Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/The 4th Reich

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was no consensus. Stifle (talk) 08:21, 18 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The 4th Reich[edit]

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Delete per WP:NFF, principal photography hasn't even begun yet on the film. Just a disclaimer, this article had an expired proposed deletion tag that I removed because an editor protested deletion on the talk page. -- Atama頭 22:12, 10 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Film-related deletion discussions. -- Atama頭 22:14, 10 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Procedural note I've removed a large chunk of this as a blatant copyvio. – iridescent 22:25, 10 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks, I suspect that the creator of this article, Shaunrobertsmith78, is the same Shaun Robert Smith who wrote and plans to produce and direct the film. He was probably quoting himself there, but of course that doesn't satisfy our copyright policy. -- Atama頭 22:32, 10 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Delete/Userfy per WP:TOOSOON. Does not meet the GNG criteria that might merit this article as a possible exception to WP:NFF. If requested, give back to author for continued sourcing toward a possible return... but with a caution toward WP:COI and WP:COPYVIO. Schmidt, ^{MICHAEL Q.} 00:16, 11 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Keep. Hi. I have no problem with the policy in general. In this specific case, I think it is fair to say objectively that it's a green director who made an inadvertent error. He took the WP step too soon. If you look at the plan for his film, it's a location shoot with several well-known actors. That's enough pressure; let's be lenient on the fellow his first time out. Varlaam (talk) 01:59, 12 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Reply - Thank you for your comment. I too prefer to be lenient on newcomers, which is one reason why I chose to start this discussion to give him a say in the fate of this article rather than deleting an expired proposed deletion (the other reason is that you had objected to the deletion, though not by removing the PROD tag per standard procedure). We have a common standard that applies to all articles on films, WP:NFF. The film industry is somewhat like the music industry in that planned projects often do not reach completion, and so articles on films that have not yet begun shooting are not accepted unless there is a lot of coverage about the film to establish that the film is particularly notable even in pre-production. Also, even when shooting begins, some coverage of the film is usually required before an article is accepted. I wish Mr. Smith well with his creation, but Wikipedia is not the place to generate interest in his proposed film. Once it is released and the film can be shown to be notable his input and participation in the article may be quite welcome, while of course keeping in mind our conflict of interest guideline. My own personal feeling is that there's enough established talent in the film (looking at the cast list) that if it survives and gets a general release that it should merit inclusion in Wikipedia at a later date, but that's only speculation -- Atama頭 02:17, 12 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I have modified my comment above to include userfication. Absolutely no harm in allowing it to be worked on until it's ready for return to mainspace. Schmidt, ^{MICHAEL Q.} 06:20, 12 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I think that's a good idea also. -- Atama頭 15:43, 12 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Userfy per nom and Schmidt. Cliff smith ^talk 17:19, 13 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Keep. Hi this is in fact Robert Morris - Shaun Robert Smith's PA. I am in control of his web interest and promotion etc. I had no idea that these rules applied - for that I apologise. WP is a fantastic source for information and a first stop for the general public to find out about practically anything. Shaun had WP at the top of his list. The 4th Reich is infact in full swing with pre-production - a little delayed but still on track for a 2011 release. I understand your policy and is similar to that of IMDb. We thank you for your leniancy and urge you to keep it or let us carry on editing for a future addition.RobMorris 21:57, 15 August 2010 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Shaunrobertsmith78 (talk • contribs)

Reply - Thank you Robert for joining the discussion. So far the consensus seems to be to "userfy" the article (though that can still change). If userfied, the article will no longer appear among the regular Wikipedia articles, but it will instead be a subpage of your own user page. That way we satisfy the guidelines for film articles but you can continue to work on it in your own space, and add details and even collaborate with other editors to improve it if you ask for help. If production goes well and the movie becomes notable enough to meet our criteria, then it can be moved back into regular article space for the public to view. I do wish you, Shaun, and everyone else involved the best of luck as you create this movie. -- Atama頭 23:42, 15 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.