Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Joseph Ratzinger, Sr. (2nd nomination)

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. J04n(talk page) 23:13, 8 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Joseph Ratzinger, Sr.[edit]

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Delete, this is a case where we have an article that the subject is notable only through his sons. We do not have inherited notability or notability by proxy. As such this article fails to provide reliable sources for it's claims. I realize this isn't a BLP that requires sources or it's deleted but unless anyone can show how this man was notable other then being a father to a former pope it shouldn't be here. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 13:16, 1 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Delete as not noteworthy enough; per Wikipedia:NOTE. Kierzek (talk) 15:10, 1 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Comment There's another article Ratzinger family; they could be merged, or maybe both deleted/merged to the ex-pope's article. --Colapeninsula (talk) 15:58, 1 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Merge into an appropriate article on the family or to the main article on the Pope himself. -OberRanks (talk) 17:15, 1 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]
delete It's rather obvious that this is all the rather scanty material dredged up in not-especially-successful attempts to make a connection between the pope emeritus and the Nazis. What they found is that the pope's father was just a pious, "sternly anti-Nazi" (as the article puts it) policeman whose son became famous long, long after he died. This is material for a couple of sentences in the ex-pope's article(s), not substance enough of a man who plainly enjoys no independent notability whatsoever. Possibly it could be redirected to Early life of Pope Benedict XVI given that someone is sure to try to recreated it in defiance/ignorance of policy. Mangoe (talk) 17:17, 1 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]
delete, no individual notability. Notability is not inherited (and that means, not inherited backwards on somebody's father either.) Fut.Perf. ☼ 17:34, 1 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Delete - Notability is not inherited, this person has done nothing in his own right to warrant an article in an encyclopedia. The findings AfD #1 has no relevance to this discussion, for the record; it is hard to imagine a Wikipedia era where "Keep -- he's the popes' old man" was actually considered an acceptable argument. Tarc (talk) 17:56, 1 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]

comment See Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Ratzinger family above. Mangoe (talk) 18:11, 1 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Germany-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 00:17, 3 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of People-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 00:17, 3 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Comment I have serious concerns that "notability isn't inherited" is a bit idealistic and doesn't reflect reality. If you actually look at WP:NOTINHERITED it appears to have started as a "we sortof don't think this is a good argument to use" and then morphed into "this is policy" by means of WP:CREEP. The truth is that individuals connected to Highly notable individuals do acquire some notability (and especially academic interest) by association. The testament to this is that there are articles in the encyclopedia on these people in existence. (I could for example nominate Anne Hathaway (Shakespeare), to prove a WP:POINT). The deletion argument should that Pope Ben 16 isn't notable enough that a close relative of his would acquire notability. Barney the barney barney (talk) 20:58, 8 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]

I see your point but it also appears to me that the volume of material on Hathaway is quite a bit more extensive. Mangoe (talk) 21:08, 8 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for the understanding. Actually, I'm not sure that Herr Ratzinger here is necessarily notable. But, if we imagine articles as nodes (WP:BUILDTHEWEB) with incoming links at special:whatlinkshere/Joseph Ratzinger, Sr., people are unlikely to find it other than via Pope Ben 16 anyway, and I'm not sure a 300 word article with a dozen relevant links is necessarily entirely out of place, especially if a photo can be added, maybe a few more biographical details. The way it's reading at the moment seems to be an attempt to distance as much as possible Herr Ratzinger from the Nazi regime, which makes it awkwardly political, and I think there may be room for possible expansion on this theme. Barney the barney barney (talk) 22:08, 8 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.