Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Valentina Seferinova
- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was delete. If content here is a copy vio then this is no further discussion. Spartaz Humbug! 09:27, 26 December 2014 (UTC)
Valentina Seferinova[edit]
- Valentina Seferinova (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log · Stats)
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BLP prod removed after references were added. However, the coverage (references, external links, etc.) does not seem sufficient to justify this article passing Wikipedia:General notability guideline and the more detailed Wikipedia:Notability (biographies) requirement. The article also suffers from terrible layout/formatting, and poor grammar/vocabulary. It does not belong in the mainspace (through I am not saying we should delete it due to it looking like a bad draft; bad drafts can be improved - I am just not seeing any reliable references in this mess). Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 09:21, 9 December 2014 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Bulgaria-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 03:08, 10 December 2014 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of United Kingdom-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 03:08, 10 December 2014 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Academics and educators-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 03:08, 10 December 2014 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Bands and musicians-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 03:08, 10 December 2014 (UTC)
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Hi As I didn't know if you read that on Piotrus page, I copied the posts & I'm pasting them here. Would be grateful for reply. Discussion: Dear Piotrus Why is Valentina Seferinova page suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia? Quite a few reasons come to mind: I have come across many other entries where (in my opinion & not only my opinion, but others too!) people haven't achieved & have not contributed to our musical knowledge as much as I have & still am trying to do. Indeed many entries that I see in the Classical Music genre should not be there at all. It has been my intention to bring back from 'the dead' many composers & their music. It's composers & music that at their time was a significant part of the concert stage & people's lives. I have recorded and played live many long forgotten composers of different nationalities (Polish, Jewish, Swiss, Bulgarian etc etc). I'm not just focusing on Bulgarian music (because I've been born brought up there) but I'm trying to bring to life as many composers from different nationalities & countries that for many reasons were forgotten (or in some cases music was destroyed by Nazi's in their attempt to erase Jewish and Polish music and culture from the face of our planet! Similarly with Stalin in the second half of the 20th century and his attempts to complete Hitler's aims of crushing Jewish and polish culture) as much as I can. Since the collapse of Communism has allowed these cultures to start investigating and putting things back together in their original and true context. I'm not sure if you're a musician of any sort, or have an in depth knowledge of musical history but please try and see the significance of the composers listed on my entry. They have not been chosen on a whim. They all fall into the category of what I'm outlining. For the Poles - they have yet to re-discover who and what came after Chopin in terms of the development and progression of the classical music form!! (because of the cultural destruction they suffered). It's absolutely the same for long lost composers with a Jewish heritage - they too suffered horrendously during the 20th Century. I feel that unless we know of our past & our heritage, how will we be able to find the right path into the future?! If we don't know where we came from (musically and philosophically) - how do we know where we're going; and what it all means? The development of modern music forms (both classical and modern) absolutely forms a lineage (like an ancestral tree; one composer/performer learns from his peers then passes on his knowledge and ideas to the generation that follows him or her) over the centuries. The Polish composers Noskowski, Różycki, and Wieniawski are absolutely in that vein. Similarly the ethnically Jewish composers Raff, Jadassohn, and Brüll are themselves in that vein Another reason: there have been so many people at concerts, on the Internet, YouTube, you name it, that have been saying after hearing some of the music I have recorded & played live: 'Why haven't I heard of this before? It's beautiful! Where can we find out more...? Thank you for bringing this music to us!. ..' Well, I'm trying (as others do too) & succeeding: Raff op2 No2 Romance I recorded for the first time ever (in history in fact) in 2002; it is now a well-established piece in the piano literature - included in the grade 6 Trinity exam board! Nowadays many other people are playing & recording the music I've discovered: The Jadassohn concerto I recorded for the first time ever has subsequently been recorded again by the Hyperion label by another soloist and orchestra. Similarly the Raff 2nd Sonata that I recorded for the first time ever (the term 'premiere recordings' is exactly what it says) has been recorded subsequently by another artiste by Naxos etc... My recordings and myself are thus 'notable' in that they are the originals which others are judged by. At the end I just want to add that I'm doing all this revival in the benefit of the new generation & future generations as when I was a student I had to learn about the music of composers without being able to hear a single note of it as there were no recordings available. There are many piano performers who are listed on Wikipedia - and I don't know why it is so - because they do not appear to be 'notable' (your criteria) in any exceptional way for their performances. May I humbly suggest that I have not just the performance qualifications - but the academic qualifications also - so much missing in others and their entries. Although writing about my own achievements feels awkward, I feel the facts speak for themselves. Regards Valentina Seferinova Master of Music - Theory; Assistant Professor of Music - Performance (Married Name = Mrs Valentina Seferinova-Bradley; my British husband has always agreed to my retaining my maiden name for professional reasons - i.e.’ Valentina Seferinova’ has a better 'ring' about it than 'Valentina Bradley' !! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Visb723(talk • contribs) 07:13, 10 December 2014 (UTC) Moved from top, by — Revi 07:24, 10 December 2014 (UTC) MLADENOVA (talk) 10:31, 10 December 2014 (UTC)Visb723MLADENOVA (talk) 10:31, 10 December 2014 (UTC) and small corrections by MLADENOVA (talk) 10:31, 10 December 2014 (UTC)MLADENOVAMLADENOVA (talk) 10:31, 10 December 2014 (UTC) Dear Piotrus Re proposed deletion of Valentina Seferinova on the grounds of lack of clear references. Have added 2 cite references for 'Valentina Seferinova' and the piano Duo 'Va I Ve' - each from the British & International Music Year Book 2015 - although both have been in this authoritative reference manual for in excess of 14 or 15 years. regards MLADENOVA (talk) 10:42, 10 December 2014 (UTC)MLADENOVAMLADENOVA (talk) 10:42, 10 December 2014 (UTC)
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- Delete - not a single link added to this article is reliable and independent of the subject. Bearian (talk) 21:39, 10 December 2014 (UTC)
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It might not be 'Independent' - but by God it's 'Reliable' !! MLADENOVA (talk) 15:22, 12 December 2014 (UTC)MLADENOVAMLADENOVA (talk) 15:22, 12 December 2014 (UTC) Dear Piotrus As in the case of being invited to perform at the Claude Debussy House & Museum – exactly the same criteria applies. PS the International Rachmaninoff Society ceased to be in 2013 – mainly due, it’s believed, to being no longer financially viable. Regards
MLADENOVA (talk) 16:50, 10 December 2014 (UTC)MLADENOVAMLADENOVA (talk) 16:50, 10 December 2014 (UTC) Dear Piotrus
I again address whether Valentina Seferinova is worthy of a Wikipedia entry; although this comment is slightly more difficult.
