Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Mako (template engine)

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was no consensus‎. After a full month on AFD I'm not seeing a consensus here or any realistic prospect of one emerging. Stifle (talk) 08:45, 1 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Mako (template engine)[edit]

[Hide this box] New to Articles for deletion (AfD)? Read these primers!

(Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)

Fails to meet WP:GNG. DatGuy^Talk_Contribs 22:17, 1 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

keep - initially I was skeptical, but I think there's actual decent secondary source coverage. Its use in Pylons is especially notable. I don't believe use of a dependency in a major project is itself grounds for notability - or we'd have articles for all million of Webpack's, but templating engines are different since they are a major factor in the user experience of any web framework. (Yes this is WP:Other stuff exists, but) Jinja2 deservedly has an article for similar reasons. Besides Pylons I found several other sources discussing Mako, including:

StereoFolic (talk) 03:22, 3 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Keep I'll try to update the article some but beyond what's in the article now and StereoFolic found there's also the books The definitive guide to Pylons, Programming the Semantic Web, Python 2.6 text processing : beginner's guide, which all have significant coverage of Mako. Skynxnex (talk) 17:26, 3 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Computing and Software. Skynxnex (talk) 17:31, 3 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]
All the examples above are passing guides on how to use the library in the context of another library. There are no high quality sources dedicated to the topic like Ruby on Rails has, there is no in-depth analysis into its function like Webpack has (although the majority of Category:Programming tools may be a discussion for another day). There is no content backed by a high-quality secondary source in this article, and indeed nothing I've found that would provide that content. DatGuy^Talk_Contribs 18:55, 4 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I don't agree that sources here need to meet the level of depth of projects like Rails and Webpack. Those are vastly more complex projects, and there's simply much more to write and learn about them. Templating engines are necessarily pretty simple and almost always embedded in other software, but this does not make them non-notable. StereoFolic (talk) 21:16, 4 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Python 2.6 Text Processing devotes a full chapter to mako and although it's largely a howto, it also discusses mako itself. I think(?) that both https://turbogears.org/2.0/docs/main/Templates/Mako.html and The Hitchhiker's Guide to Python (Mako is well respected within the Python web community.) also contribute toward notability in that they support mako's place within the Python community, are generally reliable for programming topics, and are more than a trivial mention. I think that Python Interviews, although not contributing to notability very much since it's an interview, would give some more factual details to add to the article as well. I'm also happy I learned doing research for this that mako is/was fairly commonly used as a tool for help generate 3d model and other description files (see Google Scholar results.) Skynxnex (talk) 23:02, 7 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, _signed,Rosguill ^talk 16:07, 9 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Delete. From those books above, does it cover Mako in depth? They don't provide basic information, like who wrote the library or its history. They're just how-tos. An attempt to extract the information contained by them should be shot down under WP:NOTHOWTO. Being used in Pylons is WP:NOTINHERITED. I am unconvinced that the blogs and documentation pages are sufficient for GNG. SWinxy (talk) 18:20, 14 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Extraordinary Writ (talk) 03:23, 17 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Keep. Did an independent search for sources. SIGCOV in this Person book [1], including evaluation and comparison with Django templates. SIGCOV in this O'Reilly book [2], including some evaluation, and a comparison of syntax with python syntax. Here's a different O'Reilly book with SIGCOV [3], again including evaluation, pointing out some of the drawbacks, as well as a bit of background and comparison to Myghty. From these three sources alone we could write a start class article that explains some of the functionality provided, describes some strengths and drawbacks, compares it to other template engines, and provides some basic background, with zero how-to content. —siro χ o 04:32, 17 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]
And just to clarify, the subject meets WP:GNG —siro χ o 04:34, 17 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: I debated on closing this as no consensus or relisting and decided to relist, hoping that we can have a little more discussion to avoid a no consensus closure.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Dusti ^{*Let's talk!*} 11:12, 24 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.