Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/List of Asian states by population growth rate

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. Alex Shih ^Talk 06:18, 25 August 2017 (UTC)[reply]

List of Asian states by population growth rate[edit]

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This page is redundant to List of countries by population growth rate. That list contains all countries, including Asian. If there is need to compare Asian states, a separate column ("continent") may be added to the List of countries by population growth rate. Vanjagenije (talk) 12:47, 31 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Lists-related deletion discussions. CAPTAIN RAJU^(T) 13:04, 31 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

I have copy/pasted the arguments I made when the page was marked for speedy deletion which was subsequently overruled by an administrator.

"The page that it has been tagged as duplicating is "ist of countries by population growth rate" (I assume you meant to tag list of countries by population growth rate). The aforementioned article not only doesn't get updated regularly, but more importantly, does not split countries up into their individual regions. To this end, the two main ways that this separate page adds value are:

1. The larger list gets updated infrequently because of the effort required to not only fill in the new growth rates but re-rank all the countries of the world. A smaller list not only takes less time but someone living in the particular region may be more motivated to update their region's demographic statistics.

2. People are often interested in comparing demographic statistics between neighbours or countries within the same region of the world on a timely basis. For example, if one were to compare population growth in the South East Asian Region, they may be muddled with countries from the Caribbean or Africa that share similar growth rates and not find such a large list as intuitive.

Finally, I was personally motivated to create this new list as I found the world aggregate list very cluttered. I find the new page a lot cleaner and aesthetically pleasing."

In response to new arguments posed by Vanjagenije, the suggestion made not only does nothing to address the update frequently problems in Point 1, but a new column for "continent" does nothing to provide clean, intuitive and timely accessibility to end users as well as adding to the clutter problems on the world aggregate page. In addition, the suggestion made is out of line with any current precedent of continent-specific lists, as a multitude of continent lists already exist for a wide variety of demographic and economic statistics. Finally, the suggestion would make it much harder to find this information through Wikipedia continent-specific categories.Maranello10 (talk) 13:23, 31 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Asia-related deletion discussions. North America¹⁰⁰⁰ 17:21, 31 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Geography-related deletion discussions. North America¹⁰⁰⁰ 17:21, 31 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, North America¹⁰⁰⁰ 01:32, 7 August 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Delete I have read carefully the position set out by Maranello10 but simply cannot agree with it. By this reckoning, we need a separate article, with less detail in but updated more frequently. What we'd then have is the main article potentially left or infrequently updated, thus creating a situation where one article may be up to date, whilst another is not, yet ultimately they both seek to offer the same fundamental data for the respective region. There is no guarantee a separate article would be updated frequently either, which is itself a problem of many articles on wikipedia, but the solution is not to effectively mark it as "out of date" and supercede it with one offering less. Besides, adding a region column into this article may be beneficial regardless, but I haven't seen a compelling argument to create and maintain the article in question; i'd consider changing my vote if I could be convinced otherwise. Bungle ^{(talk • contribs)} 13:41, 7 August 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Not Delete In response to the points raised by Bungle. Admittedly, I could have made it a bit clearer that the main reason a separate list adds value is not because of update frequency but that the aggregate list is cluttered; it has too many data points made worse by the inclusion of non-sovereign states and multiple periods and overall isn't suitable for those looking for region specific information. In response to the suggestion of adding a "region" column; it is not a practical solution as it would require a pivot table in order to sort by both "rank" and "region" at the same time. This adds a level of complexity to create, edit and for end users to use the list and infer information; notwithstanding the list becoming further cluttered and even less intuitive. The potential for improved frequency of updating is just an added advantage and yes, in isolation, I agree would not warrant an entire new article. Finally, I must stress again that "split articles" by region are very ubiquitous for economic and demographic data; deleting this article completely goes against the typical treatment of similar topics.Maranello10 (talk) 00:04, 8 August 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry but I am just not being convinced right now.. maybe others who choose to express an opinion will, but personally I can't see the justification which warrants having a separate article, offering basically the same, but less. A region column on the parent article could include the part of that region in parentheses (i.e.: Asia (South East)) which would be sortable collectively.

Maybe you should do a sandbox article of the main one (or a portion of it), with the above suggestion included to explain why you feel it'd not be appropriate. I also feel if we go down the separate articles for regions, it'd have to be done for every region and not just one - we would have to make the parent article redundant to avoid the issues I raised. Bungle ^{(talk • contribs)} 09:15, 8 August 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Keep - A non-trivial listing of broad import. Quite fascinating, actually. Sourced to American CIA figures, which means that governments are studying these things also... I'm not seeing a redundancy that makes deletion imperative — if anything the universal set of countries is so large as to be unwieldy. Carrite (talk) 17:04, 13 August 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Delete I think this is needless duplication of information from not only the main country list, but also from the Individual article such as SAARC and ASEAN. For example for ASEAN, a lot of content including population comparison is already there at Association of Southeast Asian Nations. There are many such groupings of countries and it is sometimes hard to define them. For example, it is debatable whether Afghanistan is South Asian or Central Asian. (SAARC includes it). This will only result in multiple scattered lists. Rather than creating another redundant article, it would be good to improve the existing ones.--DreamLinker (talk) 17:21, 13 August 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Delete. Splitting articles and lists can be useful when the parent article or list is becoming cluttered or the split is notable on its own (guidelines here). That is not the case here; the suggestion to add a "continent" column to List of countries by population growth rate is a concise and compact way to provide this list's functionality in the parent list. Malinaccier (talk) 18:56, 15 August 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, A Train^talk 20:00, 15 August 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Delete This content is covered sufficiently on List of countries by population growth rate. Power~enwiki (talk) 04:47, 17 August 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Final relist.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Jdcomix (talk) 15:06, 22 August 2017 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.