Talk:Manhattan Life Insurance Building

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When destroyed?[edit]

There seems to be two stories how this was demolished. The article said:

"was demolished in 1930 for the Irving Trust Bank Headquarters Building."

but Emporis says:

"By the 1960s, the building was no longer particularly tall or fashionable, and was demolished to make way for the 1965 addition to the Irving Trust Company’s Art Deco One Wall Street, now The Bank of New York."

--Quasipalm 15:38, 23 September 2005 (UTC)[reply]

You´re right, the correct date of demolishion is 1963. Here are proofs everyone can find:

1. Open the book called "The American skyscraper, 1850-1940: a celebration of height" see the page 199 where it clearly says the date of demolition is 1963.

2. Click here: http://arttattler.com/architecturespeedlimits.html You can see One Wall Street Building being constructed and the Manhattan Life Insurance Building is still standing throughout the whole construction process right next to it (only the dome is visible).

3. Open the NYPL Digital Gallery: http://digitalgallery.nypl.org/nypldigital/dgkeysearchdetail.cfm?trg=1&strucID=104454&imageID=482661&total=28&num=20&word=irving%20trust%20building&s=1&notword=&d=&c=&f=&k=0&lWord=&lField=&sScope=&sLevel=&sLabel=&imgs=20&pos=28&e=w Photo from 1938 and again! You can see the top of the Manhattan Life Insurace Building next to the One Wall Street.

The Manhattain Life Insurance Building was not razed in 1930 simply because it was never standing on the plot of One Wall Street Building! It was razed in 1963 for THE EXPANSION of One Wall Street that was finished in 1965.

I am unable to update the main info because some wiki-morons constantly revert the update back to the wrong date!

"manhattan life insurance building

—Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.71.148.175 (talk • contribs) 17:51, 9 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The problem is, I see no such thing in the photos you linked to. The image, File:Manhattan Life Insurance Company Building New York City.jpg, shows no dome and I see no other structure resembling the MLIC building in the photos you linked. I don't have the book you mention, though the quote from the usually reliable Emporis is worrying. Perhaps if you brought more compelling evidence, gave some edit summaries explaining why (or at least directing people to this discussion), and didn't call other contributors to this encyclopedia "morons", your changes would be more likely to stay. Astronaut (talk) 13:27, 8 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Actually, the problem here are people who do not know the topic, know nothing about the rich history of this building, who do not bother to do a proper research before posting bullshit, who quote different wikipedia pages with the same mistake and yet have the insolence constantly reverting the correct info back to the wrong date. Those so called contributors are indeed morons.

If anyone is interested in the truth (obviously wikipedia is not) and almost complete history of this building from 1894 to 1963 you can learn more at http://manhattanlifeinsurancebuilding.blogspot.com (not my blog by the way) with more then 100 authentic photos, 2 videos (one even in colour) and with detailed explanation of most of the photos there. The blog is updated regularly if a new fact or an interesting photo is discovered.

And if for some reason you consider blog information as unreliable source you can always do your own research at libraries. You can start with books like "The American skyscraper, 1850-1940: a celebration of height" and "Rise of the New York Skyscraper: 1865-1913". You may also visit The library at the New-York Historical Society and The Museum of the City of New York library. In any case you will come to the same conclusion: Manhattan Life Insurance Building was in fact demolished in 1963. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.71.148.175 (talk) 20:00, 8 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

User:212.71.148.175, You need to calm down, and find some reliable websites. "Morons", you refer to are Wikipedians that have been on Wikipedia, for a much longer period than you have, so do not call editors "morons". If you don't have anything nice to say, don't say it at all. Thank You -- MelbourneStar☆ (talk) 07:11, 9 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"In 1936, the Manhattan Life Insurance Company relocated its offices to One-Hundred-Twenty West 57th Street in midtown Manhattan. Then, catastrophe arrived when the building was only 69 years old; in a 1963 act of utter desecration, the Manhattan Life Insurance Building was demolished." Sound fammiliar? A quote from the book. Now, It states that the MLIC relocated in 1936. The building could have been demolished in 1930, because the company relocated somewhere else. You can't relocate somewhere without owning that new site...so in the years 1930-1932 they had no relocation sites.

