do with the Heaven Sent Gaming draft, and I am not interested in having an article about myself or my company, I don't know why I'm in this list. My website was hacked, and harassing comments appeared on my site during the first discussion of deletion, this information, along with IP related to that incident were sent to [email protected] in July or August-ish of last year, the problem was solved on my site at least. I have been unaware of their behavior since. Smile Lee (talk) 06:13, 5 March 2015 (UTC)[reply]


Clerk, CheckUser, and/or patrolling admin comments[edit]
  •  Confirmed at the request of a crosswiki CU:
-- DQ (ʞlɐʇ) 04:48, 5 March 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • Per Smile Lee's comment above, I ran some additional checks. The checkuser evidence is unambiguous, and I agree that all of the above are  Confirmed matches to one another. ​—DoRD (talk)​ 21:52, 5 March 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • I've added Mystic Sonic to the case as well, as the user openly admits it's Sonic Lee on Commons. Mike V • Talk 22:02, 5 March 2015 (UTC)[reply]
    • It was pointed out to me that the account does not have a SUL. I've unblocked it for now and left a suspected tag on the user page. Mike V • Talk 06:11, 6 March 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • all are tagged and blocked. Closing the case. Vanjagenije (talk) 22:57, 5 March 2015 (UTC)[reply]
    • I"m holding the case for now. There are additional accounts that have been brought to my attention that need to be decided behaviorally. Mike V • Talk 23:24, 5 March 2015 (UTC)[reply]
      • I think I found them all for now, closing. Mike V • Talk 01:49, 6 March 2015 (UTC)[reply]
30 April 2015[edit]
Suspected sockpuppets

Attempted recreation (yet again) of article about Smile Lee's business Draft:Heaven Sent Gaming. Similar use of extremely flimsy sources to establish notability, per Kieron Donoghue. User defends Smile Lee (on a first name basis) as being an innocent bystander,[1] in spite of check user evidence and mountains of behavioral evidence already documented. Grayfell (talk) 23:35, 30 April 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Comments by other users[edit]

Accused parties may also comment/discuss in this section below. See Defending yourself against claims.


Clerk, CheckUser, and/or patrolling admin comments[edit]
  • The technical data is  Inconclusive. However, given the behavioral evidence and other factors, I'm confident it's the same individual. Mike V • Talk 02:20, 1 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

26 September 2015[edit]

Suspected sockpuppets

Ruski22's first edit was to create Christian Comic Arts Society which includes mention of Smile Lee's much deleted project Heaven Sent Gaming supported only by a primary profile. Ruski22 later restores a link to heavensentgaming.com used as a source at Silver City, New Mexico,[2] which has no other connection to Christian comic books. The IP that originally added the link (71.210.198.251) also edited the page about Silver City musician Al Hurricane, which was mostly written by Smile Lee (and socks).

Ruski22 defends Heaven Sent Gaming as a reliable source (it isn't) on Talk:New Mexico chile, where they claim ignorance of the topic, but maintain that the site is reliable anyway because it establishes information. The lengthy writing style full of personal tidbits also matches the sockfarm's many AFD arguments.[3]

Ruski22 was apparently mistakenly bot-blocked as part of the Orangemoody case and then unblocked. If this was connected to proxy use, it would fit past patterns considering Smile Lee's aggressive and deceptive past history. Alternately, it would also explain why Ruski22, a two month-old account, calls sock investigations "routine" on the chile talk page. Grayfell (talk) 22:02, 26 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

More connections: IP 97.123.7.170 (contribs) was one of many !votes for keeping Heaven Sent Gaming, and has also !voted to keep Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Tobuscus Adventures: Wizards!, a game made by youtube personality Toby Turner. On the chile talk page, Ruski22 mentions Turner as an example of an overturned deletion discussion. There is no obvious connection between Turner and New Mexico or comic books, so this seems way too obscure to be a coincidence. Grayfell (talk) 00:43, 27 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Okay, so looking at the CCAS' website, Mario J. Lucero (Smile Lee has repeatedly said he is Lucero) joined August 4, 2015, which is the same day the CCAS article was created.[4] CCAS has 1,628 members, and there's no indication of greater significance for Lucero. There is no way that's a coincidence, this is clearly Smile Lee creating a new account to write an article about a group he just joined. Grayfell (talk) 05:48, 27 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Comments by other users[edit]

Accused parties may also comment/discuss in this section below. See Defending yourself against claims.

