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October 7[edit]

Who should form a new War Cabinet? MPs in the smoking room, April 1940[edit]

In Foot, Dingle (1976). "1940". British Political Crises. London: William Kimber. p. 177. ISBN 0718301943. we read that "One evening in April, a group of seven or eight Members met in the smoking room. They were drawn from all parties. The question was discussed as to who should form a new War Cabinet. Each member of the group wrote down five names. When their suggestions were compared it was found that there was virtual unanimity. The five were Churchill, Lord Halifax, Attlee, Bevin and Sinclair". Who were those seven or eight Members? Thank you, DuncanHill (talk) 01:26, 7 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Maybe the "Watching Committee"? Peers wouldn't be in a meeting in the smoking room tho would they? fiveby(zero) 03:28, 7 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Duff Cooper, Leo Amery, Harold Macmillan, Harold Nicolson, Cranborne and Wolmer were the MP's on the committee. Rose, Kenneth (1975). The Later Cecils. pp. 104–5. I doubt those are the names we're looking for. fiveby(zero) 04:54, 7 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Fiveby: Thanks - the Watching Committee is new to me. While the names you give were all Conservatives it would not surprise me in the least if some of them, or Richard Law (mentioned in the ICS article you linked) were among our seven or eight from all parties. DuncanHill (talk) 14:26, 7 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

There were also the "Eden Group" or "glamour boys" (led by Amery), an "All Party Parliamentary Action Group" (Rathbone, Salter, Boothby, Nicolson, White, Grenfell and Amery)—but they met at the Carlton— and "The Vigilantes" (Boothby, Davies). It looks like there was quite a bit of overlap in membership and all these groups were probably larger than seven or eight members. Amery seems to be the real driver behind a "small, executive war cabinet": he spoke at length in Commons on 1st February[1], floated a memorandum "Case for a War Cabinet" to the Watching Committee members in March before their first meeting, which Salisbury's committee adopted and pushed hard for in early April. Witherell, Larry L. (November 2001). "Lord Salisbury's 'Watching Committee' and the Fall of Neville Chamberlain, May 1940". The English Historical Review. 116 (469): 1149. fiveby(zero) 16:09, 7 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Looking for likely candidates in Dingle's Select Bibliography:

not in Nicolson
can't find Boothby's I Fight to Live but it's not in Recollections of a Rebel
not in Amery

Think that just leaves Lloyd George or Dingle himself as the source. fiveby(zero) 18:18, 7 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks @Fiveby:, I didn't think it was mentioned in Nicolson or Boothby, I appreciate you checking. If it isn't mentioned in the memoirs of anyone involved we may never pin it down - and of course without knowing who was involved we can only guess at whose memoirs to check! I suspect Dingle may have heard it from his brother or Frank Owen, both of whom were in a position to pick up a lot of backbench goings-on. I don't think LlG himself would have been one of the Members (and I'm sure I've not seen anything to suggest it), but Megan Lloyd George might have been. I know she and Dingle sat together in the Commons - Dingle told her to go and fetch her father when Chamberlain made his appeal to his "friends in the House" in the Norway debate. DuncanHill (talk) 14:54, 9 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Enjoyed reading a little about Ernest Bevin while searching. fiveby(zero) 00:13, 10 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I'm glad - he's something of a neglected figure nowadays, but huge in his time. That makes me think it's possible A. L. Rowse may have mentioned the meeting somewhere. He and Bevin worked together organising china clay workers before the War and Rowse too was a vehement anti-Appeaser. He remained a great admirer of Bevin. I don't think I've seen it mentioned, but my collection of his books is (sadly) not complete, and it's been a while since I've read some of them. It's the sort of detail I rather think he would have used had he known it. DuncanHill (talk) 01:24, 10 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Where can I find these cards?[edit]

Where can I find these cards?

I would like to buy some or print out a PDF if I can find it.

https://awwmemes.com/i/snosidd-do-not-consent-a-police-officer-asks-to-search-991111

The small print on the first image says it is from Students for Sensible Drug Policy (SSDP) ssdp.org 06:32, 7 October 2021 (UTC)2600:1700:D0A0:21B0:352B:6753:7490:2266 (talk)

You could just create your own. And you might want to print them with red flags on them. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 06:39, 7 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I did not find the exact same card, but some very similar ones: [2]+[3] and [4]. --Lambiam 09:50, 7 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Also keep in mind that in many jurisdictions, cops will use an allegedly broken tail light as a pretext to pulling you over, so if you're carrying anything illegal, you're screwed. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 12:02, 8 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

If you allow them to search your car, they may plant drugs, and then you're screwed. --Lambiam 06:19, 9 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Maybe especially if you flash one of those cards. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 13:54, 9 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Pakistan journalist Aroosa Alam[edit]

Greetings,

Attempting to sorting out information from grapevine on the net. Looking for print media sources −(including pre internet times) from U.K. & Pakistan media for article Draft:Aroosa Alam, an old time Pakistan journalist.

Bookku, 'Encyclopedias = expanding information & knowledge' (talk) 08:12, 7 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Citizenship of Abdulrazak Gurnah?[edit]

In all media outlets I only read that Abdulrazak Gurnah was born in Zanzibar and now lives in England since many decades, but is he still a citizen of Tanzania or has he gained UK citizenship? /Bandy långe (talk) 16:59, 7 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Note that people born in British colonies and territories were British citizens and entitled to a UK passport and residency, until the Commonwealth Immigrants Act 1968. Alansplodge (talk) 18:47, 8 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The Sultanate of Zanzibar was a British protectorate. The subjects of the Sultan were not British subjects. --Lambiam 06:15, 9 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Quite right, not a British Citizen but a British Protected Person, which still entitles you to a British Passport if you were born in the Zanzibar Sultanate before 9 Dec 1963. Alansplodge (talk) 21:40, 9 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]