Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Westmount Park School (2nd nomination)

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was redirect to English Montreal School Board. There seems to be a clear consensus that the article does not have enough RS coverage to meet the notability guidelines, but that it still warrants a redirect to the school board page. (non-admin closure) SkyGazer 512 ^{Oh no, what did I do this time?} 17:12, 30 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Westmount Park School[edit]

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A ton of WP:SPS and what isn't SPS is not mentioning the school directly, but pointing to statistics. Reads as a borderline advertisement. -- Amanda (aka DQ) 07:58, 23 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Redirect - to the school board. I don't understand how this passed AfC, as it had been redirected in the prior AfD. Redirect is generally the way lower schools are handled (see WP:SCHOOLOUTCOMES). As the nominator is an admin, and my vote is to restore the consensus reached in the prior AfD, perhaps she could look at the previous article with an eye to withdrawing this, and restoring the redirect as editing against consensus? John from Idegon (talk) 08:48, 23 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

It's not the same article as was originally around, and would not apply to CSD G4, therefore I felt it needed the discussion first here. -- Amanda (aka DQ) 20:08, 23 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Comment - thought I should specifically ping @L293D:, though it'll have flashed up on their watchlist, to see if they could give us their views. I have some thoughts of my own, but would like to see theirs first. Nosebagbear (talk) 12:04, 23 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Schools-related deletion discussions. CAPTAIN RAJU^(T) 18:47, 23 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Canada-related deletion discussions. CAPTAIN RAJU^(T) 18:47, 23 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Education-related deletion discussions. CAPTAIN RAJU^(T) 18:47, 23 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Redirect to English Montreal School Board and add the sentences pertaining to the school founding and International students sources from the Westmont Independent, which is a local neighborhood newspaper, to the verbiage at that board article. There are 40 elementary schools in that board, the ones that have articles have a fair list of alumni. Reconsider if secondary sources outside of the region give the school significant coverage. AngusWOOF (bark • sniff) 19:00, 23 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Redirect to English Montreal School Board. Can't find several RS, no idea how I accepted this. L293D (☎ • ✎) 20:54, 23 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Redirect at the risk of a pile-on !vote, backing the specific redirect given. Obviously a dearth of RS and whatever your view on the status of SCHOOLOUTCOMES, elementaries wouldn't be covered Nosebagbear (talk) 21:02, 23 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Redirect as no evidence of notability, Fails SCHOOLS & GNG. –Davey2010^Talk 01:35, 27 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Hi Davey2010, Leonard Cohen and Norma Shearer attended this institution during the early 20th century. Reference sourced and added August 29, 2018 to support notability guideline. Nufwps18 (talk) 10:15, 30 August 2018 (UTC-4)

- See WP:INHERIT. John from Idegon (talk) 14:23, 30 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Redirect (per policy - alternatives to deletion). Kudpung กุดผึ้ง (talk) 08:32, 28 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Comment - Surprised at the eagerness to delete relevant new content of a +100 year Canadian school and building. As an open source reference site, it is best to allow other users to contribute to the growth of this page (considering the page is less than a month old). This is one of only 2 public schools in this community where an English language school is a dying breed in a French city. Furthermore, there are notable alumnus to be confirmed prior to publishing. Nufwps18 (talk) 10:50, 28 August 2018 (UTC-4)

Hi Nufwps18 - while the majority of page growth is after its creation, it has to meet minimal standards from the beginning (otherwise we have nothing to prove the information we are making public). While its scarcity may or may not make it important, without reliable sources demonstrating that it can't be proved and can't provide any notability. Nosebagbear (talk) 15:03, 28 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Comment - Given the guidelines by which the comments above have based their "redirect" recommendation, why does Wikipedia allow all movies, TV shows to be featured? Those types of pages are commercial and serve to advertise. Should those pages also be "redirected" to film company pages based on the criteria used? I believe a 104 year old public institution with a rather rich history still to be unlocked adds value to Wikipedia. Nufwps18 (talk) 9:37, 29 August 2018 (UTC-4)
- Notability isn't based on anyone's opinion of how important something is. It's based on whether the subject has been written about in detail. It seems to me that "a rather rich history still to be unlocked" is a fancy way of saying those sources do not exist. I'd say WP:TOOSOON might apply, but honestly, no one has written about it in 104 years, why would we expect that to change now? The standard practice outlined by WP:SCHOOLOUTCOMES works perfectly here. Grammar, elementary or basic schools are the oldest and most common type of school. Except under rare circumstances, individual basic schools are seldom written about in detail. And most often when they are, it is for reasons external to their educational purpose, such as being architecturally significant, or being a part of a significant historic event. John from Idegon (talk) 14:39, 30 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Hi John from Idegon, ultimately, I hope this page is given an opportunity to grow with time. Having read WP:TOOSOON, would Star Wars: Episode IX not be classified as such as it literally seems too soon to create a Wikipedia page for an unreleased film (Dec 20, 2019... 1 year 4 months before release). Granted there are many fans of the epic sci-fi franchise, but there are fan sites for discussion and studio social media feeds for pre-release info. Having reviewed WP:INHERIT, the fact this school was originally a high school from 1914-1961 with Leonard Cohen attending begins to add relevance to this topic. Film maker Paul Almond, director of the documentary Seven Up! also attended in the 1940s when the school was Westmount Junior High School. I do appreciate the review process and hope to add supporting reference information from RS. Sourcing digital material for older institutions sometimes just takes an individual to pull the basics together and verify the first few nuggets to get the ball rolling. Cheers.Nufwps18 (talk) 12:57, 30 August 2018 (UTC-4)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.