Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Neenah Menasha

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was redirect to Rotting Piñata. (non-admin closure) Pamzeis (talk) 01:30, 21 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Neenah Menasha[edit]

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Fails WP:NSONG. Has been redirected twice to the obvious redirect target of Rotting Piñata, but the article creator has reverted both times, so there is no other option but to obtain a wider discussion. But there really doesn't appear to be any substantial discussion of this song. None of the sources verify that the song is named after two cities in Wisconsin, despite three of them being used as citations. The AllMusic entry is just a track listing, and most of the other sources are the usual user-generated databases. RiotFest isn't an RS, and the mention is a passing one in the context of the author urging readers to listen to the whole album. The Oakland Press also mentions the song only briefly in passing, and the claim in the Wikipedia article is misquoted – The Oakland Press doesn't say this was the track that impressed the record label, it says the sound of the band's songs such as this one impressed the label, which is a different thing. So there is nothing that makes this song stand out, and no in-depth reliable sources to create an article. Richard3120 (talk) 21:40, 13 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Albums and songs-related deletion discussions. Richard3120 (talk) 21:41, 13 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Music-related deletion discussions. Richard3120 (talk) 21:41, 13 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Redirect to album. I concur with the nominator's analysis. -- Whpq (talk) 21:52, 13 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I just added an additional reference to the song's page that is a more substantial discussion of the song. I also added a reference in regards to the the twin cities in Wisconsin, Neenah and Menasha, and moved the previous references to the correct sentence. The AllMusic entry is not just a "track listing", it has information regarding the song's release as a single along with a photo of the cover. Riot Fest has it's own Wikipedia page (since July 2012) and does appear to be an RS. In that article, the author urges readers to listen to the whole album but "particularly Neenah Menasha" as stated in the section's title, and then he describes details about the song's music video. I have also edited the sentence citing The Oakland Press and made it word-for-word with the source ("impressed with the big, full sound of tracks such as Neenah Menasha"). I would also like to point out that I've seen several pages for other comparable music singles on Wikipedia that don't cite any sources (or only one that is not an RS) that have been on Wikipedia for years. Regardless, I believe that the additional sources that I've added should suffice for it to be considered more substantial. -- T Yorke (talk) 06:46, 15 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Notability requires that the song has been the subject of significant coverage in multiple independent reliable sources. Nitpicking over "track listing" versus a track listing with a release date and a photo misses the point that neither represents significant coverage. AS for other articles, these other articles may or may not meet the requirements to be a standalone article but we are not discussing them here. I've provided a more detailed analysis of the sources as of this version of the article. I still stand by my original opinions. -- Whpq (talk) 13:47, 15 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Source	Independent?	Reliable?	Significant coverage?	Count source toward GNG?
Source assessment table: prepared by User:Whpq
Riotfest		? Riotfest is a music festival with no mention of editorial staff for its articles	The coverage of Neenah Menasha is a short blurb in a long list of songs	✘ No
Allmusic			Barebones database entry	✘ No
Discogs		Crowdsourced content	Barebones database entry	✘ No
Fox Cities Magazine			No mention of the song in the article	✘ No
Innocent Bystanders		It's a blog	Short blog entry with an even shorter amount about the song	✘ No
The Oakland Press			Passing mention	✘ No
Musicstax		? No indication how entries are created	Just another database entry	✘ No
IMDB		User edited site	barebones database entry	✘ No
Youtube video	This is the band's video		This isn't coverage about the song; it's the song itself	✘ No
This table may not be a final or consensus view; it may summarize developing consensus, or reflect assessments of a single editor. Created using {{source assess table}}.

Just to add to what Whpq says above, none of the sources added actually demonstrate that the song is notable – the link to AllMusic just proves it was a single, it has a track listing, and it has some cover art... that's not notable. The fact that RiotFest is famous enough to have an article doesn't mean it's considered reliable to be used as a source itself. The National Enquirer and InfoWars are well known enough to be written about, but they are not considered reliable enough to be used as sources for other articles – see WP:DEPSOURCES. The only thing the RiotFest author says about the video anyway is "There’s a lot of cutoff shorts and some goofy Thom Yorke-lite gyrating going on". The only source you've added that actually states the song was named after two cities is from a blog, not an RS, and in any case, why would this make the song notable? This still doesn't pass any of the criteria at WP:NSONG. If there are other articles that are in a worse state than this one, then that's a better argument to delete those articles, not keep this one. Richard3120 (talk) 14:21, 15 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Redirect to Rotting Piñata per WP:NSONGS and the well-explained reasoning by Richard3120 and Whpq. I couldn't agree more. Starcheerspeaksnewslostwars^{Talk to me} 18:53, 15 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Redirect to Rotting Piñata - The article's creator has tried valiantly, as the song did get a little bit of its own notice as a piece of the band's history, and its video was mentioned in the media a few times. But that stuff can be mentioned at the album's article, and as the other voters concluded above, it does not justify a separate song article. ☆ DOOMSDAYER520 (TALK|CONTRIBS) ☆ 21:51, 16 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Redirect to Rotting Piñata: Per analysis done by Richard3120 and Whpq. Barely found anything about the song. ASTIG😎 _{(ICE T • ICE CUBE)} 01:12, 19 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.