Talk:Sudden death (sport)

Sudden death in tennis

I don't have a reference for this, so I won't make the edit myself, but I am 100% certain that the term sudden death in tennis specifically refers to the outdated 9-point tiebreaker rather than to the 9-point tiebreaker. In a 9-point tiebreaker, the winner of the set is the first player to win 5 points, not necessarily leading by two. The term sudden death specifically refers to the brevity of the tiebreaker and the fact that a match at the US Open could theoretically be decided by a single point after full sets of play. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.36.79.152 (talk) 18:49, 21 October 2007 (UTC)

Sudden death in fiction

Don't know if these are worth including as matters of humour...

In an episode of "Fantasy Island", the two best-known game show hosts (one played by Gene Rayburn, a real game-show host) "duke it out" in the "ultimate" game show, hosted by Mr. Roarke. Having finished out with one win each and working together to survive the third contest, Mr. Roarke asks if they'd like to take part in one final tie-breaker, "I believe you call it, a 'sudden-death'?" The men decline, knowing the "realism" of Fantasy Island.

In an episode of "The Facts of Life", to fill time on the university radio station after the turntables are broken, Jo's friends, Natalie, Blair and Tootie participate in talk programming. Blair reads the sports results from prepared text, including a line, "(x) lost to (x) in sudden death...". "How awful!" she exclaims, noting that it seems the team players all died.

GBC 02:41, 20 September 2005 (UTC)

Why talk page redirects?

Talk page for sudden death (medical) article redirects to sudden death (sport). Why?--C6H12O6 16:18, 25 November 2006 (UTC)

That's a good question. I also wonder why sudden death (medical) seems to only discuss sudden cardiac death while completely and totally ignoring non-cardiac forms of sudden death. Clinicians may use the term "sudden death" to refer to cardiac sudden death only, but we laity don't. Chances are that if we're looking for "sudden death" we're likely interested in all forms, including anaphylaxis, ruptured berry aneurysm, ruptured AAA, stroke, etc., etc. --Charlene 22:24, 25 December 2006 (UTC)

To follow up, I've suggested deleting the redirect under WP:RFD for December 25. --Charlene 22:35, 25 December 2006 (UTC)

Long American football games

I've tightened up the section on American football, but I've moved the information on notably long games to Overtime (sports). PS: Someone with context should also harmonize the plural in Overtime (sports) versus Sudden death (sport). --Spike-from-NH (talk) 18:40, 29 January 2009 (UTC) (superseding previous comments)

Alleged speculation

I'll delete the former Section 16, "Future," which User:Jnestorius marked with {{Speculation}}. He has added text to the intro with both important points that Section 16 made:

• The basis for criticizing the sudden-death format
• Considerations of television

I'll modify slightly his new text in the intro to

• Mention team-travel considerations, formerly in Section 16, and
• Rephrase "unsatisfactory travesty"

--Spike-from-NH (talk) 05:30, 30 January 2009 (UTC)

Spelling of 'idiosyncrasy'

The American Heritage Dictionary confirms, from Greek 'krasis' (mixture), versus democracy, from Greek 'kratia'/'kratos' (strength, power). I'll be dipped! --Spike-from-NH (talk) 18:12, 30 January 2009 (UTC)

Sudden death in baseball

(moved from User talk:Jnestorius) I agree that softball and baseball are interrelated with respect to this article, and that the list of walk-off home runs is better covered on its own page. But I think you've taken out too much that I added in my recent rewrite that explains the significance. Spike-from-NH (talk) 04:51, 31 January 2009 (UTC)

I don't currently agree, though I'm open to being convinced. I don't know much about baseball, so maybe you're right; but I didn't find the previous version of the text was very relevant. To what extent do baseball fans refer as "sudden death" to the scenario you've described by that name? If this is a common name for the scenario, then it can be discussed here, but the section as it was seemed to me to be arguing the case for an analogy that is not widely recognized; that would fall under original research. For argument's sake, consider a similar analogy: when a tennis player has match point, the game will end if that player wins the next point. And yet, this is not called "sudden death". My thinking is that the baseball scenario is similar to the tennis scenario. In sports where "sudden death" does happen, it's something that happens rarely. "Match point" happens in every tennis match; bottom-of-the-ninth happens in more than half of all baseball matches. Of course, in baseball, the home team often finds itself behind in the ninth without ever pulling level or getting to a point where a batter has a chance to win the game; therefore, not all bottom-of-the-ninths result in the scenario which you are describing as "sudden death". Nevertheless, I am reluctant to include it, because it's something that can happen in a regulation game without extra innings, and because it doesn't seem to have a name. Maybe it is not called "sudden death" but rather called by some other name? Assuming it's not just original research, I think a better option would be to expand or refactor the walk-off home run article with your previous material, so it includes not just the home runs, but also "walk-off hits" etc, and the "potential walk offs", or whatever they're called, that end in failure with the visiting team holding out for a win or the match going into another inning. jnestorius^(talk) 18:07, 1 February 2009 (UTC)

I know of no baseball fan who refers to "sudden death" (well, I've done so, in explaining the game to newcomers). I did not intend to advocate the term, least of all use Wikipedia to lobby for new terminology. My phrasing "the game ends...in sudden death" gives that impression, but all I was trying to do is simplify indirect wording from the start of the section in the previous draft. I am not interested in the list of things that can be walk-offs and balk-offs, merely in explaining the reasons behind, and effects of, baseball's sudden-death-like situation.

