Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Luis Acevedo Andrade

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was no consensus. Several ideas have surfaced in this AfD - someone suggested a merge, another suggested moving the article to make it about an event (his disappearance) rather than a biography. I encourage people to continue discussing these possibilities on the talk page. – filelakeshoe (t / c) 🐱 18:58, 1 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Luis Acevedo Andrade[edit]

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A WP:BEFORE check here turned up little in the way of references. This looks to be a rough translation of the same article on the Spanish Wikipedia, but I can't find much here or in Spanish, which I can read. Lack of sources seem to indicate he's not a notable subject - a mayor of a Chilean commune and a member of the Communist party, who disappeared. That's about the best I can find. Red Phoenix ^talk 00:04, 9 July 2019 (UTC)[reply]

It appears that the same editor has done both the English and the fa:لوئیس آسودو آندراده translations from es:Luis Acevedo Andrade, which does contain two pointers to memoriaviva (which is not the Brazilian pt:Memória Viva). Uncle G (talk) 00:31, 9 July 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Politicians-related deletion discussions. North America¹⁰⁰⁰ 01:21, 9 July 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Chile-related deletion discussions. North America¹⁰⁰⁰ 01:21, 9 July 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Keep. If he was leader (or even a leader) of the Communist Party of Chile then he's likely to be notable. -- Necrothesp (talk) 12:15, 10 July 2019 (UTC)[reply]
- Except there's no source to back that claim, to prove he even was. He wasn't "the" leader if the timeline on Communist Party of Chile is to be believed. There's a quick mention that says "Communist Party Leader" in one of the sources, but it goes on to call him a "member", and I also strongly believe that none of the sources used are reliable source. WP:GNG applies, especially if it can't be proven he meets WP:NPOL. Red Phoenix ^talk 13:50, 10 July 2019 (UTC)[reply]
keep. Yes I have translated this article to English and Persian and I think it's a worthy article to keep .thanks to Uncle G (talk) and Necrothesp (talk) , I'll try to find more sources. --SalmanZ (talk) 14:53, 10 July 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Delete, although I'm certainly willing to reconsider this if SalmanZ's promise to find better sources actually pans out with better sources. Leading a political party (if he really did that, which seems to be up for debate) would certainly be a valid potential notability claim if it were properly sourced, but it's not an instant notability freebie that exempts a person from actually having to have enough real media coverage to get over WP:GNG — but of the two sources here, the one that contains content about him is unreliable and the one that is reliable doesn't even mention his name at all, so we're batting zero for establishing that he would pass GNG. Bearcat (talk) 18:35, 10 July 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Comment Still remembered ([1],[2],[3]). There are dozens of online reports about the conviction of his murderers. 188.218.87.4 (talk) 07:24, 11 July 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks a lot for providing the above 3 links that were helpful. --SalmanZ (talk) 21:24, 16 July 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Just Chilling (talk) 00:37, 16 July 2019 (UTC)[reply]