"Then, catastrophe arrived when the building was only 69 years old; in a 1963 act of utter desecration, the Manhattan Life Insurance Building was demolished" <--- from my understanding, that sentence tells us that Manhattan Life Insurance Building was demolished...the relocated MLIC, not the original. ....Then again, you can't trust all books. But you can trust reliable references -- MelbourneStar☆ (talk) 11:40, 10 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

No. The book says that it was demolished in 1963. It is online so you can read it. [1] Structrae and emporis say 1963. The CTBUH says 1964. There are at least two dates when it might have been demolished, so the article should reflect that. - 203.122.234.200 (talk) 09:39, 24 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Granted. Good Job! -- MelbourneStar☆ ^{(talk to me)} 09:46, 24 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Recognize something on that photo from 1952?: http://collections.mcny.org/mcny/C.aspx?VP3=ViewBox_VPage&VBID=24UP1GQR62YB&IT=ZoomImageTemplate01_VForm&IID=2F3XC5LFKPZ&PN=975&CT=Search — Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.175.191.46 (talk) 13:38, 19 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

No. -- MST☆R ^{(Chat Me!)} 01:41, 6 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Regarding 1930 as the demolition date[edit]

MelbourneStar reverted my edit saying (basically) that most sources agree on 63 (or 64) as the year it was demolished -- and that remains the case. What is the source that says it came down in 1930? I cannot find one. (I imagine the confusion between the Irving Trust Building (1928-32) and its Annex (1965).) Beyond My Ken (talk) 02:37, 6 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

here and here. In this article: "It was the first skyscraper to pass 330 ft (100 m) in Manhattan, and was demolished to make way for the Irving Trust Company Building (now One Wall Street) completed in 1931 and extended in 1965, that served as headquarters for the former Irving Trust Bank." -- MST☆R ^{(Chat Me!)} 02:50, 6 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Hmmm, not the most authoritative of sources, but enough, I think, for me to revert back to your version. I still think there's some confusion between the Irving Trust Bulding and its Annex behind all this, but I'll keep looking for a more definitive source. Thanks. Beyond My Ken (talk) 03:20, 6 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

What I find odd, is that sources have cited dates of the demolition - that are more than 30 years apart. Surely there must be a reliable undisputed source out there that has only one date. This is where we need a time machine, bad. Thank you -- MST☆R ^{(Chat Me!)} 03:55, 6 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

OK, I went at this from another angle. Your sources say that the Manhattan Life Insurance Building (which, according to this New York Times article I bought and downloaded, was sold in 1928 to the Central Union Trust Company) was demolished to make way for the Irving Trust Building, so I looked at the New York City Landmarks Preservations Commission's designation report for that building, also known as One Wall Street. According to that docuiment:

Four buildings were located on the site, including the "Chimney Corner", an undistinguished eighteen-story building steel-frame structure built in 1906 ... these buildings were demolished ...

There is no doubt in my mind that if the Manhattan Life Insurance Building has been one of the four buildings on the site that were demolished, the designation report would surely have mentioned it, since the building was significant, referred to by the Times in the article linked above as "a landmark in the financial district". Mentioning the undistingushed "Chimney Corner" without mentioning the much more distinguished building would not have been done. (The Annex building, built in 1963-65, is not part of the landmark designation and is barely mentioned in the report.)

I would still like a positive source that says the building came down in 1963 (or 64), but this rather conclusively establishes that the sources which give 1930 as the demolition date in order to build the Irving Trust Building cannot be correct. Beyond My Ken (talk) 05:00, 6 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Allthough articles I provided clearly outlined this particular building as being destroyed/demolished in 1930 - your edit do have mirror and have stated otherwise. I think the 30 year gap issue has been resolved - well as much as it possibly can. Thank you -- MST☆R ^{(Chat Me!)} 05:41, 6 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]