User talk:Varnent/Archive 3

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 Done --Varnent (talk)(COI)

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 Done --Varnent (talk)(COI) 02:13, 10 February 2013 (UTC)

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Please comment on Talk:Lindsay Lohan

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Political advocacy and Wikimedia

Hi.

I've been meaning to properly reply to this thread for months. Perfect is the enemy of the done, of course.

Groups (and group groups) are certainly not new to Wikimedia, but they're gaining a more prominent and formalized role, it seems. The Wikimedia Foundation's Board of Trustees seems to be encouraging this through its movement roles work. Other parties are similarly encouraging the development of these groups, each in their own way. Not that a "taking sides" mentality is really a good thing, but we can look at this from different angles and different perspectives and see how there's some wariness and distrust on every side.

Wikimedia is already a fairly radical concept. The idea behind the Wikimedia movement is to bring free (as in speech and as in beer) educational content (knowledge) to the world. Because of its radical nature and many, many other factors, this is not an easy vision to achieve. It's a global community project that requires crowdsourcing and technical innovation and a lot of good faith and donated volunteer time.

From the side of the people who are very involved in Wikimedia, there's a very big, lurking wariness of politics and political advocacy. I believe politics and political advocacy are one of the few issues that could easily destroy (tear apart) Wikimedia. This is, of course, why the SOPA protests were such a big deal, in my mind. Wikimedia has a commitment to neutrality; Wikimedia has a commitment to free and open content. And these are difficult battles to wage in many (maybe most) parts of the world, but they become even more difficult—if not possible—under the grey cloud of politics and political advocacy.

On the other side, there's the idea that small dedicated groups of people (e.g., "Wikimedia LGBT") can make a huge positive impact (cf. q:Margaret Mead) on Wikimedia in a variety of ways. This can include content creation and curation, editor support and engagement, etc. But can this include (or perhaps more to the point, will it eventually include) politics and political advocacy? I think there's a huge danger that it eventually would, even if the intentions of the group's founders are pure.

In our conversations last June, the idea of whether LGBT issues are still controversial was brought up. To me, this seems unambiguously to be the case. LGBT issues, even in open and democratic countries like the United States, are still hugely controversial. This is to say nothing of how controversial these issues are in countries where Wikimedia is already trying to spread its own radical ideas about free and open content. There's a large concern about a mixed message and about controversial politics and political advocacy creeping into Wikimedia's work. I think there has to be some acknowledgement of this reality on all sides.

This isn't meant as an attack on you or your work, here or elsewhere. But I think these issues need a lot of further thought and discussion and debate. While it may be unfair, I consider a "Wikimedia LGBT" group as potentially controversial or political as a "Wikimedia Abortion" group, regardless of my personal opinions and whether they align with yours. The hesitancy and fear on my end of the table is that we'll slowly see an injection of politics and political advocacy into Wikimedia ultimately harms or destroys Wikimedia.

If you're interested, I'd like to work with you on these issues. I think there's room for improvement in this area, in terms of defining what is and is not acceptable for Wikimedia, for groups of Wikimedians, etc. Perhaps an expansion of m:best practices. Perhaps an expansion of m:movement roles-related documentation. Perhaps something else entirely.

Let me know if you have any thoughts about, or interest in pursuing, this. --MZMcBride (talk) 05:59, 20 February 2013 (UTC)