Grayfell didn't even warn me about any of this. Extremely bad faith, I was already investigated for an Orangemoody thing, and now this? Is this all this site is? Investigations against wild accusations. I am not Mario, I do not know Mario, and I only brought him up because you did. Ruski22 (talk) 03:47, 27 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

What the heck is Silver City musician Al Hurricane? I don't even know what you're talking about. I edited the Silver City thing since you had been on a tirade about removing the source in question. I'm outta here, not touching this subject again with a ten-foot-pole. Ruski22 (talk) 03:51, 27 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

"Tirade" eh? You mean the two sentences on Talk:New Mexico chile explaining why the source should be treated as spam? How did you find out about my "tirade", then? How did your research about Christian organizations lead you to a talk page about a New Mexican food product, and why did that make you want to jump into the fray about small-town New Mexican restaurants? Actually, how did you even notice the edit to Silver City? It was weeks ago, and I've made many edits since then, removing dozens of spammy links from various articles. It's incredibly unlikely that you just happen to have stumbled on a page that used to include this incredibly obscure site Heaven Sent Gaming. Since this is exactly the same behavior we've seen from other socks, explaining your behavior would be helpful. Grayfell (talk) 04:41, 27 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]
I searched "Heaven Sent Gaming", on Talk pages on Wikipedia, and there we go. I did the same about "Clint D. Johnson", "Heaven Sent Gaming" and "Captain Salvation", all three of which, I happened to find out about when researching the Christian Comic Arts Society. I also see now that you were involved in a deletion on a New Mexican English related to a Heaven Sent Gaming thing, I don't care about New Mexico and I have no interest in editing anything related to it any more. I can't see the "dozens of spammy" links from Heaven Sent Gaming your referring to, from your editing history I only see like 4 or 5. I don't really know why you have taken an interest in some small "obscure" publisher like Heaven Sent Gaming, but you have been directly involved with several deletion and removal discussions about Heaven Sent Gaming.Ruski22 (talk) 04:56, 27 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]
I don't believe I've ever edited New Mexican English, although the spammy nature of those links is evident from the multiple discussion on that article's talk page (Talk:New Mexican English). There again we have an editor saying that the link doesn't have to stay, but that it's a reliable because it's factual, which completely ignores the point of WP:RS. I've removed many spammy links from many pages, only a few of which have been Heaven Sent Gaming related. How did you find the one I made to Silver City? Grayfell (talk) 05:42, 27 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Clerk, CheckUser, and/or patrolling admin comments[edit]

  • CheckUser requested and endorsed by clerk - @DeltaQuad, DoRD, and Mike V: Is it possible to compare him to previous accounts using the CU log data? Vanjagenije (talk) 09:33, 27 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comparing it to some of the technical data from past accounts, I'd say it is  Likely. I've blocked the account. Mike V • Talk 23:24, 28 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

18 November 2015[edit]

Suspected sockpuppets

IP from proxy server trying, once again, to recreate Draft:Heaven Sent Gaming Grayfell (talk) 00:17, 18 November 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Comments by other users[edit]

Accused parties may also comment/discuss in this section below. See Defending yourself against claims.

Might want to do a range block of 178.73.210.*. At Talk:Earthquake_prediction#Earthquake_forecast there are two more instances where someone is pushing the fringe theories of one Omerbashich. These relate to the blocked user Aminidi. ~ J. Johnson (JJ) (talk) 22:16, 20 November 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Clerk, CheckUser, and/or patrolling admin comments[edit]

  • I've blocked the 178.73.210.0/24 range for 36 hours. Closing. Vanjagenije (talk) 15:15, 22 November 2015 (UTC)[reply]

10 April 2016[edit]

Suspected sockpuppets

Created El Gringo (musician) on April 4th. Sources describe El Gringo as a Mexican Regional artist, but this editor links him (reasonably, to be fair) to New Mexico music, which was Smile Lee's major area of activity. The article used Heaven Sent Gaming as a reference, which is Smile Lee's website, and one he has aggressively spammed in the past. The article at Smile Lee's website was last edited April 4, same day the Wikipedia article was created. Whoops, was just edited today. Wish I had grabbed it in Archive.org to see what the difference was. Oh well.

