Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Charles H. Stonestreet/archive2

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The following is an archived discussion of a featured article nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured article candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The article was promoted by Ian Rose via FACBot (talk) 9 November 2019 [1].

Charles H. Stonestreet[edit]

Nominator(s): Ergo Sum 03:04, 10 September 2019 (UTC)[reply]

This article is about a 19th-century Jesuit who led Georgetown University and the American Jesuit province at a critical time in their history. He had a rather interesting life. One tidbit is that he was called as a character witness for two of the conspirators in the assassination of Abraham Lincoln. This is a second nomination, as the first did not generate sufficient comments. Ergo Sum 03:04, 10 September 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Support from TRM[edit]

I've had the pleasure of reviewing Ergo Sum's work on a number of occasions and this is a good example of one such article which I reviewed for GA-class but which I felt fundamentally exceeded those requirements. I'm pleased to see it here at FAC and also pleased to offer my support to the nomination. The Rambling Man (Staying alive since 2005!) 09:38, 11 September 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Source review[edit]

- spotchecks not done

  • FN13: Federal Reserve Bank of Minneapolis is the publisher, not the website or author
    • Fixed at {{Inflation/fn}}. Although there is an ongoing debate there, which really doesn't have anything to do with this article. Ergo Sum 14:35, 14 September 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  • Retrieval dates aren't useful for GBooks links
    • I think they serve a purpose, so long as they don't violate any policy. Ergo Sum 14:35, 14 September 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  • Catholic Editing Company is not an author. Nikkimaria (talk) 13:59, 14 September 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Ceoil[edit]

Will look over next few days. Ceoil (talk) 03:17, 29 September 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Leaning support, have read about half. Two things so far:
  • The article is very much a CV; especially in the very dense lead, where its all about the sequence of the progression of his career...and then..and then..and then.., and there is very little context. I don't really mind - notability is not in question, but is there a way to breath more life into it? Or shorthen so only the major progressions are mentioned, and not drowned by minor events. That would increase the chances of readers not getting exhausted and reading further. Ceoil (talk) 23:16, 4 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]
    • Admittedly, given a broad, contextual flavor to articles is not my strong suit, since it generally involves to quite a bit more research into ancillary events, which I don't know if I have the time to do at the moment. Ergo Sum 17:07, 13 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  • Ok, I've realized what I was trying to say. The article is too verbose, perhaps because sources are hard to find, and there may have been padding in earlier drafts. Not that I would remove any claims, but certainly would state them in less words. This is an example of what I mean, and you could certainly cut the lead by 33%...its a dense and daunting read as it stands. Note I am still leading support. Ceoil (talk) 23:27, 4 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]
    • I've trimmed the lede so that it's less verbose. Ergo Sum 17:11, 13 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  • Can you create a small article on the know nothings...they sound frustratingly fascinating, but are currently unexplained in the lead only.
  • For many years, discussions had occurred about establishing a dedicated scholasticate to educate new Jesuits, which would be separate from Georgetown, which educated lay students and where many of the Jesuit scholastics were teachers. this is hard to parse for several reasons. Ceoil (talk) 00:46, 5 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]
    • You're right, that was a muddled sentence. I've made it much clearer. Ergo Sum 17:14, 13 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]
    • Thank you for the comments. I will go through them in the next couple days. Ergo Sum 01:15, 5 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Not withstanding, I am a Support here, working on the lead, and expectant that Ergo will work through issue highlighted. Ceoil (talk) 21:52, 6 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  • @Ceoil: Thank you for your comments. I've left a note for each one. Ergo Sum 17:14, 13 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Coordinator notes[edit]

I've had this on the Urgents list for a while but it's stalled in recent weeks and doesn't have the amount of attention needed at present. I'll need to archive it within the coming days if it doesn't attract some more review. --Laser brain (talk) 18:00, 3 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Comments from Ceranthor[edit]