As usual, your comments are well thought out and in this case also speak to a topic I have also been pondering. I agree that Wikimedia LGBT will be seen by some (maybe many) as controversial just by existing. The same seems to be true for the wiki women efforts and oddly enough some MediaWiki groups (apparently open source is a radical idea in some parts of the world). I also agree that the notion of political advocacy presents a series threat to the future of Wikimedia.
The short answer is yes, I would be interested both as a Wikimedia groups supporter and member of AffCom in expanding any existing content to reflect these concerns. A key reason that I helped created WikiQueer was in part to avoid the problem of Wikimedia projects being used for LGBT political advocacy purposes. I think the harder question is what exactly does that include. Using articles to advocate political campaigns/efforts is a more obvious judgement. Someone tried to add talking points supporting marriage equality to some articles - thats a no-no in my mind. Although it would be welcomed at WikiQueer. However, some things about HIV/AIDS are still being disputed and when they are stated one way or another in a Wikimedia project article, some argue that is politically taking sides. To me that can be resolved by documenting both sides of the argument, but ultimately some things stated as fact, like that AIDS develops from HIV, are hard to avoid taking some side on if you're trying to educate on a topic (some believe HIV leads to AIDS is wording that may discredit that whole article in some people's minds - and maybe that's just the price we pay - not sure yet). The medical thematic group is already running into this problem. How to add content the science community sees as fact, but some still want to debate. Climate change related articles are another example.
Ultimately I do not believe that political advocacy actions, beyond things related to the core Wikimedia mission like SOPA, are not appropriate for Wikimedia projects or groups. Do I think Wikimedia LGBT should advocate for transgender education that supports what a vast majority of experts agree on, yes. Do I think Wikimedia LGBT should advocate for people and topics in things like an ArbCom case, yes. Should Wikimedia LGBT advocate for equal treatment of LGBT Wikimedia employees, yes. Do I think Wikimedia LGBT should promote passage of marriage equality bills on Wikimedia projects, absolutely not. I could potentially see Wikimedia LGBT trying to engage lgbt orgs on a topic Wikimedia as a community has already decided to address and falls under the mission of the movement - that's about as externally political as I would like to see it become, but I obviously don't speak for the group. I recognize some will see that as a fine line hard and may not see differences, but I think it's an internal vs external advocacy debate.
Wherever folks fall on the spectrum of this discussion, I think it is one both worth having and important to the future of the newly recognized groups. It's something I plan to discuss a bit during some upcoming AffCom meetings. --Varnent (talk)(COI) 15:25, 20 February 2013 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Mama's Family

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The Tea Leaf - Issue Seven (special Birthday recap)

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Metric Control group Teahouse group Contrast
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Start Snuggle

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A barnstar for you!

The Special Barnstar
Special Barnstar for being a Queer Youth Advocate. Cheers, Sou Boyy (talk) 13:35, 22 August 2013 (UTC)
Thanks!  :) --Varnent (talk)(COI) 04:31, 28 August 2013 (UTC)

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Image request: File:Wikimedia_Regional_Chapters_of_the_USA.svg in Spanish

Hi! Are you interested in making a Spanish version of File:Wikimedia_Regional_Chapters_of_the_USA.svg?

This is what needs to be changed:

  • Proposed Wikimedia Regional Chapters of the United States -> Secciones regionales propuestas de los Estados Unidos de Wikimedia
  • New England -> Nueva Inglaterra
  • Midwest -> Medio Oeste
  • Potomac is the same
  • Mid-Atlantic -> Atlántico Medio
  • Great Plains -> Grandes Llanuras
  • Rocky Mountains -> Montañas Rocosas
  • Sierra Region -> Región Sierra
  • Pacific Region -> Región del Pacífico
  • Southeast Atlantic -> Atlántico Sudoriental
  • Western Gulf -> Golfo Occidental

Thank you WhisperToMe (talk) 03:08, 27 August 2013 (UTC)

Sure - added to my tasks list.  :) --Varnent (talk)(COI) 04:27, 28 August 2013 (UTC)
Thank you :) WhisperToMe (talk) 04:53, 28 August 2013 (UTC)
 Done File:Secciones regionales propuestas de los Estados Unidos de Wikimedia.svg --Varnent (talk)(COI) 23:59, 8 September 2013 (UTC)
Thank you so much! WhisperToMe (talk) 01:28, 9 September 2013 (UTC)

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Category:LGBT scientists by nationality

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Categorizing LGBT scientists by nationality

I'm a fairly new Wikipedia contributor, and I'm wondering if you might be able to help out with a more technical question. You've recently created the "LGBT scientists by nationality" categories and re-categorized everyone that way. Is there still a way to have all the queer scientists also show up on a single master list (whether or not that list is sorted/subheaded by nationality)? I was trying to browse for someone whose name I couldn't quite remember (but would recognize), and I didn't know his nationality, so I ended up clicking through a number of sublists. I also rather miss the visual and emotional impact of having my entire "tribe" show up on one page, which prompted me to explore people I'd never heard of before.


Altion33 (talk) 12:07, 10 October 2013 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Murray Rothbard

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Battle Creek Enquirer

I have deleted Battle Creek Enquirer because it was a very close paraphrase of the source MadmanBot pointed out. That's a copyright violation even if you change a word here and there. Huon (talk) 21:43, 6 November 2013 (UTC)

Wikimania 2014 Outreach

Hello!

I have been doing and facilitating a lot of work on the outreach strategy for Wikimania 2014, and I'm looking for some advice and guidance on what we've done so far. I think it's getting to the point where I can start asking the wider community to contribute. A good entrypoint to the work is here: https://wikimania2014.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Themes

If you could take a bit of time to click around and take a look and maybe give some comments, that would be really helpful!

