Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Rhirid ab Owain Gwynedd

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. Cirt (talk) 00:35, 25 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Rhirid ab Owain Gwynedd[edit]

(Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)

Delete. This is another bastard with no apparent notability to speak of. JBsupreme (talk) 00:13, 18 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Delete - I am unable to find sources testifying to either the notability or existence of this person. (Zero GScholar hits is surprising.) - DustFormsWords (talk) 02:05, 18 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Comment There are now sources testifying to his existence, though none mention him extensively. I would say merge to the article on Owain Gwynedd or Hywel ab Owain Gwynedd (which currently doesn't mention him).--Cúchullain ^t/c 16:53, 18 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Incidentally, the article's original raison d'être - the association with the Madoc legend - no longer appears in the rewritten version. I seem to recall that Rhirid was indeed associated with some version of the Madoc legend, but I don't remember which. Gwyn Williams' Madoc: the Making of a Myth would probably have it; unfortunately I no longer have access to this book to check myself. If this is true, then Rhirid would be (marginally) notable for two things, which may be a reason to preserve an independent article, though it could never be more than a few sentences long.--Cúchullain ^t/c 18:50, 18 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Wales-related deletion discussions. —Cúchullain ^t/c 18:50, 18 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - I originally created the wiki and I admit as a stand alone it is rather weak and pointless. Without spending a lot of time looking it up right now, this Rhirid is, according to legend, the brother Madoc returned to collect and take back to new lands in America, or more likely; Ireland. This Rhirid apparently had an estate near Dublin which his descendants held until the 17th Century. But is this enough to justify a page for Prince Rhirid? I think objectively, probably not. If we decide it is worth retention then referencing can be improved, but is that the question? I'm happy for it to be deleted, because he did not do anything particularly noteworthy, and allow poor Rhirid to slowly fade into complete obscurity....James Frankcom (talk) 00:31, 19 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.