Prose
  • "He then was appointed President of Georgetown University in 1851, where he oversaw expansion of the university's library." - probably worth mentioning how long he was president
  • Any idea for which subject he was a professor?
  • "Bishops James Oliver Van de Velde of Chicago, Richard Pius Miles of Nashville, John Baptist Miège of the Indian Territory East of the Rocky Mountains.[21]" - missing an "and"
  • "His father was a distinguished lawyer who intended Charles to enter the legal profession." - I think it should be "intended for"
    • I think either would be grammatically correct, but I've added the "for". Ergo Sum 18:33, 5 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  • "Administration of the university by the generally low-key Stonestreet " - "low-key" might be a bit informal for an encylopedia article, IMO
  • "The several Chilean students successfully petitioned to be relieved of the requirement's frequency.[25]" - not sure if you explained why this is, but I read it and had no idea what this sentence meant... am I misisng something? Why the Chilean students in particular?
    • I don't know why it was specifically the Chileans. The source doesn't say. Ergo Sum 18:34, 5 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  • "That August, accepted an appointment as provincial superior of the Maryland province of the Society of Jesus; Bernard A. Maguire was named as his successor.[23]" - Stonestreet missing?
    • Clarified the subject. Ergo Sum 18:35, 5 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  • "He took office in the immediate aftermath" - As this is a new section, I think it should be "Stonestreet" rather than "He".
  • "For many years, the Jesuit leadership had discussed establishing a scholasticate for the education new Jesuits." - education of
  • " instead using secular styles such as "doctor."[36]" - Is styles the right word here, or did you mean titles?
  • "As president, Stonestreet" - probably worth saying "As president of Gonzaga"
  • "In 1860, he resignated as president of the school to the Jesuit Superior General,[46] " - resignated? A typo I think.
  • "In addition to during time as president, Stonestreet served on the board of directors of Georgetown from 1861 to 1862 and from 1863 to 1864.[49]" - Not sure the bolded bit is grammatically correct.
  • "He returned as a parish priest " - same note as above about starting a new section with "he"
  • "With the president of Georgetown, Bernard Maguire, health worsen in 1869," - typo(s)?
Images
  • File:Charles H. Stonestreet portrait.jpg - The license in the file description says it was never published, but the image description says that it was "First published in 'Gonzaga College, an Historical Sketch: From Its Foundation in 1821, to the Solemn Celebration of Its First Centenary in 1921' (1922) on p. 63." Those seem contradictory! I suspect the license template is wrong but that this is still public domain, though.
  • Other images all look fine to me. They also all have alt text.
    • Added a more appropriate tag. Ergo Sum 18:44, 5 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Good work overall. More typos and grammatical errors than I'd expect given how short this article is, but nothing a solid read-through can't fix. Once that's been completed, I will likely support. ceranthor 01:47, 4 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for the thorough read through, Ceranthor. I'll take a look at all these tomorrow. Ergo Sum 03:03, 4 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]
@Ceranthor: I will double-check on the question about what he was a professor of. Besides that, I believe I've addressed all your comments. Ergo Sum 18:44, 5 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Support Satisfied with the changes made per my comments. ceranthor 00:40, 6 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Support from Coffeeandcrumbs[edit]

  • It may be helpful to add a cite to his obit in WL.
  • "His father was a distinguished lawyer who intended for Charles" – His father is not mentioned by name, so is it necessary to use "Charles"
  • His obit linked above, at the top of p. 401, gives exact date he joined Society of Jesus as August 14, 1833
  • ...also mentions noviceship under Fridelis Grivel
  • ...obit also states he became spiritual father at the College of the Holy Cross in 1880 (p. 402)
  • ...was ill for two years before his death
  • ..."Dr. Samuel Mudd" — remove "Dr." in the two instances per MOS:DOCTOR

That's it for me. Feel free to ignore any and all recommendations. --- Coffeeandcrumbs 07:27, 9 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

@Coffeeandcrumbs: Thank you for the comments. A very useful WL link. I'll go ahead and incorporate them. Ergo Sum 15:13, 9 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.
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