I'll revert to my draft, without re-adding the list of historic walk-off home runs, and apply your change incorporating softball, and try to correct the above problems, and we'll see if you think it works. --Spike-from-NH (talk) 04:32, 2 February 2009 (UTC)

I disagree with your edit. It is original research to call this situation "sudden-death like". jnestorius^(talk) 18:43, 7 February 2009 (UTC)

In two places, I describe the baseball situation as "comparable to sudden death." I have deleted the second of these. You agree that the situation is "comparable" as you endorse having a reference to baseball in this article. Our disagreement is not over the comparability; again, I wanted the section to more fully explain the rules that lead to the situation and the effect of the existence of the situation. --Spike-from-NH (talk) 01:21, 8 February 2009 (UTC)

Since the link to "sudden death" is so tenuous, the explanation does not belong in this article. Put it in one of the baseball articles, and link to that from here. jnestorius^(talk) 02:19, 8 February 2009 (UTC)

Death

Perhaps it would be prudent to mention, for the benefit of non-native English speakers, that sudden death generally does not involve actual death? Some guy (talk) 09:18, 11 March 2009 (UTC)

It's clear from the beginning that this term is figurative, and there is a brief mention of actual death in the middle of the second paragraph. --Spike-from-NH (talk) 10:30, 11 March 2009 (UTC)

I think clear is an exaggeration. It's obvious if you're already familiar with the concept. The mention in the second paragraph isn't exactly clarification. Someone who is not a native English speaker could easily read the first few sentences and not be certain as to whether someone who loses a sudden death game is killed for the loss. Some guy (talk) 12:39, 11 March 2009 (UTC)

The article's first sentence could be rewritten "...sudden death (or a sudden-death round) is a figure of speech for competition under a rule that provides that play ends as soon as..." (My underlined change does more than add "figure of speech," to be more precise than saying "form of competition"). I have not yet applied this change to the article because I remain unconvinced that confusion of non-native English speakers is a serious problem here, and would solicit input from others first. --Spike-from-NH (talk) 14:38, 11 March 2009 (UTC)

The article admits that there were attempts to start calling it "sudden victory" out of political niceness, but happily that tepid term didn't catch on.WHPratt (talk) 14:29, 9 July 2009 (UTC)

Don't be so sure. The NCAA rulebooks for soccer, lacrosse, and wrestling all refer to "sudden victory" overtimes. Hockey, thankfully, still calls it "sudden death." —Preceding unsigned comment added by 165.206.43.5 (talk) 18:07, 15 March 2011 (UTC)

The article says "If neither team scores during this period, the teams use a penalty-shot shootout, consisting of three players in the NHL or five players in the minor leagues, to determine the winner. In the NHL, if no team wins this shootout, a 1-by-1, sudden-death shootout ensues." I really think that this is an unforgiveable abuse of the term, since shootouts are staged more like extra innings in baseball or overtime szessions in college football, wherein each team gets a chance and the contest can end on a save or a defensive stop as well as on a score. Some sudden death that is! WHPratt (talk) 14:22, 1 July 2012 (UTC)

American football

I'm pretty sure that the NFL didn't authorize overtime play until the middle 1950s, just shortly before it was first needed in 1958.

I suppose that, prior to that, if the NFL championshipo game had been tied after 60 minutes, they'd have crowned co-champions. Not an ideal solution, but workable.

But, what would they have done if a playoff game between teams that finished tied for a division lead were tied after 60? Someone has to advance to the title game!

A good topic for some research. WHPratt (talk) 20:40, 7 July 2009 (UTC)

Actually, a few months back, I added this information to the article History of National Football League Championship final paragraphs of the "1933 – 1966" section. WHPratt (talk) 01:08, 16 December 2011 (UTC)

Thanks for that relevant information! I've now added it to this article, lifting your wording from the article you link to, with minor adaptation (primarily, deleting the sentences that were not directly related to the topic of sudden death overtime). JudahH (talk) 15:17, 18 December 2011 (UTC)

Basketball

The article implies that basketball never employed sudden death; this is not the case as it was routinely used after two overtime periods had failed to break a tie in the years up to about the outbreak of World War II when overall scoring was far lower. If I come upon a reliable source stating this I'll cite it and add this to the article; however if someone already has this source I encourage them to be bold and go ahead and add this to the article. 2600:1004:B16D:AA57:B87B:8F7C:E361:389F (talk) 18:16, 24 May 2015 (UTC)

Article title

Why does the disambig read "sport" and not "sports"? As it is, it seems as if there was a sport called "sudden death". --uKER (talk) 05:09, 23 May 2017 (UTC)

Sport encompasses "all forms of competitive physical activity or games which,[1] through casual or organised participation, aim to use, maintain or improve physical ability and skills while providing enjoyment to participants, and in some cases, entertainment for spectators" — Preceding unsigned comment added by 124.171.71.192 (talk) 05:56, 23 May 2017 (UTC)

Precisely. Sudden Death is not a sport. It's a term describing something that's related to sports in general. --uKER (talk) 21:06, 29 May 2017 (UTC)

Yes, as explained by the link, sport in general, not any particular sport. IOW, it's shorthand for "Sudden death in sport", as opposed to say "Sudden death in hospital" or "Sudden death in traffic" — Preceding unsigned comment added by 124.171.71.192 (talk) 02:41, 30 May 2017 (UTC)

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Sudden dearth tie breakers

Question 1 To Question 10 41.114.83.113 (talk) 15:17, 12 April 2022 (UTC)