Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Conejo (rapper)

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. Vanamonde (talk) 07:20, 20 August 2018 (UTC)

Conejo (rapper)

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Conejo (rapper) (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log · Stats)

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A rapper; the only references I find are related to a manslaughter charge. power~enwiki (π, ν) 18:34, 12 August 2018 (UTC)

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Mexico-related deletion discussions. CAPTAIN RAJU^(T) 22:49, 12 August 2018 (UTC)

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Bands and musicians-related deletion discussions. CAPTAIN RAJU^(T) 22:49, 12 August 2018 (UTC)

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of California-related deletion discussions. CAPTAIN RAJU^(T) 22:49, 12 August 2018 (UTC)

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Actors and filmmakers-related deletion discussions. CAPTAIN RAJU^(T) 22:49, 12 August 2018 (UTC)

• Delete – I waited a few days to make a decision and find some sources, but most of them seem to be focused on his 2002 murder charge. This rapper is not notable enough for inclusion. MX (✉ • ✎) 15:37, 13 August 2018 (UTC)

• Do Not Delete – There is a reason that this page keeps getting reposted. The rapper is well known both in California, Brazil and Mexico. There is a distinct cultural eurocentrism to the manner in which this issue is treated. We are adding English content to Wikipedia for content that generates quite the buzz, within Youtube, Social Media and in underground hip hop media. This is again a very hostile (but implicit because of how it is couched in technical wikipedia terminology) attitude towards Chicano culture. 21:57, 14 August 2018 (UTC) Nyc media research (talk) NYC Media Research

• Not 100k, but 1 million views on music platforms -- The rapper is notorious in SoCal - just a bunch of white boys or dudes outside of the culture not really trying to see culture that has been existing. Go figure. These songs were played on Power 106, Los Angeles local hip hop station. You need to respect our culture by not interjecting when other people create historical memory. . TiemposDuros (talk) 01:57, 15 August 2018 (UTC) Tiempos Duros

• • Leave me out of it Tiempos Duros - Not trying to get into it with anyone over this in a racial sense. What I would like, though, is for the deletion process to not be so capricious, but I think the fleshed out citations will do well. Nyc media research (talk) 03:39, 15 August 2018 (UTC) Nyc media research

• Added References To Show The Shield Soundtrack power~enwiki

• There - I connected it with some mainstream content. Master P was on it - is that good enough? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Nyc media research (talk • contribs) 02:13, 15 August 2018 (UTC)

• Delete. Not disputing Conejo's contribution to the underground scene, and according to AllMusic, he has released several albums on labels distributed by EMI ([1]) which may indicate meeting point #5 of WP:MUSICBIO very weakly, but despite that I can't seem to find any non-trivial coverage in reliable sources that really show how he meets the guidelines for inclusion. I'm happy to be proved wrong, but for now I think he fails the general notability guideline. Sorry. — sparklism ^hey! 07:05, 15 August 2018 (UTC)

• Do Not Delete. The point about EMI's distribution deal does not service your argument. The point you don't wish to dispute is what actually makes him notable. The artist had a major distribution deal because of his real world notoriety; there is a large social media presence as a result and that actually led to the coverage in the Los Angeles area after the false accusations of murder. It would be a Hip Hop Police like story. For those outside of the hiphop scene, the story is actually notable because a task force is assigned to major hip hop artists on both sides of the country's hip hop scene: Los Angeles & New York. Thus, in the same way Mobb Deep had a task force on them, Conejo had a major task force placed on him because of his notoriety. Finally, the page has been placed up multiple times by different wikipedia editors if you look at the delete history. This should be yet another indication that different editors (with limited time) have argued in action for his notoriety. Thanks for replies, but no apologies needed. Don't need them f you feel sorry for having a different opinion, but what I am sharing is verifiable. Nyc media research (talk) 15:13, 15 August 2018 (UTC) Nyc media research

@Nyc media research: Which of the guidelines for inclusion at WP:MUSICBIO do you believe this artist meets, and where are the reliable sources that back that up? Thanks. — sparklism ^hey! 15:36, 15 August 2018 (UTC)

@Sparklism: Yo I can answer that one. Conejo (rapper) was on the radio all the time before he went independent! Power 106 , provided the theme music for the Shield and soundtrack .

