Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Ariko Inaoka

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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. TonyBallioni (talk) 21:42, 25 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Ariko Inaoka[edit]

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Ariko Inaoka (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log · Stats)
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NN photographer, fails the GNG and WP:CREATIVE. A search for sources turned up several interviews of the subject (which explicitly cannot count to bolster a subject's notability), but is wholly lacking in substantive coverage in reliable, third-party sources. Ravenswing 00:12, 18 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Artists-related deletion discussions. Ravenswing 00:12, 18 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Photography-related deletion discussions. Ravenswing 00:12, 18 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Japan-related deletion discussions. Ravenswing 00:12, 18 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment I am seeing lots of sources when I search with the Japanese version of her name. However my Japanese is limited to saying hello and thank you, so we need a Japanese reader here.ThatMontrealIP (talk) 00:41, 18 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Reply: Indeed, there are a number of sources. I went through a couple dozen without finding a single one conferring significant, independent coverage from a reliable source. Ravenswing 01:02, 18 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment: Currently unmentioned in the (very feeble) article is that she's a restaurateur. The recent disappearance of her website may suggest that she has given up photography for full-time restaurant-running and home-making, but she's exhibiting and has a new book out. -- Hoary (talk) 12:32, 18 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • The disappearance of her website continued to puzzle me. As she no longer calls herself "Ariko" but instead 稲岡亜里子 (Inaoka Ariko), I wondered if she might possibly have moved to inaokaariko.jp or arikoinaoka.com or whatever. And yes, an up-to-date website appears at the latter. (I've edited the page accordingly.) -- Hoary (talk) 22:27, 20 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep - I am seeing enough online to establish notability as a photographer and as the owner of the oldest (and notable) soba restaurant in Kyoto, Honke Owarya, founded in 1465. It's a little confusing because there are so many variations in the restaurant name (and spelling), but she is the 16th owner, following in the footsteps of her father and grandfather who were the 15th and 14th owners, respectively. I also found a couple articles in the Guardian & Metal Magazine on her photography, and there are others out there. I've added these to her article, and hope to add other sources, as they exist. Netherzone (talk) 14:24, 18 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • "Owarya" is I think just a typo for "Owariya". 本家尾張屋 Honke Owariya) is a compound of 本家 (honke) and 尾張屋 (Owariya). 尾張屋 is 尾張 (Owari) suffixed with 屋 (ya), often used as the last part of the name of a store or restaurant. "Owarya" is phonologically possible in Japanese but I've never encountered such a change made by ‑ya or indeed any other suffix. On the second or third hand, I'm completely unfamiliar with the dialects of Kansai, so I wouldn't be so surprised if told I was wrong. -- Hoary (talk) 03:40, 19 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment on the claim in the nomination that interviews of the subject "explicitly cannot count to bolster a subject's notability": the string "interview" appears nowhere within Wikipedia:Notability; and its only appearance within Wikipedia:Notability (people) is as the title of a link to an essay. So if interviews cannot count, then this has to be inferred; it's not explicit. Interviews should, of course, be treated with care (and indeed suspicion); they're not reliable sources for achievements. We don't cite an interview with somebody to "source" a claim that she received an appreciative letter from Cartier-Bresson or won the Prix Pictet. However, nobody has suggested anything like this here. Mere number or length of interviews or profiles can also be meaningless (for example in India, where even long-established and augustly titled newspapers seem to put out whatever promotional flatus they're paid to); but the interviews of Inaoka suggest to me editorial judgements that her work merits exploration. -- Hoary (talk) 01:45, 19 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • That would be WP:IS. An interview is by definition not independent; it's the very words of the subject. Ravenswing 02:57, 19 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Yes, it is, and I agree with WP:IS (a page I hadn't previously encountered, and that only makes a single, fleeting reference to interviews) that "Reliance on independent sources ensures that an article can be written from a balanced, disinterested viewpoint rather than from the subject's own viewpoint or from the viewpoint of people with an axe to grind." We shouldn't take an interviewee's word for her own achievements, such as having surmounted this or that difficulty. I haven't suggested otherwise. -- Hoary (talk) 03:40, 19 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep, notable as a photographer. No, I haven't yet found any detailed analysis, and a lot is more or less based on interviews; but even if one removes the mere blog entries and recyclings the bulk is telling. Putting aside material in Japanese and what has already been mentioned, there are this, this, this, this, this, this, this. (Incidentally, this NYT page temporarily isn't responding, but according to Google it says that Inaoka is also in the T&H book Family Photography Now.) -- Hoary (talk) 02:29, 20 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
@Hoary: no opinion on this, but I did get access to the NYT article you linked. The article is a book review containing one of her photos with the caption "Ariko Inaoka has taken photos of Erna and Krefna, identical twins from Iceland, every year since 2009."ThatMontrealIP (talk) 04:02, 20 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep searching for her Icelandic twins project produced several good sources. The Guardian article from 2014 is the best as it reprints 13 of her photographs (visual SIGCOV), but there is also the Iceland Monitor article Hoary found, this Slate article, this short Iceland Magazine article in addition to the ones in the article and those mentioned above. I think clearly WP:BASIC is met, as well as GNG. She has an international profile as a photographer proven out by international in-depth coverage.ThatMontrealIP (talk) 04:10, 20 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Let's add meets WP:ARTIST to that list, since the twins project is widely covered and reviewed: "The person has created or played a major role in co-creating a significant or well-known work... In addition, such work must have been the primary subject of... multiple independent periodical articles or reviews."ThatMontrealIP (talk) 04:18, 20 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, to take stock:
And more. Not bad going for an allegedly non-notable person. Hoary (talk) 06:43, 22 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Actually a lot of pages reproduce half a dozen or more of her photographs. In my list of links above, I omitted those that did little or nothing more than reproduce the photographs, partly because they wouldn't be usable as source material, partly because I had no particular reason to think that the publication was authorized. (This is no criticism of the Guardian, which may make an occasional error but which I'm sure is conscientious.) And a lot of web pages do no more than regurgitate other web pages. ¶ Legitimate and particularly interesting (though unusable): a BBC page about twins (not about Inaoka's work but illustrated with this), and available in either English or Hausa. -- Hoary (talk) 05:27, 20 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
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