This editor has the same conversational style as Smile Lee and socks, which is hard to describe, but very distinctive. Grayfell (talk) 06:04, 10 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]

The Heaven Sent Gaming site has been updated to mirror LittleMissIndependent's recent changes to the Wikipedia article. The phrase:
  • His singles, though they primarily chart and receive recognition on New Mexico music charts, he is primarily known as Regional Mexican music. was added to the Heaven Sent Gaming article (compare to archive)
LittleMissIndependent has added:
  • His music has been well received within the New Mexico music circles, but he is primarily known for performing Regional Mexican style music.[5]
Just like all the other socks, LittleMissIndependent professes surprise and confusion over why Heaven Sent Gaming isn't acceptable at Talk:El Gringo (musician). Grayfell (talk) 20:52, 11 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Comments by other users[edit]

Accused parties may also comment/discuss in this section below. See Defending yourself against claims.

Comment Apologies for wrong venue, but at least related... but maybe it's time for heavensentgaming.com to be added to the spam filters as well. Can anyone point me to the right venue to request that? -- ferret (talk) 21:06, 11 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Yeah, that's a good idea. I think MediaWiki talk:Spam-blacklist#Proposed additions is the right place. Grayfell (talk) 03:53, 16 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Clerk, CheckUser, and/or patrolling admin comments[edit]

  • CheckUser requested and endorsed by clerk - I recall there was significant cross-wiki investigation last year. Is there anything that can be investigated here from a technical viewpoint despite the latest known local sock being stale? ☺ · Salvidrim! · ✉ 21:03, 11 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]
  • Sorry, the checkuser tool isn't much help here. Moving to the open queue. Mike V • Talk 02:27, 12 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]
  • The evidence is sufficient to convince me that LittleMissIndependent is indeed a sockpuppet. Blocked and tagged. ​—DoRD (talk)​ 14:27, 17 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]

17 March 2019[edit]

Suspected sockpuppets[edit]

Yet again, this account seems fixated on promoting the legitimacy of Heaven Sent Gaming as a source. After it was explained this was disruptive sock puppetry and time-sinking nonsense, 2600Texan says "That Heaven Sent Gaming issue sounds like a gigantic misunderstanding, and it should be worked out with them, sounds like both sites were dealing with spam." and "Heaven Sent Gaming is most certainly not spam, and they have many contact methods all over their site, contact them and work it out." Previous socks have encouraged editors to contact the site to clear this up (as seen here) although they never explain what that would accomplish.

Rambling sentences are standard with this sock. As with Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Heaven Sent Gaming, this editor seems to think any mention of Heaven Sent Gaming in any borderline source must indicate that it's a reliable source.

These accounts like to include stilted, and sometimes implausible, biographies on their userpages that mention where they are supposedly from. Compare "I'm a female Japanese-Canadian in Albuquerque, NM!", I am from China", "I'm a native Hawaiian!", "I have returned, after a great experience at the University of Oxford", and "NYC native, from the Bronx" to 2600Texan's: "Sandia Pueblo man living under the safety of the Lone Star."

This edit is the account acknowledging its IP address]. This sock-farm has used proxies in the past, such as the many IPs at the AFD. Grayfell (talk) 03:56, 17 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Comments by other users[edit]

Accused parties may also comment/discuss in this section below. See Defending yourself against claims.

I wasn’t notified that this was going on, so that’s lovely. I’m not a sockpuppet of Smile Lee, and from what I can see, there hasn’t been any sockpuppet related activity about this subject for years. After reading about this case, that I was dragged into by the way, I don’t believe Smile Lee was the one behind the sock puppetry to begin with.

I will debunk the accusations made above;

  • I’m not fixated on Heaven Sent Gaming, I made a brief mention on one of their productions being a potential source on the English in New Mexico article. And was immediately branded with accusations and hostility. I brought up why they should be contacted, and explained that it would prevent false accusations such as these.
  • My bio isn’t implausible, Texas is the State just East of NM, where Sandia Pueblo is located, plenty of New Mexican expats move to Texas or California. But now that you mention it, you know who else didn’t have an implausible, biography on their userpage, Smile Lee. Which is more evidence that he wasn’t the one at the center of the sockpuppetry, he even mentions wanting to make things right on his LinkedIn profile https://www.linkedin.com/in/mariojlucero and he continues to use Smile Lee as his Twitter handle https://twitter.com/smile_lee
  • That IP issue was one that affected much of central Texas, it’s unrelated to this issue. It was why I created an account in the first place, I used to just edit Wikipedia anonymously, and I had to create an account. 2600Texan (talk) 16:35, 26 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  • So far, every single talk page post by 2600Texan has defended Heaven Sent Gaming and/or Smile Lee. This is despite the mountains of evidence, use of proxies, and past check-user evidence. These soft-journalism stories do not demonstrate that this is a reliable source, btw, and posting a Linkedin profile speaks for itself.
To 2600Texan: If you're not Smile Lee, perhaps spend less time researching his site and reading his resume and social media. Presenting your findings on an obscure part of a website few people will read is not a productive use of anyone's time.
Free advice to Mr. Lucero: using a resume for badmouthing a previous position is considered a big red flag by prospective employers. Grayfell (talk) 02:59, 29 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

