Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Jamie Searle

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. Fenix down (talk) 23:02, 24 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Jamie Searle[edit]

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Searle has not played in a professional league, or represented his nation at either Olympics or Senior level. He's not an Olympic athlete if he does not compete at the Olympics. No guarantees he will be first choice goalkeeper for New Zealand. Fails WP:NFOOTY and WP:GNG. And yes, I have looked for sources online and found nothing that is enough for SIGCOV. Davidlofgren1996 (talk) 19:10, 17 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Sportspeople-related deletion discussions. Shellwood (talk) 19:12, 17 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Football-related deletion discussions. Shellwood (talk) 19:12, 17 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of New Zealand-related deletion discussions. Shellwood (talk) 19:12, 17 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Keep as I said at a concurrent AfD, there is no reason to have this discussion now. Wait and see what happens in the Olympics. LEPRICAVARK (talk) 19:14, 17 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Sure, let's go write some articles about wars which haven't happened yet. Then, if they don't happen, we can have them deleted afterwards. Ridiculous logic. Davidlofgren1996 (talk) 19:19, 17 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Well, we do have World War III. Phil Bridger (talk) 09:14, 18 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Is there any significant coverage of him anywhere? I searched but couldn't find any but I'm not too familiar with NZ news sources. Spiderone^{(Talk to Spider)} 20:51, 17 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Delete - Fails WP:GNG. The only article I could find that is potentially significant coverage was this one but it is behind a paywall and it alone is not enough. Also, it does not matter if he appears in a game in the Olympics as WP:ATHLETE clearly states that all subjects must meet GNG, regardless of whether they pass any sport-specific guideline such as WP:OLYMPICS. Alvaldi (talk) 21:59, 17 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Keep I've expanded the bio with a detailed write up from a local Bay of Plenty newspaper. It gives a rundown where he's played since he left high school, and given that he's played in England and Wales since leaving school, it's clear that there will be little that can be found about him in New Zealand newspapers. You'd have to look further in England and Wales. Schwede 66 23:17, 17 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you for providing these sources, I could only find the SunLive one myself, and that and the Birmingham Mail source on their own would not have been enough for GNG. The NZ Herald article is behind a paywall, but does look promising. I think the page may scrape by on GNG, depends on opinion. Davidlofgren1996 (talk) 09:03, 18 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Regarding the paywall article, the text is actually all in the page's source code. I've extracted it and it's linked from the article's talk page. Quite an interesting and detailed read. Schwede 66 22:32, 18 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Keep Association football isn't my area of expertise. However, as I understand it, the Premier2 league is professional. That's where Searle has played (see bio note on Swansea City website here [1]). This appears to satisfy criterion #2 of WP:NFOOTBALL. Others who understand this topic better will no doubt be able to confirm this, or provide a correction.Marshelec (talk) 01:01, 18 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Searle has just signed a contract with Swansea City, but I see no evidence that he has actually played for them. There are plenty of goalkeepers who are signed to clubs but never get a game, as most clubs usually put out first-choice goalkeepers unless they are injured, which happens less frequently than with outfield players. Phil Bridger (talk) 08:17, 18 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
@Marshelec: The Premier League 2 is not professional, as it is a youth competition. He does not pass NFOOTY, but may scrape by on GNG with the sources provided by User:Schwede66. Davidlofgren1996 (talk) 09:03, 18 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
This article may have been created prematurely, but, now that it exists, I see no harm in waiting a couple of weeks before nominating for deletion to see if he plays in the Olympics. Why such a hurry from either "side"? Phil Bridger (talk) 09:14, 18 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Normally I would agree with this, but I've seen numerous delete votes against articles I've created, where the players have actually made an appearance in a professional league, and are still playing in a professional league. (1, 2, 3 - and yes I know that in all three, the decision was keep, but that's because they actually played in professional games). Players who have not made pro appearances do not pass WP:NFOOTY. You could argue, for example, that Will Ferry should have a page created for him, because he plays for Southampton in a professional league, has even appeared on the bench for them, and has potential to play in a professional game of football. But this is all WP:CRYSTALBALL and WP:TOOSOON, which I thought we were supposed to be avoiding? Davidlofgren1996 (talk) 09:31, 18 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Passing WP:NFOOTY or WP:OLYMPICS is not automatic notability pass, regardless of whether the player has played 1 match or 100 matches in a professional league or the Olympics. The player always has to have the significant coverage to pass WP:GNG. I highly recommend reading the FAQ at the top of WP:ATHLETE, which both SNG's are a subsection of, where all this is made very clear. Alvaldi (talk) 10:10, 18 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
But if he does take part in the Olympics (something that I know nothing about the likelihood) then he will very likely get significant coverage off the back of it. Again I must ask the question, "why the hurry?", if notability is going to become clearer one way or the other in the next couple of weeks. This is an encyclopedia that exists for the long term. Phil Bridger (talk) 20:12, 18 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
It wouldn't change anything, Wikipedia is not a WP:CRYSTALBALL. There is no guarantee that him participating in the Olympics will result in any significant coverage about him. Alvaldi (talk) 21:03, 18 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in WikiProject Football's list of association football-related deletions. Giant Snowman 15:44, 18 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Keep as above, there's enough coverage out there to justify keeping, particularly given the Olympics call-up. Giant Snowman 15:45, 18 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Draft I would prefer the article be run from draft space, no guarantee he will play an Olympic game, if he does then he would qualify for an article. This still feels WP:CRYSTAL. Govvy (talk) 18:42, 18 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Keep will narrowly pass WP:GNG and further subject is 20 years with an ongoing career and has a Olympics call-up see little point deleting it now.Pharaoh of the Wizards (talk) 22:55, 18 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Keep As per others. Nexus000 (talk) 04:53, 19 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Keep they're a professional athlete with media coverage of themselves, and more references has been added to the article since it was nominated. Mathmo ^Talk 06:12, 19 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Keep passes GNG.--Ortizesp (talk) 06:12, 23 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.