In my mind that’s ‘notable’ The difficulty I have is – how can I cite and prove his words when I don’t want the video to be in the Public Domain (even though his words are!) Regards So here we have a former child prodigy (her first public performances as a solo piano player, and orchestral soloist were when she was only 12 years of age – that’s notable) who went on to become a highly academically qualified award winning (see original entry) classical Concert pianist - which I suggest is notable in itself (Typically performers have the gift and talent of performance only) |
- Userfy or delete It is easy to determine that the subject is indeed a musician who performs and records. I cannot, however, find any neutral-party reviews of her work. She is listed on album covers as "award-winning" but so far there is no source for this. Also note that some of the text of the article was taken verbatim from some album cover blurbs, which would in theory make them copyright violations. To the editor of the article, the first thing I would suggest is finding some (preferably English-language) articles about her and reviews of her work. This references must NOT be blogs, nor from her own web site, nor may they be promotional materials for her recordings or performances. You need to find a reliable music reviewer who has written about her work. And remember: every fact you include in the article must come from a third-party source, even those facts you know personally. LaMona (talk) 05:02, 14 December 2014 (UTC)
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Dusti*Let's talk!* 04:27, 16 December 2014 (UTC)
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The comments that follow are also intended to answer Bearian's post above that there isn't a single reliable and independent link to support valentina Seferinova's article, when in fact there are, in fact many many. My problem has been, in trying to be editorially neutral in following Wikipedia guide lines, I felt they were too self promoting to be used. Hi Dusti Hi Dusti Hi "Valentina Seferinova takes on a difficult task, making something exciting out of Joachim Raff's highly respectable but hardly compelling Fantasia-Sonata, Op.168, Grand Sonata Op.14, and Trois Morceaux, Op.2. She is a fluent pianist, and does a fine job, until the dreadful fugue that takes up most of the finale of Op.14. Like the listener, she seems to go on automatic pilot, coping with one academic entry of the theme after another - one of the reasons Raff, despite many attempts to resurrect his music, remains more a "name" than a living musical force.” Please try and distinguish between comments on the music itself, and on the performer! Now I ask you to go the first of many on-line references to Valentina's work, performances and recordings. Please - how do I reflect this - and use the Joachim Raff Society's links on Valentina's article without it appearing self promotional ? Hi again I somewhat pass over a controversial review of another of Valentina's CDs (Zygmunt Noskowsi - Piano Works 1) by Jonathan Woolfe at http://www.musicweb-international.com/classrev/2009/Nov09/Noskowski_Piano1_APO188.htm, mainly because Valentina disputes some of his remarks ("The first is quite tough and Seferinova sounds a little stretched by its demands". To which Valentina replies "Oh no I wasn't!"). Although he did remark in his summary "The performances are enjoyable ..." A thorough in-depth review of yet another of Valentina's CDs is by Steve Arloff, again at the independent reviewers at http://www.musicweb-international.com/classrev/2013/Apr13/Rozycki_Vol1_AP0263.htm Regards Continuing on about Edvard Grieg's classic Concerto for piano and orchestra in A minor op.16 - which has been played by countless number of soloists, with a countless number of orchestra's to a countless number of audiences - I ask you - and anyone else reading this post, just for the heck of it, to become a reviewer yourself! I challenge you - to search YouTube, the Internet for another recorded example of what you are witnessing! MLADENOVA (talk) 21:22, 18 December 2014 (UTC)MLADENOVAMLADENOVA (talk) 21:22, 18 December 2014 (UTC) Valentina Seferinova
Summary: I feel that I/we have successfully answered all the ‘challenges’ made to her Wikipedia article. |
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.