Thanks, EdSaperia (talk) 18:26, 17 October 2013 (UTC)

Hey there! Absolutely - I will check it out and weigh in when I have a few minutes. Please let me know if there is anything else I can do to help with program or Hackathon. --Varnent (talk)(COI) 00:20, 18 October 2013 (UTC)
Hi Varnent, you might like to look at how https://wikimania2014.wikimedia.org/ is going. NB I am presenting the hackathon as running from 6-10th August 2014, with the main programme joining rather than replacing from the 8th, and this will be reflected in the event's design. I am very keen to try and consolidate a local technical community in London, and I will be doing a lot of developer outreach in the coming months including running five hackathons in the months leading up to the conference, one on each of the main conference themes. Interested to know your thoughts. EdSaperia (talk) 15:37, 31 October 2013 (UTC)
Bump! EdSaperia (talk) 14:53, 7 November 2013 (UTC)

Huggle 3

Hey Varnent! I am Petrb, one of core developers of Huggle, the antivandalism tool, which you are beta testing (according to https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Huggle/Members#Beta_testers). I am happy to announce that Huggle 3 is ready for some testing. You can read more about it at WP:Huggle/Huggle3_Beta. Please keep in mind that this is a development version and it is not ready for regular use. That means you must:

  • Watch your contribs - when anything happens you didn't want, fix it and report a bug
  • Frequently checkout source code and build latest version, we change it a lot

If you find any problem with a feature that is supposed to work perfectly, please let us know. Some features are not ready yet, it is listed in known problems on Huggle3 beta page, you don't need to report these - we know it! So, that's it. Have fun testing and please let us know about any problems, either using bugzilla @ http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/ or #huggle connect. Please respond to my talk page, I am not going to watch your talk page. Thank you Petrb (talk) 10:57, 14 November 2013 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Alejandro García Padilla

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Huggle 3 beta is out - and we need more feedback!

Hey Varnent, how are you? I am Petrb, one of huggle developers, and you are currently subscribed as a beta tester of huggle on meta (meta:Huggle/Members. You may not have noticed, but this week I released first beta precompiled installers for ubuntu and microsoft windows! Wikipedia:Huggle/Huggle3_Beta has all the links you need. So if you can, please download it, test it and report all bugs that is really what we need now. Don't forgot that as it's just a beta it's unstable and there are some known issues. Be carefull! Thank you for helping us with huggle Petrb (talk) 16:27, 29 November 2013 (UTC)

Your request for rollback

Hi Varnent/Archive 3. After reviewing your request for rollback, I have enabled rollback on your account. Keep in mind these things when going to use rollback:

  • Getting rollback is no more momentous than installing Twinkle.
  • Rollback should be used to revert clear cases of vandalism only, and not good faith edits.
  • Rollback should never be used to edit war.
  • If abused, rollback rights can be revoked.
  • Use common sense.

If you no longer want rollback, contact me and I'll remove it. Also, for some more information on how to use rollback, see Wikipedia:New admin school/Rollback (even though you're not an admin). I'm sure you'll do great with rollback, but feel free to leave me a message on my talk page if you run into troubles or have any questions about appropriate/inappropriate use of rollback. Thank you for helping to reduce vandalism. Happy editing! – Juliancolton | Talk 15:04, 30 November 2013 (UTC)

Thank you! --Varnent (talk)(COI) 15:18, 30 November 2013 (UTC)

Reviewer

Hello. Your account has been granted the "reviewer" userright, allowing you to review other users' edits on pages protected by pending changes. The list of articles awaiting review is located at Special:PendingChanges, while the list of articles that have pending changes protection turned on is located at Special:StablePages.

Being granted reviewer rights neither grants you status nor changes how you can edit articles. If you do not want this user right, you may ask any administrator to remove it for you at any time.

See also:

—Tom Morris (talk) 17:17, 30 November 2013 (UTC)

Thank you Tom. :) --Varnent (talk)(COI) 17:19, 30 November 2013 (UTC)

dude

that was really rude how you removed my blessing of good luck on RK.... in fact it's offensive to my tradition of sending goats around Christmas time for good luck .... wow.... — Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.76.44.30 (talk) 17:30, 30 November 2013 (UTC)

Sorry - it was vandalism by Wikipedia's standards. You are welcome to seek amendments to community policies. --Varnent (talk)(COI) 17:33, 30 November 2013 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Riga supermarket roof collapse

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Reflinks ending up in Dutch?

