Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Piotr Czerniawski

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. JohnWBarber and Eastmain seem to have demonstrated that there are reliable sources out there. Ideally this Wikipedia is entirely agnostic as to which languages references should be in (although it surely is a bummer trying to find them if they happen to exist in a language which uses a non-Latin script, which is not the case here). Angus McLellan (Talk) 00:50, 24 February 2010 (UTC)

Piotr Czerniawski

Piotr Czerniawski (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log • AfD statistics)

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No evidence that he meets WP:AUTHOR. Article also created by subject [1]. -- Pakaran 23:04, 10 February 2010 (UTC)

• Comment. He has been written about here: Tekstylia bis. Słownik młodej polskiej kultury, ed. Piotr Marecki, Kraków 2006, s. 174-175. ISBN 9788389911438 I cannot evaluate how in-depth the reference is, beyond the fact that it spans (parts of) two pages. The poets to whom he is compared are redlinks in the English Wikipedia and blue links in the Polish Wikipedia. – Eastmain (talk • contribs) 00:57, 11 February 2010 (UTC)
  • "Tekstylia bis" is a well-established dictionary of the "young Polish culture" (so he's got his own dictionary entry...) Since Piotr Czerniawski is an administrator of Polish Wikipedia (moreover, a bit harsh administrator) there were some attempts to delete the pl-wiki article about him: but in every case many people well orientated in the Polish culture were sure, that he is notable. I do not know well English Wikipedia policies, but I always thought that the Polish understanding of "notability" is far more strict, closer to this of German Wikipedia... So, among Polish poets of young generation he's clearly notable, and I do not think that making sensible decisions in this discussion is possible for editors, who aren't well orientated in the Polish culture. Not knowing en-wiki policies, I do not want to vote, but only to say, that the advice of Polish wikipedians is to keep it. Laforgue (talk) 13:25, 16 February 2010 (UTC)
• Note: This debate has been included in the list of Authors-related deletion discussions. —Eastmain (talk • contribs) 00:57, 11 February 2010 (UTC)
• Note: This debate has been included in the list of Poland-related deletion discussions. —Eastmain (talk • contribs) 00:57, 11 February 2010 (UTC)
• Comment. The described person's notability is undisputed on pl-wiki. In case of young poets especially the reception of their works is important - here it seems that he has established some presence in literary circles. Pundit|utter 16:07, 13 February 2010 (UTC)
• Delete - non-notable individual. Fails WP:AUTHOR by a mile - Alison ^❤ 04:57, 15 February 2010 (UTC)

  Well, only if you ignore non-English sources :) Being covered in leading literary dictionaries/encyclopedias is hardly failing WP:AUTHOR by a mile. I think there clearly is a slight bias against non-English sources on en-wiki (for obvious reasons), but nevertheless the policies do not state that the coverage has to be in English (as it would, quite naturally, very much favor people from English speaking countries as "notable"). Pundit|utter 13:39, 16 February 2010 (UTC)

• Comment - the bias against non-English sources on en-wiki is "slight"? Opbeith (talk) 23:58, 17 February 2010 (UTC)

---

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so consensus may be reached.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Tim Song (talk) 08:00, 17 February 2010 (UTC)

• Keep Appears to pass WP:AUTHOR. The second largest newspaper in Poland (according to our Wikipedia article on it) is Gazeta Wyborcza (600,000 circulation -- it would be one of the biggest dailies in the U.S. if it were located there) has mentioned this poet, as a poet, numerous times, so he appears to pass #1. It's in Polish and its articles are behind a subscription wall, but my Google toolbar helps me translate some pages (it translates his first name as "Peter"), so a Google News archives search comes up with:

