Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Nello Mascia

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was snow keep‎. (non-admin closure) GSS ^💬 17:50, 16 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Nello Mascia[edit]

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The page has been tagged for six months as needing reliable sources, but nothing has been done. If we remove everything that is unsourced then there is nothing left. So either someone should improve it or it should be deleted. Ldm1954 (talk) 22:31, 9 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Actors and filmmakers-related deletion discussions. Ldm1954 (talk) 22:31, 9 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Speedy Keep.@Ldm1954: Just because there is a tag and an issue has been unaddressed (for 6 months!!!!) does not mean that an article needs to be deleted. I'll improve the page but may I ask you to withdraw this, please? He is a fairly notable Italian actor as a quick look at any database can confirm...So either someone should improve it or it should be deleted.. I am sorry but no: either he deserves an article or the page should be deleted. Afd is about deletion not cleanup. Again,I will improve the page, but that's not the point. Anyone nominating a page for deletion should look for sources before doing so. Which is apparently not the case here. Thanks.-My, oh my! (Mushy Yank) 23:18, 9 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
If you improve it then I will reverse my nomination, but not until then. Please note that I did a WP:AfD so it could be improved, not a WP:PROD. Ldm1954 (talk) 23:24, 9 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I said I would. ~~I am currently doing it.~~ I added some content and sources. But you SHOULD look for sources yourself before taking a page to Afd (or ProDding it, for that matter). Improvement of pages is not what Afds are for. Pages can be improved thanks to Afds but Afds are not meant for that. Anyway, see for yourself@Ldm1954: but this Afd should in my view be closed as Speedy Keep because you clearly have made no effort to even check if sources existed. At least from what I understand of your rationale and reply. -My, oh my! (Mushy Yank) 23:35, 9 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

And please note that If we remove everything that is unsourced then there is nothing left. was not even true. There was one source and NINE links to notable films in which he played (not to mention an IMDb page, which, although not considered reliable for notability should have given you an idea that you would have to dig a little bit further than a tag on the page before initiating this). You could at least have checked that, in my opinion, even if you didn't want to bother searching the internet, not even for a minute. Please have a look at the page now so that we can avoid wasting more time on this. Thanks.-My, oh my! (Mushy Yank) 01:03, 10 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Italy-related deletion discussions. Shellwood (talk) 23:23, 9 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Keep nominator has misunderstood the Articles for Deletion process. Geschichte (talk) 09:51, 10 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Geschichte, that was a completely inappropriate comment. The response by @Mushy Yank has been what was needed, improvement. However, the current version still contains a table with 15 films, only two of which have RS -- remember that Wikilinks are not considered reliable. If I was feeling nasty I would delete everything which has no sources, in which case... Ldm1954 (talk) 10:39, 10 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Please.....Just CLICK on the films that have an article here!!!!! Is the page without any source at all????? Thank you. If you think further improvements are needed, feel free, but you opened an AfD......this is NOT the article talk page and, from what you are saying, I am sorry, but I fully agree with Geschichte. Hence my Speedy Keep !vote.....no Before has been made and Afds are not for cleanup.....the page is a stub and this is not a GA review.... -My, oh my! (Mushy Yank) 10:50, 10 February 2024 (UTC).[reply]
You CANNOT use Wikipedia as a source, see Wikipedia is not a reliable source. Those links are considered irrelevant. Please look at Wikipedia:Proveit, the burden of proof is on the editor. I expect that you can validate that he was in those films, but until you do 95% of the article should be deleted. Ldm1954 (talk) 13:27, 10 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Sigh......... -My, oh my! (Mushy Yank) 14:23, 10 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@User:Ldm1954 Are you at least watching the page so that you can withdraw as you had said? Sources for every feature film have been added. Only did this to save other users' time. -My, oh my! (Mushy Yank) 21:13, 10 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, I saw the films (what about the role?). The TV needs the same attention. Ldm1954 (talk) 00:21, 11 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
You must be joking. This is not a GA review! So, let me try to give an outline of what is apparently the Afd process according to you. You see a page on an actor, with a BLP sources tag, and although the actor is said to have a considerable filmography and the page has a source, nine wikilinks and a link to Imdb, you don't open those and, without checking at all if there are other sources to verify if the actor is notable or not, you take the page to Afd. When the fact that he is fairly notable is brought to your attention, you say If you improve it then I will reverse my nomination, but although the page is vastly improved, you don't. Instead you say I expect that you can validate that he was in those films, concerning his (selected) feature films, but even though this second bizarre request is immediately fulfilled, you still don't withdraw. No, instead you demand the names of the characters he plays when a simple click gives you most of them; and sources for all of his tv roles, when some are presented and external links allow you to verify most of the rest. In the meantime, you repeatedly state that most of the content of the page needs to be deleted if unsourced. It has not occurred to you that the actor looks quite notable enough by now? No? And that this is the only point of this discussion. I have no further comments. So much for saving other people's time. I stand more than ever by my Speedy Keep !vote, and will not edit the article any further. You can do it if you wish. Keep up the good work! -My, oh my! (Mushy Yank) 09:01, 11 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Please reread the guidelines of material for a BLP:

"Wikipedia's sourcing policy, Verifiability, says that all quotations and any material challenged or likely to be challenged must be attributed to a reliable, published source using an inline citation; material not meeting this standard may be removed."

This is not my rule, this is standard and applies everywhere. Ldm1954 (talk) 09:19, 11 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
That is not the point of this Afd. Afds are for DELETION OF PAGES, not for cleanup. Remove everything you wish from the page. The point here is: is he notable? And why not withdraw as you had said? You can ask for improvements on the article TP, or improve the page yourself if that is what you wish. -My, oh my! (Mushy Yank) 09:27, 11 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Comment: WP:AFDISNOTCLEANUP. Somebodyidkfkdt (talk) 23:49, 11 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Speedy keep, I added a Corriere della Sera article about him, and searching for "Nello Mascia" there are over 900 articles on La Repubblica archives. WP:AFDISNOTCLEANUP, and WP:BEFORE was clearly ignored. The cleanup/referencing work the nominator is asking for could have been done by himself, easily. Some of his comments here look ridicolously inappropriate if not disruptive (eg. 'If I was feeling nasty...'). Competence is required. Cavarrone 08:28, 13 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Now Keep as the issues have largely been resolved, although he still has a loooong list of unsourced TV appearances. This compares to the original which had one RS (in Italian) that he was an actor/director in one play, and no other since Wikipedia is not a RS. Italian is not required.

Ldm1954 (talk) 09:13, 13 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Keep: Per above, deletion is not cleanup. The Herald (Benison) (talk) 07:22, 16 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.