Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Clonbony GAA

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. The only "keep" opinion is "GAA clubs are notable entities and deserve a page on Wikipedia", which is not an argument based in our inclusion rules or practices. Sandstein 07:23, 17 October 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Clonbony GAA[edit]

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This hurling club does not meet ~~WP:SPORTCRIT~~ WP:GNG. Source searches have provided no significant coverage in reliable sources. ~~Sources used in the article appear to be all primary~~. North America¹⁰⁰⁰ 04:37, 22 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Sports-related deletion discussions. North America¹⁰⁰⁰ 04:38, 22 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Organizations-related deletion discussions. North America¹⁰⁰⁰ 04:38, 22 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Ireland-related deletion discussions. North America¹⁰⁰⁰ 04:38, 22 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

- What is your definition of "primary sources", as both sources are independent and not related to the club at all. The Banner talk 09:10, 22 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]
  - The nominator accused me in the past of not doing WP:BEFORE. Seeing what he has nominated, I get the impression that he did not read the sources at all as he is wild of the mark. The Banner talk 23:42, 27 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

I am objecting to the proposed deletion of this article. The Gaelic Athletic Association consists of hundreds of small clubs such as this. Each plays a valid part of the organization. You will Wikipedia articles of many such clubs. It does need more information, but this will be added over time. Pmunited (talk) 12:58, 23 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Comment – @Pmunited: Can you provide any sources to establish the topic's notability as per WP:SPORTCRIT or WP:GNG? Just because a club exists does not make it automatically notable per Wikipedia's standards. North America¹⁰⁰⁰ 20:11, 28 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Comment – Struck part of my nomination above. Thus far, here's a source summary:

[1] – 2 short paragraphs consisting of one sentence each, (addendum: and 2 single name mentions)
[2] – single passing mention
[3] – ~~no mention~~ single passing mention
[4] – one single name mention

Where is the significant coverage? "Wild off the mark"? Hardly. Several searches have provided no significant coverage. For example, GNews provides no coverage, and not even any page results ("No results found for "Clonbony GAA"), and Gbooks provides no coverage. North America¹⁰⁰⁰ 23:57, 27 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

LOL, first you have to chance your nomination because you failed to read the sources and now you start nitpicking. But again you fail to read the sources properly, as source three, where you find no mention, clearly states "Clonbony". To my opinion, this is a WP:POINT-nomination. The Banner talk 19:35, 28 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

All sources were read prior to nomination, and I also read the sources that were later added. Stop casting WP:ASPERSIONS, and focus on content. Below is the text of this source I stated that has no mention, because there is indeed, no mention at all.

LADIES FOOTBALL COUNTY FINAL DAY IN COORACLARE
It's County final day in Cooraclare where the Senior and Junior A Shield finals are down for decision. First up at 3:30 is the Junior A Shield final.
West Clare neighbours Kilrush and West Clare Gaels B go head to head there.
That's followed by the Senior final clash of The Banner Ladies and Liscannor.
The Banner go into the game as favorites and are targeting a three in a row with victory today, but their North West Clare opponents know a win is not out of touch having beaten today’s finalists in the group stages of the championship.
Throw in for that game is at 5:45.
Meanwhile, as the Ladies Gaelic football association celebrates it's 40th Anniversary this year, todays final marks the 30th anniversary of the Clare Ladies Football senior championship.
LGFA President Pat Quill is in Cooraclare today as members of the winning 1983 -85 Clonboney teams are honored by the Clare Ladies Football Board in a presentation between today’s two finals.
Last night, the Mary Kenny Cup was won by Fergus Rovers in the Intermediate B championship final.
They beat Crusheen on a 1-09 to 1-05 scoreline.

You state that the source "clearly states "Clonbony"", but you are in error here. Where is it? Perhaps you confused this with another source? If you're going to cast aspersions, LOL and attempt to correct and scold people, stating that a user "fail to read the sources properly", at least get it right. Your criticism regarding reading sources only confers to yourself in this instance. Your ad hominem arguments have thus far provided nothing to counter the topic's lack of notability. From the sources presented and several searches, the topic has received no significant coverage at all. Also, the Hoganstand source came across as a bit primary in nature, but I struck this in my nomination in attempts to assume good faith. Perhaps you should also consider assuming good faith toward other users. North America¹⁰⁰⁰ 19:46, 28 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

It is sad that you know how to throw accusations, but still fail to read properly.

