Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/SuperKombat World Grand Prix II
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- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was delete. sourcing issues do not appear to have been addressed so the delete side wins it. Can i remind the participants that casting aspertions on the motivations and actions of other users could be a good way to get your votes discarded so please don't do it. Spartaz Humbug! 19:50, 11 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]
SuperKombat World Grand Prix II[edit]
- SuperKombat World Grand Prix II (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log)
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In my opinion, this is a blatant use of the encyclopedia for event promotion. Using a poster to illustrate the page demonstrates the slippery slope issues at play. Not all sporting events are notable. Provided sources for event are sports blogs. As I stated in the AfD procedure for this event's predecessor (which has already occurred and not drawn significant resonance from the kickboxing media): "Filling in a redlink on a notable fighter's kickboxing record seems a low bar for inclusion." Since the event hasn't occurred, WP:CRYSTAL is also in play here. BusterD (talk) 13:46, 2 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Martial arts-related deletion discussions. —BusterD (talk) 13:52, 2 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Events-related deletion discussions. —BusterD (talk) 13:52, 2 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]
— BusterD (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.
- agreed it is a poor attempt to discredit the nominator. the tags is for single purpose editors, clearly people are going to resort to desperate tactics to save these articles. LibStar (talk) 16:15, 2 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Keep The contributor has already added sources and it’s obvious that more details will emerge as the event occurs. I would suggest people wait till the outcome of the first Super Kombat page before nominating extra pages as it does feel like the kickboxing pages are under siege by deletionists who are nominating what seems to be every single page. As mentioned in previous nominations this is a notable up and coming promotion which has notable fighters competing in a tournament format competition with tv and media interest from across the world including Eurosport one of the top sports channels in Europe. If you have any idea about mma or kickboxing think 3rd most notable in Europe behind It's Showtime and possibly United Glory (about 4th or 5th globally). This is an important event and it should not be deleted on notability issues. If people think we are here to promote events in some sort of sinister manner you are wrong. We are fans who are passionate about our sport. Thank you. jsmith006 (talk) 15:01, 2 July 2011
- Strong Keep Another abuse of some users that hint positions and want to make points on our back, honest writers who improve the kickboxing database. There are lot of kickboxing fans who use in this moment wikipedia, because of our work (Marty, Jsmith, me and others who are involved in the kickboxing projects) the database is the most complete on the internet. About this Superkombat organisation: considering K-1's decline, this Romanian promotion is in this moment considered the second promotion from the world, after the famous Dutch It's Showtime. There will be one title involved in this event, from parental organisation WAKO-Pro, while other notable fithers are scheduled to fight: Stefan Leko, Mighty Mo (kickboxer), Singh Jaideep, etc. I would also argue that martial arts are not as mainstream as most other sports so relying on the big newspapers like the New York Times for event details is not going to be possible. But, the promotion signed a contract with Eurosport (all the events are LIVE broadcasts on this tv channel) and with televisions from Asia, South America and Pacific. IF YOU KEEP ABUSING US (the honest kickboxing writers who write work here as volunteers), we will leave the community! This is an abuse, kickboxing is practically dead in United States, where you follow mainly MMA. You practically dont respect the other continents, Europe and Asia, from where this phenomen appeared. You are completely behind kickboxing and dont have minimum knowledges, no offence.
