Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Laura Coombs (designer)

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. Barkeep49 (talk) 01:15, 6 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Laura Coombs (designer)[edit]

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Citations do not support WP:ARTIST or WP:GNG. Google search does not seem to uncover those sources either. Morbidthoughts (talk) 05:42, 27 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Artists-related deletion discussions. Morbidthoughts (talk) 05:42, 27 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Women-related deletion discussions. Morbidthoughts (talk) 05:42, 27 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Visual arts-related deletion discussions. Morbidthoughts (talk) 05:42, 27 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete. Perhaps a case of just not being there yet. BD2412 T 05:46, 27 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete. Does not meet GNG, NPROF or NARTIST. A search turned up little. Possibly (talk) 05:49, 27 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete Agree with the previous remarks, doesn't pass WP:GNG or WP:PROF. Curiocurio (talk) 17:18, 27 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Comment/Question: given that graphic designers primarily earn recognition through awards like the AIGA and ADC awards that Coombs has won, how does WP:NARTIST account for the work of a designer? It seems to me like it doesn't. How many awards does she have to win? Or will no number of awards matter? I ask these somewhat absurd questions because they highlight the ineffectiveness of NARTIST here. Theredproject (talk) 20:24, 27 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Artist accounts for awards in Criteria 4(c). However, there should be citations to independent reliable sources like newspaper accounts or academic/trade journals confirming the receipt and significance of the award. Morbidthoughts (talk) 01:44, 28 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Theredproject: I think all the criteria can be made to apply, but the bar ends up being higher for designers because the public market is smaller. I'm thinking of examples like the designer of the I Love New York campaign (The person has created or played a major role in co-creating a significant or well-known work), Jony Ive for The person is regarded as an important figure, and of course all the designers in museum collections count for WP:ARTIST part 4d. I think their chance of becoming notable are a lot lower than that of your average artist, given that there aren't as many opportunities to be reviewed. Possibly (talk) 08:13, 2 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Morbidthoughts, What I am trying to work through is the way the combination the way NARTIST is written, and how it is interpreted, has led to a designer like Coombs being read as TOOSOON, but an artist with roughly the equivalent set of accolades would likely be a !Keep or !Weak Keep. The way that "critical attention" as mentioned in 4(c) has been interpreted here is exhibition reviews, as implied by what Possibly has said above. Past discussions have discounted grants as meeting "critical attention" to establish N (though I disagree), and also awards that are not of the highest order.
What I am positing, is that the way a designer receives "critical attention" is fundamentally different from that of an artist. Designers don't receive exhibition reviews, they don't receive book reviews, but they do have a system of awards. AIGA is the primary US design organization, and they give out several kinds of awards. They give out about 5 AIGA Medals annually, which is the kind of award that would be undoubtably recognized as establishing N. And they hold two or three Design Competitions, which give out awards [1]; the primary of these is the 50 Books/50 Covers competition, which it first awarded in 1941. 50 Books/50 Covers has a short section on the [American Institute of Graphic Arts] page, and it is out of date. It is probably incorrect to try to compare 50 Books/50 Covers to an annual exhibition, like the Whitney Biennial, as though they are of about the same size, they do not attract the same kind of media attention. Which in some ways makes clear the incommensurate ways that designers and artists are evaluated here.
Given that designers don't receive exhibition reviews, I reframe my question: do awards constitute "critical attention," and if not, how we are to evaluate the notability of a designer? Theredproject (talk) 10:55, 2 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I consider awards to be evidence of won critical attention. The debate then becomes whether the awards are significant. If independent reliable sources like media don't cover them, that doesn't bode well for the subject's notability. Trying make the criteria level for different types of artists can be seen as insisting on WP:FALSEBALANCE because ultimately notability is about the amount of coverage a person gets. Morbidthoughts (talk) 23:01, 2 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Texas-related deletion discussions. Spiderone 21:14, 27 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Weak delete - It's WP:TOOSOON for this emerging designer to meet GNG, PROF or NARTIST, however in a couple of years I imagine there will be enough coverage of her to support an article. If more sources can be found at this time, I'm willing to change my !vote. Re: @Theredproject:'s comment, good point, perhaps there should be different criteria created for designers. Where would such a discussion take place? Netherzone (talk) 15:20, 29 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.