Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Otgonbayar Ershuu

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. Sandstein 22:27, 8 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Otgonbayar Ershuu[edit]

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This article was created by the artist himself via now-blocked sockpuppets. The sources all appear to be closely connected to the artist (mostly from his own website). I also did a search in Mongolian and couldn't find any independent sources, though I obviously can't be sure. He might not pass WP:NARTIST either, as the exhibitions he claims to have been featured in are relatively small, besides the National Art Museum of Moldova—though the source for that is dead. Even if he may be notable, it might be best to TNT it. Ovinus (talk) 18:10, 1 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Artists-related deletion discussions. Spiderone 18:21, 1 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Mongolia-related deletion discussions. Spiderone 18:21, 1 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Leaning delete The images were all uploaded by the artist (user: "Otgo"). The promotion here is extreme (e.g. web url embedded in some images). The product we are presented with is so promotional that it is difficult to say he is notable by independent coverage; the same is true of the search results I saw: While I saw a couple good sources, I wonder if they are the result of promotion or press release churn. This is one of those cases where an artist's ceaseless promotional machine (and the socks mentioned above) work to discredit their notability by heaping doubt on sources. Possibly (talk) 07:53, 2 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Delete the article has four sources: http://www.artavenue.mn, http://www.bipchisinau.com, http://www.mongolian-art.de and https://www.suedkurier.de. Südkurier is a regional newspaper from Konstanz. Art Avenue is a Mongolian gallery guide that "partners with galleries, museums, foundations, and institutions". In other words, it is not an independent, reliable source. http://www.bipchisinau.com is the Bienala Internațională de Pictură, which is affiliated with the National Museum of Fine Arts, Chișinău where the subject won the Grand Prize, the article has a text by de:Martin Stather, an art historian. http://www.mongolian-art.de is operated by Ershuu and is neither independent nor reliable. He posts some articles from other sources though, and it might be possible to cite them properly. The artists fails to meet the GNG and WP:ARTIST with the current sourcing; there is no significant coverage in independent, reliable sources. I could be convinced that it does exist, but I have not found it myself. Vexations (talk) 13:32, 4 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]
- I found an additional source in Der Tagesspiegel: [1] Vexations (talk) 15:08, 4 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  - That's a good find; I should have looked for German sources too. The automated translation sounds very promotional but I don't speak German so can't know for sure. As Possibly noted above, Otgo has tried to promote their work very hard, but given the newspaper's prominence I think we can consider this article independent? Ovinus (talk) 15:28, 4 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]
    - Ovinus, I don't know what you're using to translate, but deepl's translation is quite good. The article is problematic; the writer is a freelancer, not staff, and it's basically a promo piece for an open studio event. It does not do what I'd want from independent art criticism; critically engage with the subject matter. I don't think it's independent; the article is mostly a retelling of what Ershuu told Rieger. Beyond talking to him, did she do her own research? I see no evidence of that. As an art critic friend of mine explained: Because he's well known in the art world, gallerists often come to talk to him and give him their sales pitch. So he says "Please let me work, and if I have questions, I'll come and ask". That is independent journalism. This, not so much. Vexations (talk) 16:03, 4 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]
      - Yeah I agree it's very promotional, but I didn't realize reputable newspapers post promo pieces like this. I'll be more vigilant in the future. Ovinus (talk) 16:34, 4 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.