Cyperuspapyrus (talk) 16:17 CET, 2 July 2011
- Delete. Per nom. Similar articles are being proposed for deletion, and my assumption is that the same supporting editors of these "events" will be voicing their support and outrage. See Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/SuperKombat World Grand Prix I. Many, like Cyperus, appear to take these nominations personally and make silly threats (see above).--Bbb23 (talk) 14:29, 2 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Comment (to above) Your assumption is absolutely correct Bbb23 although your reasons are not. If many people are taking it personally then maybe it’s because you aren’t very good at communication. Calling Cyperus threats silly because he cares about his pages and is genuinely upset about his (sourced and notable) pages being nominated is pretty cold (not very fitting for a person who doesn't like mean people according to his profile). If I’d have had you guys ganging up on me two years ago I probably wouldn’t be here either. We may seem like stupid kickboxing fans who aren’t into philosophy or the wonders of the universe but the events we write about are notable for kickboxing. The recent (possibly deliberate) targeting of our pages by people with little or no knowledge of the sport, actually appears very unfair esp as sources have been applied and weaker pages haven't got a mention. I’ve worked on kickboxing pages for over two years here and never had a problem till recently – it’s quite distressing to see something you have worked on for two years seemingly being undone before our eyes. jsmith006 (talk) 15:57, 2 July 2011
- Comment. It's human and understandable after investing time and energy in an article to want to keep it, even though, of course, none of us owns the articles we work on or create. However, Cyperus's comments go well beyond such a response, screaming and crying abuse and conspiracy. "Silly" is a nicer word than he deserves. Frankly, you're part of the problem as phrases like "ganging up" and "possibly deliberate" are clearly euphemisms for the same allegations of conspiracy. Anyway, fortunately, Cyperus has you to comfort him and to encourage such misguided views. See here.--Bbb23 (talk) 16:01, 2 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- To above - Well done for checking his talk page – you really got me there. Of course I’m going to offer support. If I’m correct you were the one who had some sort of argument with Cyperus to start with – before I’d even begun my role as ‘comforter’ so to accuse me as part of the problem is absolutely laughable. Cyperus is a young user who is only just getting to grips with Wikipedia, to who English is a second language, and you a supposed hater of ‘mean people’ could have been more understanding given the circumstances. One last thing, have you even checked how many kickboxing pages have been nominated recently SuperKombat World Grand Prix, SuperKombat World Grand Prix II, all of Thai & Kickbox SuperLeague, K-1 Europe Grand Prix 2009 in Tallinn, K-1 Rumble of the Kings 2009 in Stockholm, KOK Europe GP 2011 in Vilnius/KOK Europe GP 2011 in Chişinău – if this isn’t a concerted effort by deletionists (one in particular) then I don’t know what is. I won’t even ask your opinion on it because to you guys this is probably better than Christmas for a four year old. “Quick guys over to the K-1 pages there’s deleting to be done”. jsmith006 (talk) 17:49, 2 July 2011
- Actually, you do a better job confirming that you are part of the problem than I could ever do. However, all of our comments are becoming distracting. Hopefully, every AfD will be evaluated on its own terms.--Bbb23 (talk) 17:02, 2 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- What an earth are you talking about – I’m part of the problem – what problem is that, resistance to you guys? I don’t remember ever going around to multiple pages and slapping a deletion symbol without even consulting anyone. I haven’t gone around saying that you’d better not create anymore pages until this is sorted out. All I’ve done is stuck to my subject of speciality and created pages. If you think it’s a good thing to make things so rigid that people in certain fields are scared to contribute or are driven off because they don’t want to have to deal with this sort of thing – then yes (to you) I must be part of the problem. jsmith006 (talk) 18:17, 2 July 2011
- Actually, you do a better job confirming that you are part of the problem than I could ever do. However, all of our comments are becoming distracting. Hopefully, every AfD will be evaluated on its own terms.--Bbb23 (talk) 17:02, 2 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- To above - Well done for checking his talk page – you really got me there. Of course I’m going to offer support. If I’m correct you were the one who had some sort of argument with Cyperus to start with – before I’d even begun my role as ‘comforter’ so to accuse me as part of the problem is absolutely laughable. Cyperus is a young user who is only just getting to grips with Wikipedia, to who English is a second language, and you a supposed hater of ‘mean people’ could have been more understanding given the circumstances. One last thing, have you even checked how many kickboxing pages have been nominated recently SuperKombat World Grand Prix, SuperKombat World Grand Prix II, all of Thai & Kickbox SuperLeague, K-1 Europe Grand Prix 2009 in Tallinn, K-1 Rumble of the Kings 2009 in Stockholm, KOK Europe GP 2011 in Vilnius/KOK Europe GP 2011 in Chişinău – if this isn’t a concerted effort by deletionists (one in particular) then I don’t know what is. I won’t even ask your opinion on it because to you guys this is probably better than Christmas for a four year old. “Quick guys over to the K-1 pages there’s deleting to be done”. jsmith006 (talk) 17:49, 2 July 2011
