Talk:Samosa

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Other places[edit]

Samosas are also common foods in Ethiopia and many other African countries. There is some confusion on the influence of Africa on Samosas, or vice versa. Clarification on this is necessary.

I agree with the above comment, some clarification would be good. Somasas are an integral part of Cape Malay cuisine in the Cape Province of South Africa, AFAIK they are a long lived part of the food of the Malay slaves who origionated in Indonesia in the 1700's rather than transplanted from people of Indian descent who came to the Natal province of South Africa in the late 1800's. Does anyone know the genesis of these Samosas and those found in the rest of Afirca Htaccess 01:08, 4 September 2005 (UTC)[reply]

The beginning of the article states that samosas originated in Uttar Pradesh (a state in northern India), while the end of the article states that the samosa originated in Persia - which one is correct? --205.156.188.254 23:20, 20 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

The exact origin is unknown, but is likely Central Asia. They were common from North Africa (particularly Egypt) to West China in the 10th century. They almost certainly didn't originate in India or Pakistan (and certainly not modern day Pakistan, as one anonymous Wikipedian is claiming). However, they are probably most famous as an Indian cuisine & probably came from Central Asia. They most likely spread to the other country through trade. --Karnesky 02:43, 28 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Could you specify the page of your Oxford Companion reference? I found on page 511 [1]:

"... Important categories of dishes which have a Moghul origin include: PILAF and BIRIANI dishes; KEBABS, KORMAS, and KOFTAS; TANDOOR dishes; SAMOSAS. Rich dishes with almonds and pistachios are likely to be of Moghul origin, as are sweet rice dishes (flavoured with ..."

-Dforest 06:16, 28 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]

See, especially, page 690 (where the actual entry for "SAMOSA" is. --Karnesky 14:54, 28 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Just a few things I wanted to bring up. There is an article at Sambousa. I don't know if someone wants to incorporate the text from there into this article and redirect it here. On another point, there seems to be quite a number of alternate names/spellings from around the world for samosa. Someone with greater knowledge on the subject may want to add that info. Oh yeah, and does anyone have any reference for the "East African Railway/Indian workers in Africa" line? I'm going to remove it for now. If we're using presumptions, introduction through Egypt or the Arabian Peninsula seems just as likely. 24.218.25.244 04:40, 19 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Now All Samosa Love Until The End[edit]

THERE YUMMY !!!!!! 213.206.144.100 09:30, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Minh any comments to add? 213.206.144.100 09:32, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

-- anonymous

Can i just say that i bloody love samosas? It is no exaggeration to say that they are the western Asian equivalent of the beefburger or the pie - a cultural staple, a pure expression of the human need for nourishment, a distilled essence of the fundamental nature of food. We in the west are a fortunate people to have had them introduced to us.

Viva samosa!

-- Tom Anderson 128.40.81.186 23:14, 18 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

These are very important points and should be emphasised in the main article. I bought a samosa who told me she put her heart and soul into her samosas. I though the fish/offal combo would be horrible, but I enjoyed it. Stevendavy 22:03, 6 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Hahaha! Fish/offal ftw! 78.105.113.27 (talk) 00:50, 20 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Just a comment. How remarkable and interesting it is that the samosa, one of the finest products of world cuisine, originates and proliferates in some of the most ancient parts of the Old World - the Middle East, Africa and India, but has formed a wonderful partnership with a product of the New World, the potato. I was interested to read the suggestion about Cornish Pasties. At first I was sceptical, and doubt there is any historical connection. Wrapping contents in pastry isn't rocket science, even if it is wonderful. But if you are very lucky, you can find a Cornish Pasty whose filling is mainly potato and other root vegetables, and you can eat it cold. I had one once in the 1970s, but never found the shop again! Not spicy of course, but still good. 212.159.59.41 (talk) 10:13, 16 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Mergers[edit]