You claim that source 4 ("Ladies Football County Final Day In Cooraclare") has no mention at all. Unfortunately, that is not the case. The article starts with Clonbony GAA (also spelled as Clonboney GAA) (...). The source reads: LGFA President Pat Quill is in Cooraclare today as members of the winning 1983 -85 Clonboney teams are honored by the Clare Ladies Football Board in a presentation between today’s two finals. (highlighted by me.
As argument for removal you use [[WP:SPORTCRIT]. When you read that, you see that SPORTCRIT is about players, not clubs.
When you persist in using rules and regulation about players to judge a club, at least use WP:NGAELIC, what is about Gaelic Sport players, including hurlers (and camogie players, the female variant)
When using WP:NGAELIC against a club, please note that the Clonbony GAA Ladies were county champions in the period 1983-1985. The means qualifying for the national All-Ireland competition.

Thank you for your attention. The Banner talk 22:47, 30 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Sandstein 11:07, 30 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Changed part of the nomination to "does not meet WP:GNG" made a change to the source analysis above. WP:NGAELIC refers to players only, not clubs. The spelling of "Clonboney GAA" was added after my nomination for deletion (diff). I do admit that I did not see this minor addition to the article after the nomination. However, ad hom statements of not being able to read properly are unnecessary and hostile in nature, and provide nothing to qualify notability for the club, which is the basis of this nomination. No evidence of the club having received significant coverage has been presented, nor does any appear to exist, based upon source searches. This topic does not meet WP:GNG. As such, the article qualifies for deletion. North America¹⁰⁰⁰ 23:27, 30 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

And again you change your nomination rationale... Please, stop playing games (unless you start playing hurling). The Banner talk 10:27, 1 October 2016 (UTC)[reply]

No game playing, just being accurate. I could have changed it to the simpler Wikipedia:Notability (sports), which states, "This guideline is used to help evaluate whether or not a sports person or sports league/organization (amateur or professional) is likely to meet the general notability guideline, and thus merit an article in Wikipedia.", but eh. Anyway, so where's any significant coverage? None appears to exist at all. North America¹⁰⁰⁰ 10:37, 1 October 2016 (UTC)[reply]

In a newspaper that is not yet scanned by Google (non-United States, surprisingly). But I guess that you dismiss those sources to suit your wishes. You have by now repeatedly changed your arguments when I proved them wrong. What guarantee do I have that you do that again when I have put in an extra effort and provide those sources? There are already reliable, independent sources available in the article, so what do you want more? (And no, I do not play hurling or are in anyway related to the club. I even have never seen them play.) The Banner talk 13:47, 1 October 2016 (UTC)[reply]

I have added some honours to the article, all based on articles published in the newspaper "Clare Champion". This newspaper is, as far as I know, not (yet) digitized but the paper version can be checked at the Clare County Library, Local History Centre, in Ennis. The Banner talk 21:27, 11 October 2016 (UTC)[reply]

@The Banner: Please do not attack other editors. Comment on content, not on contributors. Personal attacks damage the community and deter users. Please stay cool and keep this in mind while editing. KATMAKROFAN (talk) 15:11, 1 October 2016 (UTC)[reply]

And where is your content-related edit? The Banner talk 16:42, 1 October 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Neutral. KATMAKROFAN (talk) 17:51, 1 October 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Keep. GAA clubs are notable entities and deserve a page on Wikipedia. This AFD would have catastrophic consequences for GAA related article if this deleted a terrible precedent would have been set. Finnegas (talk) 20:22, 5 October 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Comment – I appreciate that you personally consider all GAA clubs to be notable, but this notion is not present in any Wikipedia guidelines. Could you provide any evidence that this club is notable per Wikipedia's notability guidelines, such as WP:GNG and WP:NSPORTS? North America¹⁰⁰⁰ 20:37, 5 October 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Delete It's a non-notable club in the GAA. Emir of Wikipedia (talk) 12:04, 14 October 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Delete - The organization doesn't appear notable. I'm fine with having whatever details are necessary about GAA clubs provided that they get substantive reliable source coverage. Here, we just have slight mentions and what appears to be run-of-the-mill reporting. It all doesn't really pass our encyclopedic guidelines. CoffeeWithMarkets (talk) 08:19, 16 October 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Weak Delete From the Clare GAA Clubs template, Clonbony seems to be a part of the "Junior Hurling Championship" - is that a league? Most articles in the various GAA hurling templates under "Junior Hurling Championship" do not have articles. With some clarity, I could see changing my !vote, but for now I don't see anything that clearly establishes notability for this club. Smmurphy^(Talk) 01:42, 17 October 2016 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.