Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Cheshire Oaks Arena

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. Sandstein 10:56, 14 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Cheshire Oaks Arena[edit]

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The arena is just the main sports hall at the Ellesmere Port Sports Village. It isn't permanent and they just pull down the seats for the basketball, otherwise the hall is used for any other sport. This would be a viable redirect if the sports village article existed, but it does not. There are no refs in the article and nothing on google. The arena is the home to Cheshire Phoenix so they are another via redirect target. Szzuk (talk) 20:18, 29 November 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Basketball-related deletion discussions. Bakazaka (talk) 01:11, 30 November 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of England-related deletion discussions. Bakazaka (talk) 01:11, 30 November 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Keep The article says it's a multi-sports venue. I'm not sure why the seating arrangements would make the slightest difference in terms of notability. Smartyllama (talk) 14:39, 3 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

The multi sports venue is Ellesmere port sports village. This 'arena' exists for 12 matches per year x 4 hours per match = 48 hours per year. There are no refs for a reason. Szzuk (talk) 14:56, 3 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Keep I did the bare minimum of sourcing the article, but other sources exist which discuss the arena in context as well, so it passes WP:GNG. Also a quick look shows other venues with roll-out bleacher seats have articles, like smaller American college basketball arenas. SportingFlyer talk 08:51, 4 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I updated the article to reflect the fact it is a temporary arena, if we have to keep this it shouldn't be misleading. Also the refs you added don't support GNG, the first is a local website and the second doesn't mention the arena. Szzuk (talk) 10:12, 4 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

There's nothing wrong with local sources, there are other references such as [1] [2], and the arena isn't temporary. Many arenas have retractable seats in order to increase floor space when events aren't occurring. SportingFlyer talk 17:52, 4 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

The problem is that when the seats are retracted the venue is called Ellesmere Port Sports Village not Cheshire Oaks Arena. Your comment many arenas have retractable floor space when events aren't occurring implies the arena still exits when the seats are retracted - and it does not. After the last basketball match they retracted the seats and they played Badminton at Ellesmere Port Sports Village in that same space. Those refs don't support GNG. Ellesmere Port Sports Village is just the Leisure centre here [3] Szzuk (talk) 20:11, 4 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

It still exists, by whatever name. It's not uncommon for smaller venues to be located within a larger sports complex. Bender Arena is located within the American University Sports Complex building, which also includes a student recreation facility, a swimming pool, and several offices. Same with Burr Gymnasium. And those are just the ones in my immediate vicinity. There are plenty of others like that. In that case, the article reflects the situation, but nevertheless we have an article because those are notable topics. The layout of the arena or the building has absolutely no bearing on notability, though of course it should be mentioned in the article. Smartyllama (talk) 14:01, 6 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Please provide refs to demonstrate this venue satisfies Wp:n. A couple of local websites aren't enough. Szzuk (talk) 14:35, 6 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Sandstein 12:13, 7 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Keep. Much of the deletion rationale centres around the arena only being a small part of Ellesmere Port Sports Village. No rationale has been put forward that the latter is not notable. The obvious solution is to expand and move to that title. If none of the participants in this discussion feel like doing that right now, then just leave it as it is until another editor takes an interest; Wikipedia is a work in progress. SpinningSpark 12:23, 8 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

There are 6,000+ Leisure centres like Ellesmere Port Sports Village in the UK, very few have pages here on wp because they are just community gymnasiums and generally not notable. I can see this point hasn't come across. Szzuk (talk) 12:55, 8 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

But your nomination rationale wasn't notability. If it had been, I would have looked at that issue. SpinningSpark 13:26, 8 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.