Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Steven Hartley

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 21:40, 18 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Steven Hartley[edit]

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Article about an actor that doesn't meet WP:NACTOR or WP:GNG. Has only played minor roles, If the subject has appeared on 60 principal and leading roles then there should clearly be WP:RS available. The sources are basically a talent website and its IMBd page. Jamiebuba (talk) 13:49, 11 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: People, Actors and filmmakers, and England. Jamiebuba (talk) 13:49, 11 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Delete Nothing found, I'm not sure if he was in well-known productions, but I can't find any critical attention about him. Oaktree b (talk) 14:00, 11 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

~~* Delete~~ Change to neutral: ~~delete in the current state, there is not much to be found on the subject~~ Paradise Chronicle (talk) 02:47, 12 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

An editor claiming to be Steven Hartley and seemingly single purpose account with only edits to the article in question has just opposed its deletion here.Paradise Chronicle (talk) 09:22, 12 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The Times source is good enough for me to believe there could be more. The Times source has a paywall, though so I could add just a bit.Paradise Chronicle (talk) 15:06, 14 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

This Gale OneFile link might work if you are already logged in to Wikipedia Library (or possibly maybe even if you are not). I wish they didn't call it "CV" as it sounds like it's user-submitted but when you see it in layout like that, you think, ok maybe they fact-checked it? And more reputable source than the tabloid (an issue that Patrick also flagged)? Cielquiparle (talk) 15:13, 14 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Delete. Earwig flags as "Violation Suspected" across three sites (80%, 71%, 71%). The page is so old that it could easily be a case of WP:CITOGENESIS and no reliable secondary sources are cited. Time to break the circle. Cielquiparle (talk) 08:39, 12 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Keep I think he passes WP:NACTOR: according to the BFI he had a recurring role in The Bill of 100+ episodes; also played Matthew Jackson in Eastenders. There are various reviews of his stage work in for example the Times and The Stage. Stage roles include playing Bill Sikes in Sam Mendes' Oliver Piecesofuk (talk) 15:52, 12 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Comment: We've had a bunch of these pages up for years and some of them have barely even met the slightest WP:NACTOR guidelines. If WP:RS that thoroughly discusses the subject can be provided alongside reliable references of his roles in movies then i'll be happy to withdraw my nomination if not its still delete for me. Jamiebuba (talk) 18:30, 12 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I believe he's more known for his TV and stage roles:

Also known for voice over work: "Mr TalkSport" https://archive.org/details/storyoftalksport0000port/page/169/mode/1up?q=hartley

The following can be viewed in the Wikipedia Library which you linked above

Bad cop role ideal for Steven From:Evening Times (Glasgow, Scotland) June 13, 2002 315 words Brief article

My hols; Steven Hartley has rocked the boat in New Zealand and stewed in the cells of Marseilles Source: Sunday Times (London, England). April 5, 2009, 30

Celeb CV: Steven Hartley (41): The Bill Source: The Mirror (London, England). Oct 5, 2002, 39

Beat goes on The Bill's new faces By: JACKIE BRYGEL, Mercury, The (Hobart), JAN 19, 2002

Celeb People: My fear of a stalker; Sun Hill heart-throb Steven Hartley was bombarded with 40 letters in six months by an obsessed female fan. The Bill star tells STEVE CLARKE why he nearly called in the Old Bill. Source: The People (London, England). 2002, pages. 11

CV Steven Hartley Source: The Times, London, United Kingdom: Times Newspapers Limited, pp. 55[S3], Issue. 67448, 2002 Piecesofuk (talk) 19:18, 12 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Piecesofuk This list is great – thanks for compiling! I would just note that "My hols" by Steven Hartley in The Sunday Times doesn't count toward notability, since it's an article written in his voice. The video of his character sketch doesn't count either. But it is great to see all of it in a list regardless. Let's see if it's enough to update the article. Cielquiparle (talk) 12:40, 14 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I have one additional concern, which is: Does Steven Hartley even really want a Wikipedia article? It sounds like he has an expectation that he is entitled to "own" the article and that no one else is allowed to edit it. If that's the case, he may not be happy with the end product, when he realises it has to change in order to conform with Wikipedia guidelines. Cielquiparle (talk) 19:19, 12 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I disagree about the Sunday Times article not counting towards notability, the article includes biographical information in the preamble and mentions his appearance on stage in Dirty Dancing https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/my-hols-steven-hartley-ktvskrdqg0w Here's another two page article from February 2009 also about his appearance in Dirty Dancing https://archive.org/details/living-south-magazine-2009-02/page/n5/mode/1up Piecesofuk (talk) 13:53, 14 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Keep. Major role in The Bill and significant roles in other long-running series. Clearly hasn't "appeared on 60 principal and leading roles", but AfD is about notability of the topic not quality of the article. -- Necrothesp (talk) 11:28, 14 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]
@Necrothesp out of curiosity. Can your source that the roles except for with IMDb? I did try and also sourced two appearances and the talkSport. Also I am wondering why the ones who vote keep don't add the sources themselves? Paradise Chronicle (talk) 12:41, 14 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.