I can see that SalmanZ has been hard at work at this. I have a great appreciation for that, and I see he's found sources from Chilean websites. I still have a lot of concerns. Below, I'll post a review of my reading of the sources used so far. To keep numbers consistent, I'm referring to this most recent diff as I review, and my numbers correspond to those in the diff. I'll also preface this by saying that yes, I can read Spanish and not just a machine translation:
- 1. 1 is sourced to Resumen, appears to be a Chilean website but it's hard to tell if it's a newspaper or something like that; I couldn't find a publishing company. About 1/2 a paragraph is about Luis Acevedo Andrade, and it's specific he was general secretary of the Communist Party of Coelemu, the small commune of which he was mayor. It says nothing about him being secretary of the whole Communist Party of Chile.
  2. 2 claims to be from the International Project of Human Rights, an organization that claims to be entirely self-funded. Website does not appear professional and my instincts tell me it's not a reliable source.
  3. 3 appears to be a book source, but there's little more than a 2-3 line blurb about the subject in it.
  4. 4 is a court case document, but the subject is just a line listing him as one of many people murdered.
  5. 5 is from an editorial website in Chile on social issues. Reads as a sort of reminiscence without really much in the way of factual information about the subject.
  6. 6, 7, and 8 are about the arrest of the captors decades later. 8 has some factual info but cites it from #2.
- Cannot view #9 because it's a blocked page in a Google Book but the book's certainly not about the subject himself.
  1. 10 I can't even see a mention of Acevedo Andrade.
If there is anything that could be kept here, a possibility might be a merge to Human rights in Chile or Human rights violations in Pinochet's Chile, since it's identified in these sources as a human rights issue - the trial is the best-sourced part with little about the person himself. That being said, I still don't think this establishes the notability of this particular person. Red Phoenix ^talk 03:15, 16 July 2019 (UTC)[reply]
- Thanks for your reviewing my work. This article is in the field of human rights. but as far as Notability is concerned, I believe there are more domestic, reliable sources for a mayor of a city like "Coelemu" that passes WP: NOTE. what we need is help from Chilean community to prove Luis Acevedo Andrade's Notability. --SalmanZ (talk) 21:35, 16 July 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Just for the record, mayors aren't routinely considered "inherently" notable. As a rule, only mayors of major cities (like Santiago or Valparaiso) are likely to be accepted as notable on their face — but in a place with a population of just 16,000, you would have to get the mayor over a much higher bar of reliable source coverage that expands into national or international media to make them notable enough. The problem is that what you're showing still isn't really notability-supporting reliable source coverage about Luis Acevedo Andrade — you're mostly showing primary sources and glancing namechecks of his existence in coverage of other things or people, not coverage about him. Bearcat (talk) 21:52, 17 July 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, – filelakeshoe (t / c) 🐱 09:02, 23 July 2019 (UTC)[reply]

~~Keep per above comments and references in article. Tuesday723 (talk) 12:16, 23 July 2019~~ — Tuesday723 (talk contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.
CU blocked, !vote stricken. – Levivich 16:36, 28 July 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Comment Thanks Tuesday723 (talk), Necrothesp (talk) and all the people in our community who will help to keep this article. what we need is help from the Chilean community to prove Luis Acevedo Andrade's Notability by some more sources. Regards. --SalmanZ (talk) 23:02, 23 July 2019 (UTC)[reply]
- We still need notability established. While the work has been good, we still don't have any sources here that actually help this article meet the GNG - the one article specifically about Acevedo Andrade (and it's more about his capture, not about him personally or his career) is not a reliable source, and everything else is a passing mention. As it stands, I still think a mention in Human rights violations in Pinochet's Chile is appropriate, but I do not agree with an article because notability is still not demonstrated. Red Phoenix ^talk 03:50, 28 July 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Weak Keep and move to Disappearance of Luis Acevedo Andrade. The relevant policy is WP:EVENTCRIT, and specifically WP:NCRIME, which says "As with other events, media coverage can confer notability on a high-profile criminal act, provided such coverage meets the above guidelines [depth and duration of coverage, and diversity of sources] and those regarding reliable sources. The disappearance of a person would fall under this guideline if law enforcement agencies deemed it likely to have been caused by criminal conduct, regardless of whether a perpetrator is identified or charged." The coverage of the arrest, charging and trials of the captors are certainly relevant to this policy. There seem to be three articles specifically about this (there are four listed in the references, but I note that "Three former Carabineros sentenced for illegal detention and kidnapping of former mayor ofCoelemu in 1974" is identical to "Condenan a tres ex carabineros por detención ilegal y secuestro de ex alcalde de Coelemu en 1974"). In a quick search, I found one other (Corte condenó a cuatro ex policías y dos civiles por desaparecidos en 1973 y 1974) which is about the court ruling on several disappearances, including this man. I'll see if I can find more. RebeccaGreen (talk) 02:51, 31 July 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks RebeccaGreen (talk) for trying to find effective sources for Luis Acevedo Andrade. --SalmanZ (talk) 22:25, 31 July 2019 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.