^ User:Grayfell This is a reasonable set of arguments on the present impasse.

  • I have defended my position beyond both Heaven Sent Gaming and Smile Lee, and I have done so meticulously and thoroughly. Including my stance on moving the page location for the English in New Mexico. The LinkedIn profile had nothing to do with proving reliability, it fills in the other half of this story as it is proof that Smile Lee was not the main sockpuppet, and that there was a misunderstanding, and there was a spam issue on their site as well. Like I said, they should be contacted to clear the air so this kind of issue doesn’t come up again. As the accused, I want to make sure that this doesn’t happen again, and that hard working editors like you Grayfell don’t have to be bogged down by this ever again. Solutions as opposed to kicking the can down the road again.
  • I have presented a large number high traffic reliable and reputable independent sources, and I do not see it being soft-journalism they are simply covering the benign subject of an independent production studio. But you are correct, this obscure area isn’t the place to discuss either the previous positions or this one, we are getting close to break-through though as I do agree on something. I don’t think there is demonstrable evidence they are reliable source according to Wikipedia standards, perhaps one day, yet I do think there is demonstrable proof that they are notable according to Wikipedia standards.
  • I agree on the critique of his resume but, being frank, I don’t care to critique the content of his resume, as rightfully I don’t think he would care about our opinion either way. You’d have to take that up with Mr. Lucero. 2600Texan (talk) 04:09, 29 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
A self-promotional LinkedIn profile is "proof" of absolutely nothing. Even if I accepted his claims of also facing spam, which I do not, that has nothing to do with his documented behavior on this website, which was deceptive and disruptive.
You came back to this page days later to respond to this, and again, literally every single talk page post you have made has gone to excessive lengths to defend Smile Lee and his website as a victim of a misunderstanding, despite the overwhelming evidence to the contrary. Grayfell (talk) 04:28, 29 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  • I like that you are a reasonable but determined individual. I just did a search for your user name on social media, you are determined in the face of bias and I like that. While I do believe his claims, I believe your claims as well, and that is fine you’re both allowed to have a world view. I’m just looking at both sides of the equation and I can see crystal clear that one half of the equation seems to want to make it work, which is progress. And I think other editors here on Wikipedia would like to solve the issue instead of again kicking the can down to road. That production studio is notable, and Smile Lee is not the only prominent member their studio, the President named Isabel Lucero has an interview about her in an independent magazine called Spectrum. They should be contacted to get that list of sockpuppets, to keep these false accusations from happening again, and to clear Smile Lee of it because is a false-positive lead.
  • Yes, because I had to defend myself against accusations. I didn’t even know about Smile Lee until this was brought to my attention, by you. I have gone to excessive lengths to understand these accusations. Because I like to solve problems, it is just how I am. There is evidence to support both claims, what I aim to solve is a peaceful resolution. This is what I have been harping on. Nobody involved is a victim of anything here, except an obvious misunderstanding. I have to at least commend his LinkedIn on not passing the blame to an underling, and instead tossing it with deadpan humor on xenophobia subtly referencing the added Frank West to a list focused on his New Mexico created articles, too instead owning up to wanting to clear the issue by providing the truth. 2600Texan (talk) 18:24, 29 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Clerk, CheckUser, and/or patrolling admin comments[edit]

  • Checkuser is unlikely to be of any help, especially given the age of the previous accounts. Based on behavioral evidence, I'm inclined to agree that 2600Texan is Ruski22.  Blocked and tagged ST47 (talk) 20:28, 12 April 2019 (UTC)[reply]

05 August 2022[edit]

Suspected sockpuppets[edit]

Fairly clear case here. Two brand new accounts (and a few IPs) editing exclusively on pages related to New Mexico. The original "Guac" user has attempted to insert essay-like material on the New Mexico page, including links to pages they recently created, like here and here and here. After edit warring using IPs, the user likely created another account to make significant changes to the page, here. Novemberjazz 14:39, 5 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Comments by other users[edit]

Accused parties may also comment/discuss in this section below. See Defending yourself against claims.