It has already been suggested that Sambousa be merged here - there's also a bigger article at Sambusac. Either all three should be merged under the most common name in English - Samosa, or those two should be merged together to reflect the Persian/Arab/Turkic take on these things. To be honest I'm not sure how different the latter are to those of the sub-continent, but if they are the same thing then I would definitely favour a merge, as it would allow the Central/West Asian history of the samosa to be better developed. Certainly the Achaemenid Empire or perhaps better the Sassanid Empire would provide a better 'fit' to the current distribution of samosas than an origin in India. Obviously they've come to places like Malaysia from India, but the history in North Africa and the Near East is much more ancient. I'd guess the samosas of East Africa date back to contact with either Arabs or India before the British Empire. FlagSteward 00:17, 24 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I'm strongly against the merger. I've eaten both samosas and sambusac, and they are definitely different, even if one is derived from the other. (For example, Baghdadi Jews living in India preserve their Iraqi-style sambusacs, and keep it quite distinct from their Indian repertoire.) --Sir Myles na Gopaleen (the da) (talk) 10:01, 24 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

hj

There are surviving 9th c. recipes for sambusac/sambusaj from Baghada (the Kitab al-Tabikh of Ibn Sayya al-Warraq) They were brought to India, probably with the arrival of Timurid Turco-Persians in the late 15th-16th c.

The seasonings in modern Indian and Pakistani samosas are quite different from those of the Arabic speaking world. Of course, modern sambusac in the Arabic world are different from those of the medieval period.

Merging, personally, i'm always sad to see when an article on the original form of something gets merged into an article about the most modern form. My opinion is that if they are to be merged, the older material should not be subsumed, made lessor, than the modern which derived from it.

Ellenois (talk) 20:13, 5 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

What's the connection with Brazilian pastéis?[edit]

The inclusion of the section on Brazilian pastéis seems rather tenuous. Aside from a superficial similarity - a fried food item in a pastry crust - the text establishes no cultural or historical links with samosas. It even states that their origins are as "modified spring rolls" introduced by "Chinese immigrants". Unless someone can establish a link, I believe this section strays from the topic and has no place in the article. Mutt Lunker (talk) 22:52, 29 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]


I have had Rajasthani Samosas in a Bikaneri shop. And they taste quite different. Samosas-makes from UP/Bihar make them in a different way. I am not too sure this can be conslusive. But I saw a mention of Hyderbadi samosa hence it came to my mind. Does anyone concur with me? Slimmer Eric Cartman (talk) 20:43, 19 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

why merge with curry beef triangle?[edit]

I'd be interested to know the rationale for this proposed merger as none has been presented. There appears to be only the most superficial of links. According to the article (which cites no references) a Curry beef triangle is Chinese in origin, semi-circular (despite the name) and the shell is of puff pastry and appears to be baked rather than fried. What's more beef would be an unlikely ingredient to find in food of the Indian subcontinent or Central Asia. Is there any demonstrable link in their origins? Mutt Lunker (talk) 23:29, 22 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Etymology?[edit]

It would be nice to say something about the etymology of the English word -- does it come from Hindi, Urdu, Tamil, or what? And what's the native-orthography and IPA transcription of the original word? --Jim Henry (talk) 18:34, 1 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Chamuças[edit]

Just merged the info from Chamuças into this article. Cheers! The Ogre (talk) 17:55, 14 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Cornish Pasties[edit]

Their are similarities and might be worth a link.?? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.194.193.194 (talk) 23:11, 8 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Merge from Sambusac[edit]

I rearranged the article quite a bit and merged in the information from Sambusac. I've tried to be as neutral as possible in regards to the regions—that is, the current name of the page ("Samosa") is appropriate because this is arguably the most common name (and variant) known in the Anglophone world.

If it's decided that the merger of Sambusac should be reverted, then each region's version should probably have it's own page, which I'm somewhat against, though not wholly. I'd definitely be in favour of discussing it, though, and this might be a good place to do it —Firespeaker (talk) 16:47, 11 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Somali Samosa Ban[edit]

Would it be worthy of a mention in this article, considering that there are multiple references to Somalia? Angryafghan (talk) 11:04, 27 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Al-Shabaab samosa snack ban[edit]

Two anonymous IPs and one account have been attempting to add material suggesting that the Islamist group Al-Shabaab (which is waging war against the federal government in Somalia) has banned samosas throughout the country. This is problematic for a number of reasons. For one thing, Al-Shabaab does not control all of the country; it only controls parts of the south, and is losing territory by the week. Secondly, this is just the latest in a series of ever-changing draconian edicts that the group is known for. Thirdly, the material is already cited on the Al-Shabaab article alongside all of the group's other draconian edicts. Fourthly, group members imposed a samosa snack ban on only one town (Afgooye) and one village (Elasha Biyaha) that it controls in the south, not the entire country; they couldn't do that even if they had wanted to (c.f. [2], [3], [4]). As such, the material clearly fails:

  • WP:EFFECT since "a precedent or catalyst for anything else of lasting significance is likely to be notable", which this samosa snack ban has not served as.
  • WP:PERSISTENCE since "notable events usually receive coverage beyond a relatively short news cycle", something which this shock news item of course hasn't either. Likewise, "events that are only covered in sources published during or immediately after an event, without further analysis or discussion, are likely not suitable for an encyclopedia article."
  • WP:GEOSCOPE since "notable events usually have significant impact over a wide region, domain, or widespread societal group", whereas this samosa snack ban has only been imposed in two small towns in southern Somalia.

Per WP:EVENT, "routine kinds of news events (including most crimes, accidents, deaths, celebrity or political news, "shock" news, stories lacking lasting value such as "water cooler stories," and viral phenomena) - whether or not tragic or widely reported at the time - are usually not notable unless something further gives them additional enduring significance." Wikipedia is also "not an indiscriminate collection of information or a news service. Wikinews offers a place where editors can document current news events, but not every incident that gains media coverage will have or should have a Wikipedia article." Middayexpress (talk) 20:10, 31 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

hebrew articles[edit]

Why are there two hebrew articles for "Samosa"? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.127.89.46 (talk) 06:15, 6 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]

not kyrgyz national food[edit]

it's not Kyrgyz national food, i think it's uzbek, uyghur and tajik food. I'm from Kyrgyzstan--158.181.133.198 (talk) 23:37, 6 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Why not merge "Etymology" and "Name variation"?[edit]

EOM. 74.70.103.82 (talk) 17:28, 3 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]

What does "sanbosag" (the Persian origin word) mean?[edit]

The "Etymology" section says that the word "samosa" can be traced to the Persian "sanbosag". What does "sanbosag" mean? Mksword (talk) 19:28, 24 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Crispy Wrapping Dough[edit]

There is a crispy variant of the dough, especially in South India which uses wheat flour with white flour in 1:2 ratio with oil. I am not adding it as an entry because cant find the recipe used to buy them for 3.50 Rs during lunch time and back home for 10 Rs with simple ingredients cooked to a savory filling.

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Retain "samosa" and redirect all others[edit]

As per the wikipedia guidelines, remove all variations of the name and retain only the most popular name "samosa" and create redirects here from other name spaces. Thanks. 18:24, 16 November 2018 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 222.164.212.168 (talk)

the meaning of the name[edit]

hi, Did anyone track a decent paper describing the meaning of the name "Sambusak", where did it come from? What is the meaning of the name in old (middle) Persian ?

I couldn't find it in the article

Thanks, Ophir. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ophirmaor (talk • contribs) 11:13, 1 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

middle eastern/central asian sambosak vs indian samosa[edit]

i think there is a big misconception, the original samosas from middle east were not triangular and not deep fried, they were baked, where as the samosas or dumplings in the indian subcontinent were deep fried, i think that indian samosas inspite of sharing same name are altogether different from sombosa of the middle east. comparing uzbek samsa to indian samosa is really funny because uzbek samsa is backed in the tandoor oven and its shape is totally different. baking the dough gets a totally different taste and dish than deep frying it.

Central Asian samsa were introduced to the Indian subcontinent in the 13th or 14th century by traders from Central Asia.[5] Amir Khusro (1253–1325), a scholar and the royal poet of the Delhi Sultanate, wrote in around 1300 CE that the princes and nobles enjoyed the "samosa prepared from meat, ghee, onion, and so on".[10] Ibn Battuta, a 14th-century traveler and explorer, describes a meal at the court of Muhammad bin Tughluq, where the samushak or sambusak, a small pie stuffed with minced meat, almonds, pistachios, walnuts, and spices, was served before the third course, of pulao.

mention of pie by ibn e batuta shows that sabosak from central asia was an entirely different dish which was baked rather than fried which was called sambusak, where as the earlier account from dehli sultanate mentions ghee which means deep fried traditional indian samosa.

60.54.13.118 (talk) 03:25, 17 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

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