Hi Varnent, thanks for filling out bare URLs with Reflinks. I just noticed that in this edit, part of it came out in Dutch: "Google Books" became "Google Boeken". Has that ever happened before? Very strange. Anyway, I'm going to put those edits into CMS style to match the rest of the article, so I'll fix that, but I just wanted to draw your attention to this phenomenon in case it can be remedied for future Reflinks edits. Cheers, Softlavender (talk) 05:21, 5 December 2013 (UTC)

Strange - thank you for catching that! I have not noticed that particular problem happening before - but will keep an eye open for it in the future. --Varnent (talk)(COI) 05:24, 5 December 2013 (UTC)

December 2013

Hello, I'm BracketBot. I have automatically detected that your edit to Peter Thiel may have broken the syntax by modifying 2 "[]"s. If you have, don't worry: just edit the page again to fix it. If I misunderstood what happened, or if you have any questions, you can leave a message on my operator's talk page.

List of unpaired brackets remaining on the page:
  • 7, 2009, Thiel was awarded an honorary degree from [[Universidad Francisco Marroquin]]<ref>[https://www.ufm.edu/cms/es/honorary-doctoral-degrees Honorary Doctoral Degrees at [[Universidad Francisco Marroquín]{{dead link|date=December 2013}}</ref> In 2012, [[Students For

Thanks, BracketBot (talk) 17:42, 5 December 2013 (UTC)

 Fixed --Varnent (talk)(COI) 17:48, 5 December 2013 (UTC)

Changing reference implementation

Just a heads up: it's best not to change wikitext, including reference style, if it will result in no visible improvement to an article. In my experience changing to a cite template makes sense for fixing deadlinks, such as adding an archiveurl and archivedate. But otherwise it's best to leave a note on Talk to seek consensus, per WP:CITEVAR. Some citation formats are completely precious and finicky, and quite stupid for general use, like Bluebook, and should be shorn from the wiki with fire, as I believed should have been done at Photography is Not a Crime. If nobody replies after 5 days (quite typical - usually nobody cares), then be WP:BOLD. Sometimes, though, someone will put up an amazing fight, which is annoying. Anyway, 'discuss first' is the safest approach. --Lexein (talk) 01:00, 6 December 2013 (UTC)

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Please comment on Talk:Asma al-Assad

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Dennis Shepard

Hi Varnent, I was inclined to delete Dennis Shepard by redirection (I'd redirect him to Matt's article). His claim to notability seems to be WP:INHERITED. Only the Casper Star-Tribune article seems to really be about him, as well as his wife (whose claims to notability are, IMO, more solid). Matthew Shepard already mentions Dennis's work in Saudi Arabia and the Matthew Shepard Foundation. What do you think? --BDD (talk) 23:16, 7 January 2014 (UTC)

It is a highly trafficked page (I say that more to point to possible interest in the individual and not solely justify its existence) - and I would rather work to expand it than delete it. Plus I think given the work on the Foundation that he is done - it is a little grim to only connect him to his son and his death vs. some of the work that has come out of it. I agree it needs expansion and is not sufficient as is, but my personal recommendation would be to put emphasis on that instead. That said, I certainly wouldn't be opposed to opening this discussion up for more feedback and would of course support whatever consensus produces.  :) --Varnent (talk)(COI) 04:40, 8 January 2014 (UTC)
A quick afterthought - his speech during the trial and some of his lobbying efforts with Judy are probably what a lot of people outside of his industry know him for. Perhaps we could expand on that and include some excerpts? I know that doesn't build the argument that there is more to the story outside of Matthew's death. If there is a redirect, maybe to the foundation or his wife so it seems less, I don't know, "your existence is only your murdered son" - but maybe that's just me - I will admit it's not an encyclopedic consideration per se.  :) --Varnent (talk)(COI) 04:45, 8 January 2014 (UTC)
I understand, and certainly expansion would be a good outcome. Keep up the good work! --BDD (talk) 17:50, 8 January 2014 (UTC)
Thank you! You as well! I appreciate you bringing this up on a talk page first.  :) --Varnent (talk)(COI) 18:38, 8 January 2014 (UTC)

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 Done --Varnent (talk)(COI) 18:46, 8 January 2014 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Psychedelic rock

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Nice work

Thank you for creating Garden State Equality. Great article! Safehaven86 (talk) 18:19, 20 January 2014 (UTC)

Thank you! :) --Varnent (talk)(COI) 21:46, 20 January 2014 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

Tireless Contributor Barnstar
I have been meaning to give you this barnstar for a while, for your tireless effort improving LGBT-related articles. I just wanted you to know that your work is very much appreciated. - MrX 23:12, 20 January 2014 (UTC)
Thank you! I greatly appreciate your kind words and barnstar! :) --Varnent (talk)(COI) 02:46, 21 January 2014 (UTC)
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