Clerk, CheckUser, and/or patrolling admin comments[edit]

21 April 2023[edit]

Suspected sockpuppets[edit]

I think this farm is the same as Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/JustMyOpiñon. The style, focus, and abuse of flimsy sources are all a far too similar for this to be a coincidence.

Overlapping articles or topics include:

ThePetroglyph and Asako Geeks like to quickly make short, fully-formed articles based on uneven sources. This matches both sock farms.

Many other edits are to articles which were spammed by IPs to add refs by Mario J. Lucero. His personal websites uses the name Heaven Sent Gaming, which has had to be salted due to behavior like this: Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Heaven Sent Gaming (2nd nomination) and Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Draft:Heaven Sent Gaming and so on. Smile Lee was the source of all of this.

Spam for Lucero/Heaven Sent Gaming added by IPs on articles later edited by ThePetroglyph:

ThePetroglyph directly added such a link when creating Bibliography of New Mexico.

Spam for Smile Lee directly added by Asako Geeks:

Spam from IP at article also edited by Asako Geeks:

JustMyOpiñon created Draft:New Mexico Piñon Coffee in 2018. ThePetroglyph precociously created both Piñon coffee and New Mexico Piñon Coffee back-to-back recently.

ThePetroglyph focuses on New Mexico-related culture, with specific interest in food (restaurants, specific agricultural goods, and commercial food companies) and New Mexican music. These were both JustMyOpiñon and Smile Lee's focus.

Asako Geeks focuses on Japanese topics, including Japanese restaurants and Japanese Country music. Smile Lee also edited this area. Mario Lucero has written for 'Tokyo Weekender', and Asako Geeks and IPs from an obviously related geolocation have been adding that link as refspam. In 2020, a Japanese editor asked on my talk page and on the Help desk regarding Smile Lee spam on the JP Wiki.

The stylistic similarities are also very clear from previous discussions with these socks. All of these accounts love using WP:WEASEL words as filler, for example, and also like sharing personal trivia in an oddly specific way. This matches past clumsy attempts at creating red herrings. I can provide examples, if necessary.

I have also raised this at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Spam#Heaven Sent Gaming and aywv.art. Grayfell (talk) 04:41, 21 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Comments by other users[edit]

Accused parties may also comment/discuss in this section below. See Defending yourself against claims.

Clerk, CheckUser, and/or patrolling admin comments[edit]

  • CheckUser requested and endorsed by clerk - to compare ThePetroglyph and Asako Geeks per the evidence in the filing and look for other accounts. I agree that this looks like the same case as WP:Sockpuppet investigations/JustMyOpiñon (I had actually suspected that ThePetroglyph was a sock of JMO when I came across them earlier, but I hadn't followed up on it yet). In that case CU showed that they were operating 7 accounts at once, so a sleeper check seems like a good idea. The previous socks in both the Smile Lee and JMO cases are stale, but there may be something useful in the CU logs for JMO. Oh, and 2601:8C0:C7C:3DF0::/64 (talk+ · tag · contribs · filter log · WHOIS · RBLs · proxy check · block user · spi block · block log · cross-wiki contribs · CheckUser (log)) is clearly being used by the same person, editing the same topics and adding links to Heaven Sent Gaming. Just noting for the record. Thanks, Spicy (talk) 16:02, 22 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]
  • Spicy Here's what I observe. ThePetroglyph and Asako Geeks have never edited from the same IP range, but they geolocate to the same city. The ThePetroglyph edits out of a narrow, stable range with no other activity on it. Asako Geeks very often edits without logging in, and they created Alkaline Plus about a month ago. According to the logs, their geolocation is a good match for JustMyOpiñon; not so much for the socks in this case (but we're going off some old logs here). Girth Summit (blether) 17:37, 22 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]
  • Thanks. I've blocked these accounts as proven to JMO and suspected to Smile Lee. Also blocked the /64 for a while. Closing. Thanks, Spicy (talk) 18:33, 22 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]
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