Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Jahanshah Javid

This discussion was subject to a deletion review on 2024 February 6.
For an explanation of the process, see Wikipedia:Deletion review.

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete‎. Star Mississippi 01:25, 6 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Jahanshah Javid[edit]

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Non-notable journalist. Curb Safe Charmer (talk) 11:02, 8 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: People, Journalism, News media, and Iran. Curb Safe Charmer (talk) 11:02, 8 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Delete. Both of the article's references were written by the subject, and the subject has a history of editing the article. There are some other sources in existence (such as https://www.jstor.org/stable/20343473) but I do not believe they will add anything to the article. Redtree21 (talk) 11:15, 8 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete: Nothing discussing this individual that isn't a primary source. This is a brief mention [1], but nothing else for GNG found. Oaktree b (talk) 15:07, 8 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Comment: As others have said, the article presently relies entirely on primary sources directly or indirectly created by the subject. A search on Google News reveals two more sources which refer to the subject. One ([2]https://iranhumanrights.org/who_we_are/]) identifies the subject as a senior researcher for the Center for Human Rights in Iran and the other ([3]) briefly appears to mention the subject only by name as a signatory to a letter calling for opposition to Iran's nuclear policy. There might be a marginal case for notability if the subject's work as part of the Center could be identified but otherwise it does not seem as if there are adequate sources to meet the WP:N standard. Pseudoname1 (talk) 00:50, 10 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Keep several reliable sources have made him subject of their coverage. Sources are in Persian but reliable including BBC and Radio Farda: [4] [5] [6] --Drako (talk) 22:37, 11 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Sicaspi: the first two of those links are the same URL. All three are interviews with Javid, which don't count towards establishing notability. Curb Safe Charmer (talk) 09:31, 12 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Sorry about the error, here are more correct links: [7] [8] [9] iewse[10]. In all these sources and interviews, interviewer is independent of this person, is a professional journalist and these sources are highly prestigous and reliable media with editorial oversight. In all of them he himself is the subject, he is not being interviewed about some third-party subject. As per WP:INTERVIEWS, interviews can also be counted towards notability, it says interviews that "show a depth of preparation, such as those that include a biography. An interview presented as investigative journalism of the sort we associate with 60 Minutes can be helpful." The sources here are like that. Also, according to Radiofarda he has founded Iranian.com which is one of the oldest and (at the time) most popular Iranian websites [11]. That is also an example of the second item in WP:ANYBIO as he has had a significant contribution to Iranian and Persian internet history by founding one of the earliest Iranian websites. More evidence on that from the BBC [12]. Drako (talk) 21:06, 12 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Natg 19 (talk) 07:31, 15 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 08:45, 22 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Final relist.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, NotAGenious (talk) 14:02, 29 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Delete: neither the sources cited in the article nor those found by Pseudoname1 and by Sicaspi offer the SIGCOV we need to establish notability. Owen× ☎ 19:06, 29 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
All the sources I presented not only cover this person "directly and in detail", he is the main subject of their coverage and they exclusively cover him, which is above the standard in WP:SIGCOV . I do not know what you mean by insignificance of their coverage of this person. Drako (talk) 19:46, 29 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I don't see how this friendly interview can be seen as "covering this person directly and in detail". The entire interview is about the website, not the journalist. No hard-hitting questions or criticism by the interviewer; all slow-ball pitches straight to his bat. Yes, interviews can provide SIGCOV. This one does not. Owen× ☎ 20:08, 29 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
PBS is a reliable media platform, and is independent of this person. The required standard is for the interview to be deep and investigative which is what this interviews is, he is being asked specific questions about his work. Being friendly or hostile is not a requirement.

As per WP:ANYBIO :"a person who has made a widely recognized contribution that is part of the enduring historical record in a specific field" is notable. His widely recognized contribution is starting one of the most popular websites in a country, hence contributing to the Internet history there. If you agree that website is widely covered and recognized as such, that makes him notable.

Also, How about the multitude of other sources? BBC and Radio Farda are highly reputable sources (and independent from this man) that have covered his person in depth as mentioned in the above links. Even in their interviews, in these sources material you see is "interspersed with the interviewer's own secondary analysis and thoughts as mentioned in wp:interview#notability. Drako (talk) 19:04, 30 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Do you really consider the PBS interview to be "deep and investigative"? What exactly is the interviewer "investigating" there? You seem to be the only one here who considers it anything but a puff piece. Owen× ☎ 19:15, 30 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]
We are not here to judge interviews to be awarded Pulitzer prize. Sources should just meet a bare minimum. Also I do not get why you are stuck on this particular source. Almost ten other more thorough sources have been presented in this AfD, for example:
Radio Farda [13] goes in depth exploring the guy and his contribution, his website

BBC has dedicated an entire episode of the programme Chamedan to him [14], depicting details of his life.

First persian podcast [15], another BBC production, has made an entire exclusive programme on him and covered him [16]

Mahdi Falahati has hosted him on his Hard Talk style show on Voice of America and has done a thorough, deep and investigative interview with him [17]

Drako (talk) 17:50, 5 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Sorry, we will not be playing this game. You said, All the sources I presented not only cover this person 'directly and in detail', he is the main subject of their coverage and they exclusively cover him. And by All you were referring to all six of the sources you presented above. The PBS interview was one of those sources you presented, therefore sufficient as a counterexample to disprove your "All" claim. Your options at this point are either (1) show us how the PBS interview meets your description of "directly and in detail"; or (2) retract your original claim. If not all your sources provide the required significant coverage, please amend your original claim to state which of those sources are the ones you believe provide SIGCOV. WP:REFBOMBing and playing Whac-A-Mole by shifting your claim to a different source whenever one is challenged will not work here. Owen× ☎ 18:18, 5 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.