  1. Dec. 15, 2005 (7th search result here [2]), seems to compare a poem by someone else with a poem by our subject: "Related vocabulary used Peter Cherniavsky in the poem "The" (book "The amendments to the dreams"), but with him it was a single text, and add language ..." (Drugą nagrodę ex aequo zdobyli Piotr Czerniawski i Julka Szychowiak, trzecie miejsce przyznano Adamowi Grzelecowi. Podczas Turnieju przyznano także nagrodę ...)
  2. November 18, 2005 (8th search result on the page): "Second prize ex aequo captured Peter Cherniavsky Julia Szychowiak and third place awarded to Adam Grzelecowi. During the Tournament the prize awarded ..." (... Minidyskusja: Marta Mizuro, Urszula Glensk, Miniprezentacje: Piotr Czerniawski, Marta Dzido, Ewa Schilling, Joanna Wilengowska, Jakub Żulczyk). ...)
  3. April 27, 2006: (7th result on this page [3]) "Peter Cherniavsky will be a guest of "appetite for reading." Meeting with the author of "30 Easy Pieces" and "Amendments to the Dream" will begin in the chair. ..." (Piotr Czerniawski będzie gościem "Apetytu na czytanie". Spotkanie z autorem "30 łatwych utworów" i "Poprawek do snów" rozpocznie się o godz. ...)
  4. December 14, 2004: (2nd result on this page [4]) Title: "Tomorrow poetry lovers and poets will have to choose between two ..." Snippet of text: "At the first fire of the poets go Jacek Bierut Peter Cherniavsky and Paul Petrovich and independent film director Luke Tunikowski. ..." (Title: Jutro miłośnicy wierszy i poetów będą musieli wybrać między dwoma … Text: Na pierwszy ogień pójdą poeci: Jacek Bierut, Piotr Czerniawski i Paweł Piotrowicz oraz niezależny reżyser filmowy Łukasz Tunikowski. ... )
  5. Jan 31, 2003: (5th result, same search page as just above) "The work will be assessed poets and Tomasz Jacek Podsiadlo Zakharevitch and Peter Cherniavsky the editor is showing irregularly Wroclaw journal ..." (Prace oceniać będą poeci: Jacek Podsiadło i Tomasz Zacharewicz oraz Piotr Czerniawski z redakcji nieregularnie ukazującego się wrocławskiego czasopisma ...)
  6. Dec 28, 2009: (7th result, same search page as above), this one from "Weekly General" publication: Title: "Literature, Man, Mankind" Snippet: "Sylwia Chutnik, Peter Cherniavsky, Peter Czerski, Joanna Pawluskiewicz, Michal Zygmunt) represent the image of capitalism as a world of insurmountable framework ..." (Sylwia Chutnik, Piotr Czerniawski, Piotr Czerski, Joanna Pawluśkiewicz, Michał Zygmunt) przedstawiają obraz kapitalizmu jako świata nieprzekraczalnych ram ... )
  7. Nov. 17, 2001: (10th result, same search page) "The three got the second prize: Luke Baginski, Klara Nowakowska and Miroslaw Marcol, two-thirds: James Jóźwicki and Peter Cherniavsky. Several distinguished poets. ..." (Trzy drugie nagrody dostali: Łukasz Bagiński, Klara Nowakowska i Mirosław Marcol, dwie trzecie: Jakub Jóźwicki i Piotr Czerniawski. Kilku poetów wyróżniono. ... )
  8. Oct 16, 2001 (5th search result on this page [5]): TITLE: "Poetic Top Ten" Text: "Ewa Sonnenberg, Martin Hamkało, Peter Cherniavsky, Filip Zawada, Marcin Kurek, Rafal Witek, Agnieszka Free, Adam Borowski. In the world of poetry introduces young ..." (Title: Poetycki top ten Text: Ewa Sonnenberg, Marcin Hamkało, Piotr Czerniawski, Filip Zawada, Marcin Kurek, Rafał Witek, Agnieszka Wolny, Adam Borowski. W świat młodej liryki wprowadzi ...

  I get the distinct impression that this guy is "regarded as an important figure" in the world of Polish poetry, at least by Poland's second-largest daily newspaper, and apparently by the "Weekly General" publication, from at least 2001 to 2009. If not, why would they refer to him so often? -- JohnWBarber (talk) 20:54, 18 February 2010 (UTC)

  Comment: "Weekly General" probably refers to Tygodnik Powszechny, which used to publish texts by, among others, Karol Wojtyła, Leszek Kołakowski, Stanisław Lem, Czesław Miłosz and Zbigniew Herbert. — Kpalion^(talk) 16:14, 19 February 2010 (UTC)

• Keep - the above seems to show that there is no shortage of sources when you look for them. That the article is self-created is undesirable, but not a reason to delete it.--Kotniski (talk) 16:16, 19 February 2010 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.