- Comment. It's human and understandable after investing time and energy in an article to want to keep it, even though, of course, none of us owns the articles we work on or create. However, Cyperus's comments go well beyond such a response, screaming and crying abuse and conspiracy. "Silly" is a nicer word than he deserves. Frankly, you're part of the problem as phrases like "ganging up" and "possibly deliberate" are clearly euphemisms for the same allegations of conspiracy. Anyway, fortunately, Cyperus has you to comfort him and to encourage such misguided views. See here.--Bbb23 (talk) 16:01, 2 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Comment (to above) Your assumption is absolutely correct Bbb23 although your reasons are not. If many people are taking it personally then maybe it’s because you aren’t very good at communication. Calling Cyperus threats silly because he cares about his pages and is genuinely upset about his (sourced and notable) pages being nominated is pretty cold (not very fitting for a person who doesn't like mean people according to his profile). If I’d have had you guys ganging up on me two years ago I probably wouldn’t be here either. We may seem like stupid kickboxing fans who aren’t into philosophy or the wonders of the universe but the events we write about are notable for kickboxing. The recent (possibly deliberate) targeting of our pages by people with little or no knowledge of the sport, actually appears very unfair esp as sources have been applied and weaker pages haven't got a mention. I’ve worked on kickboxing pages for over two years here and never had a problem till recently – it’s quite distressing to see something you have worked on for two years seemingly being undone before our eyes. jsmith006 (talk) 15:57, 2 July 2011
- Keep There is absolutely nothing wrong with this article. It is notable and well sourced. It was also one of the biggest cards of the year.WölffReik (talk) 15:33, 2 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- do you have any sources to back your claim of "biggest cards"? LibStar (talk) 15:31, 2 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Delete event hasn't even occurred yet. and for it to pass notability it must have third party sources. being telecast in 83 countries is not a claim for notability. LibStar (talk) 15:31, 2 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Comment Title match, maybe notable? Fighters that are scheduled to fight? Should we also delete the It's Showtime events in your opinion? Let's delete whole kickboxing database. It's Showtime and SuperKombat are not important, it doesnt matter there are both top 3 in the world organisations. And same users came here too, I wonder if there are not same person. Cyperuspapyrus (talk)) 17:38 CET, 2 July 2011
- no, just because WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS is not a reason for keeping. please provide evidence of third party sources (ie not connected to kickboxing or the televising) to demonstrate notability. LibStar (talk) 15:43, 2 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Delete With the notable exception of WP:CRYSTAL arguments supporting deletion, this thread looks essentially identical to the other kickboxing AfDs. I found this Romanian news source, but it's a brief mention of the event and the fighters involved. I'm not convinced this is enough coverage, though there may be more after the event occurs, at which point it would be appropriate to make this article. I, Jethrobot drop me a line 18:23, 2 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- New Source [1] or type Local Kombat prezinta gala SUPERKOMBAT Constanta! Stefan Leko se bate cu Morosanu! Vezi TOT cardul galei de pe 16 – preview showing fighters etc. The website it belongs to also has boxing, wrestling, mma and is the premier website for combat sports in Romania. jsmith006 (talk) 12:03, 5 July 2011
- Not really Another kombat.ro? That's three. Fails WP:DIVERSE. All of these sources are merely sports promotion, and don't meet the standard for independent reliable sources. I could see a merge between all three events and the parent company. To make it clear: This page fails WP:CRYSTAL, because the event hasn't even occurred yet. It fails every other test of WP:EVENT as well. Fails WP:EFFECT, fails WP:INDEPTH, fails WP:GEOSCOPE, and fails WP:PERSISTENCE. I'm seeing no clash on those issues. I'm seeing zero policy-based arguments for keeping above. I'm seeing lots of: "we're so put upon in this this arena of editing..." and "but it is too really important..." I'm not buying it, and neither should the closing admin. BusterD (talk) 11:33, 10 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.