RE: requirements WP:MUSICBIO SoCalKing (talk) Puro SoCalKing

• Do Not Delete . Mi voto es para eso - thats my 2 cents on the issue. If he wasnt big in Los Angeles (why would he have to blow up on USA today; is wikipedia just about reiterating whatever made a bunch of noise on the five news channels this country has or does well known stuff from a community count for all communities). Anyways ,check out their take, he's been known in the game. SoCalKing (talk) 17:53, 15 August 2018 (UTC) SoCalKing

Interesting. I doubt that unitedgangs.com qualifies as a reliable source. Artists do not need to "blow up on USA Today" in order to be included, but they do need to pass the guidelines set out at WP:MUSICBIO, which I (and others) don't believe that Conejo does.

I see this is your first edit to Wikipedia, SoCalKing, and I note that you're !vote here looks remarkably similar in style to the !vote by Nyc media research - you've even signed your comment in slightly the wrong way, just like NYCMR did too. I generally like to assume good faith, so I hope there isn't any socking going on here. — sparklism ^hey! 20:55, 15 August 2018 (UTC)

• Reply to Conejo talk page

These rappers are known and important which is why I joined up to write posts. Our bad if you dont like my copy paste. Dont got all day to post stuff up exactly how you like, Im just making my point. Understandable you guys are tripping off the culture not being documented by outlets you know, but at the same time you're also asking for too much hand holding when it comes to sourcing and defacto slant wikis to the major commercial outlets. While you may not like the subject matter, the issue of content experts is why unitedgangs.com and others qualify - theyre good on their lane of expertise. Youre focusing on one part, though, only. The guidelines for musicians WP:MUSICBIO state he needed to be played on the radio (he was) and he has the soundtrack contribution alongside the EMI distribution deal from like 1999 to about 2002. So keep focusing on flicking your nose on us "I doubt that unitedgangs.com qualifies as a reliable source", but he meets at least 3 of the points well:

Has been placed in rotation nationally by a major radio or music television network.

&

Has become one of the most prominent representatives of a notable style or the most prominent of the local scene of a city; note that the subject must still meet all ordinary Wikipedia standards, including verifiability.

&

Has performed music for a work of media that is notable, e.g., a theme for a network television show, performance in a television show or notable film, inclusion on a notable compilation album, etc. (But if this is the only claim, it is probably more appropriate to have a mention in the main article and redirect to that article. Read the policy and notability guideline on subjects notable only for one event, for further clarifications).

This is all validly satisfied, unless, you think Power 106's Pokos Pero Lokos segment somehow indicates they are puppets, or whatever, too. — SoCalKing ^{some bs.} 09:34, August 16 2018 (UTC)

@SoCalKing: Looking at each of these points individually:

• Has been placed in rotation nationally by a major radio or music television network

The point about placed in rotation is important here. Are there any sources that show that Conelo was placed in rotation on the radio? It's not the same as just getting your songs played a few times.

• Has become one of the most prominent representatives of a notable style or the most prominent of the local scene of a city; note that the subject must still meet all ordinary Wikipedia standards, including verifiability

The second part of that guideline is very important - the subject must still meet all ordinary Wikipedia standards, including verifiability. Where are the reliable sources that back up the claim that Conejo is a prominent representative of the scene? Finding a reliable source for this claim would really help.

• Has performed music for a work of media that is notable, e.g., a theme for a network television show, performance in a television show or notable film, inclusion on a notable compilation album, etc. (But if this is the only claim, it is probably more appropriate to have a mention in the main article and redirect to that article. Read the policy and notability guideline on subjects notable only for one event, for further clarifications)

You're talking here about his music being used in Music on The Shield and his inclusion on the album The Shield: Music from the Streets. Again, this is not backed up with sources, and the guideline states that "if this is the only claim, it is probably more appropriate to have a mention in the main article and redirect to that article".

You may be right to argue that there is a cultural bias on Wikipedia, but in the short term that doesn't change my view that Conejo does not quite meet the guidelines for inclusion. Finding sources to back up the above claims might change that. — sparklism ^hey! 07:49, 17 August 2018 (UTC)

@Sparklism:Yo, let me reply. This is Brendan Schaub giving you a basic summary of Conejo . As for the The Shield: Music from the Streets reference, here is one from a trustworthy conservative news outlet and its not the only way he meets those categories. Just way too much resistance on someone who by their very nature could not go on some corporate outlet and rep the style: they were on the run. Also, the rotation was from back in the day - how would we get those rotation lists for when Lets Ride was out, I mean that stuff wasn't as prevalent online and they've switched ownership and archiving multiple times. That track was on rotation for a short period, he would show up (as you can see from the Youtube clips) all the time to Power 106. It was a consequence part of his local notoriety in SoCal. Finally, the gangsunited.com is one such source that is aware of that style of music. -SoCalKing

• Comment see Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/Nyc media research. — sparklism ^hey! 07:44, 16 August 2018 (UTC)

References

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.