Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Epilepsy surgery and art

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. Boom! --BDD (talk) 21:54, 26 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Epilepsy surgery and art[edit]

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A rambling WP:OR connecting epilepsy surgery and art. There are lots of references, but none of them seem to discuss this concept in depth. The WP:SPA creator has declined to opportunity to rename the article after Eduardo Urbano Merino whose painting appears to be the focus of the article and who may be notable. Stuartyeates (talk) 04:21, 19 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Hi thank you for the possibility to include the article in Wikipedia. I would like to mention that I am not denying the possibility that the article can be renamed to Eduardo Urbano, although the new version is very focused to the art work. I am open to any comment and potential change. It is renamed, it is Ok with me Thanks — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jftellez (talk • contribs) Moved from talk page.

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Arts-related deletion discussions. Northamerica1000^(talk) 13:47, 19 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, it's a bit hard to follow on the article talk page, but the article creator has stated he has no objection whatsoever to a page move to Eduardo Urbano Merino, so let's please consider this case on that basis. thanks, Shawn in Montreal (talk) 14:00, 19 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Visual arts-related deletion discussions. Shawn in Montreal (talk) 14:08, 19 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

For what it's worth, there is what appears to be a published piece by the creator of this article here, accompanied by what appears to be independent WP:RS: a bylined Spanish-language news story. Shawn in Montreal (talk) 14:42, 19 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for the comments and discussion about the article. The article that you are mentioning is a comprehensive review of 15 pieces of art from ancient times regarding epilepsy surgery and also a review of historical aspects of the topic. The article in Wikipedia does not review this material, obviously we can not copy an article (I can provide to Wikipedia de pdf of the article and you can read the review, is very large and comprehensive). There are other pieces of art that I mention in my review of Wikipedia and are not mentioned in the review from epilepsy and behavior). The article that I wrote is based in the remarkable fact that all the previous art works related with epilepsy surgery were bloody and painful for patients. For the first time Eduardo Urbano makes a friendly painting that can help patients to understand patients the process of healing after epilepsy surgery. The artist has a lot of achievements and I am happy to change the name of the article if the encyclopedia considers the option to put the title of the artist. I really want to spread the message of the painting from Eduardo Urbano to patients with epilepsy and people that can not afford to pay the 35 dollars to see the whole article about epilepsy surgery and art. I think the art for patients have to be universal and the copyrights of the painting belong to Eduardo Urbano and he kindly has shared the picture with me and other epilepsy institutions in Canada. I will continue adding material to the article to be better but I have heard from difrente people that the article gives a very positive message. Thanks and I hope that you can consider my thoughts — Preceding unsigned comment added by 199.189.94.127 (talk) 18:47, 19 August 2013 (UTC) The other option that I can modify is put the title as "Eduardo Urbano merino", then the sections could be "Contemporary art work in epilepsy", then "Information about Eduardo", then "Painting, Epilepsy, leaving behind the nightmare" and finally "Importance of the painting" Thanks — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jftellez (talk • contribs) 21:57, 19 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

If the article is renamed Eduardo Urbano Merino it will then be restructured to comply with Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style and in particular Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style/Biographies. Stuartyeates (talk) 22:12, 20 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

It is not clear either from the article or from my searches on the topic that Merino merits an article either. Moving and restructuring doesn't seem to be a solution in this case. WikiDan61^ChatMe!_ReadMe!! 22:16, 20 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Delete by virtue of WP:Blow it up and start over. There may be an article with this topic to be be had at Wikipedia, but this is not it. The lead paragraph discusses the concept of medical procedures in general as a subject for various pieces of art, but not epilepsy surgery in any example. The section on Merino discusses a single piece of art that he has created, but that piece depicts the ravages of arthritis, not epilepsy surgery. Finally, there is a section that describes one piece titled "Epilepsy, leaving the nightmare behind", with a detailed description of the painting, but neglecting to note who created the work. An online search finds that the painting was also created by Merino, an artist of no particular notability. The article itself points out that "Epilepsy surgery has been depicted in few artistic works", suggesting that this topic probably is not notable enough for an entire Wikipedia article. WikiDan61^ChatMe!_ReadMe!! 22:09, 20 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Part of the problem, I'd say, is that the article creator keeps reverting my efforts to wikify it. There really does seem to be lack of WP:COMPETENCE getting in the way of his well intentioned efforts to improve and retain the article. I have to admit, the whole thing is rather amusing to me since the artcreator appears to literally be a brain surgeon. Shawn in Montreal (talk) 22:24, 20 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for the comments, the true is that there are only two contemporary works in epilepsy surgery, the one from Eduardo Urbano and the one from Juan Bravo. The previous available paintings are from the renaissance, so it is unique. In the background I just try to give an introduction to the reader about art and medicine, then some examples of art in epilepsy (there are some available, not many) and then going to the main topic that is epilepsy surgery. If you suggest me a sequence a can change the article, but goes with some background and then the description. I can do an effort to join the paragraphs to create a sequence Thanks — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jftellez (talk • contribs) 23:56, 20 August 2013 (UTC) Thank you for the comments in the discussion from the editors but I feel that the article has a sequence and it is well documented. Maybe if the title changes and it is called Eduardo Urbano Merino and his art vision in epilepsy or something like that can be more logical. I really respect the comments and I am just trying to improve the article to have a better reading going from something general to the specific point which is the painting, the perspective of the author and the potential benefit for patients. I add a sentence to linked the first paragraph with the rest of the article, specifying that the article is focused on the paintings by this artist. I am not a surgeon I am neurologist with special interest in epilepsy Thanks — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jftellez (talk • contribs) 01:00, 21 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Delete I'm sorry, the article is a lost cause imo. We're a couple of reliable sources shy of a notable artist, by our standards here and what we have here are two WP:SPA and WP:COI editors (including User:Lady Ladino) who aren't sufficiently fluent in English to help matters any. Shawn in Montreal (talk) 10:46, 21 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Delete This is not a topic. It is just a rehash of the article published on Epilepsy and Behavior by the main article editors, and as such it is basically WP:OR supported only by primary sources. Call me back when it becomes a topic in the academic literature. --cyclopia ^speak! 20:53, 24 August 2013 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.