Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Ayodeji Abass Aleshinloye

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. Secret ^account 23:07, 4 December 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Ayodeji Abass Aleshinloye[edit]

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The subject of this article is a local politician. The article is based on his own website with much of the narrative lifted in whole. EBY (talk) 03:00, 12 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Politicians-related deletion discussions. NorthAmerica¹⁰⁰⁰ 03:03, 12 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Authors-related deletion discussions. NorthAmerica¹⁰⁰⁰ 03:03, 12 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Nigeria-related deletion discussions. NorthAmerica¹⁰⁰⁰ 03:03, 12 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Keep: Subject meets the following criteria of WP:POLITICIAN.

criterion 1: "Politicians... who have held ... sub-national (statewide/provincewide) office...". He is the current chairman of a Local Government Area (Oluyole, Nigeria) in Nigeria.

criterion 2: "Major local political figures who have received significant press coverage.". He is well known in Oyo State as a grassroot developer and has received coverage in notable dailies like 1 and 2.

He has also authored a book that was well received here. Darreg (talk) 20:35, 18 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached.

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, —Tom Morris (talk) 07:30, 19 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Delete. There are 774 LGAs in Nigeria. They certainly do not count as states or provinces! That's what "statewide/provincewide office" means. It means someone who is a senior figure in a state or province of a federal country, not a smaller administrative unit. Nothing seems to mark him as anything more than a run-of-the-mill local politician. -- Necrothesp (talk) 14:59, 19 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]

When you consider the size and population of Nigeria, 774 is even too small. If the 774 LGAs are so insignificant, how come they all have Wiki articles? You can't give your interpretation of province as a guideline for deletion. Encarta dictionary defines province as an administrative region or division of a country. Nigerian political anatomy functions under Federalism. The only difference between states and local govts is that the latter makes up the former. Federal, States and LGA are clearly the administrative tiers of government in Nigeria, and are all fully individually empowered by the 3 arms of government in separation of powers. There is no governmental difference between Oluyole, Nigeria and Houston other than one having a better Wikipedia article. There are also 2 very notable references (Nigerian Tribune and City People Group) recently added to the lead of the article that discuss the politician in detail. There is simply no reason this article will not be kept! Darreg (talk) 20:37, 19 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Trust me, but there is! Precedent is that states and provinces mean first-level sub-divisions of a federal nation. This is because these are effectively sub-countries in their own right and have genuine legislatures and governments. Lesser sub-divisions are not and do not. That includes, for instance, British and American counties as well. As to whether LGAs are insignificant, I never said they were. It's also a Wikipedia consensus that all recognised settlements (even the smallest village) and higher political sub-divisions are notable by default. But that doesn't mean that everyone connected with their administration is. -- Necrothesp (talk) 21:28, 19 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]

You obviously know ~~nothing~~ little on how LGAs are designated and empowered in Nigeria. LGA's are a major sub-divisions with autonomous legislators, executives and judiciary. Most of the LGAs have between 30 - 200 towns/villages. Counties is equivalent to Nigerian towns/villages, which is a step lower than LGA's. Your argument would have been appropriate, if it were to be a city within an LGA (for example Agenebode). In reality, there is really no place like an LGA in Nigeria, it is actually a collection of many villages and towns, who have their own individual administrator called a "Councillor" represented in the secretariat of the LGA. I remember an LGA, I once visited in Edo State called Etsako East, that had at about 100 towns/villages with about 30 different languages between them. The natives in a village do not even know what LGA they belong to. Criterion 1 of WP:POLOUTCOMES clearly states that "Elected and appointed political figures...are generally regarded as notable...as are usually those at the major sub-national level...". Your personal conviction to Wikipedia definition of "sub-national" is ill-informed as regards Nigeria. LGA chairmen are normally elected quadrennial-ly along with the President and Governors and form an integral part of the State House of Assembly. I sincerely have nothing to gain or lose, whether or not this article is kept but I am quite certain that the Office of the LGA Chairman is a Wikipedia notable one. For the record, I think you are more of a Deletionist than an Inclusionist as regards the info on your userspace. Darreg (talk) 15:31, 20 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Comment - First of all, please do not make this debate personal. Personal attacks have absolutely no place in an AfD conversation nor, frankly, in Wikipedia. Second of all, 'the major subnational level' of Nigeria is "State" (plus 1 territory). LGA is a local designation - that is not under debate, the word 'local' is in it but more to the fact - they are subsets of states. While each LGA itself should have its own article with the current leader named, being the leader of any local government does not in itself lend the notability to meet WP:GNG. But "Major local political figures who have received significant press coverage" DO. SO, the question is then: does this particular subject meet GNG? Are there WP:RS to establish notability? There are many, many leaders of local governments in Wikipedia because those leaders meet GNG. Often, yes, because of the size & impact of that local government: Toronto, Berlin, Aleppo for example. Whether this particular subject meets that threshold is our debate. EBY (talk) 18:31, 20 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]

There is no personal attack here, I spoke of Deletionist and Inclusionist based on what he had on his userpage. You are the nominator of this article, give all your reasons in a single post and let others vote with their argument. Concerning sources, there is Nigerian Tribune 1, City People Group 2 and many others. I still insist that Local Government Area is a MAJOR subnational division in Nigeria and I do not expect you to understand that. Any other division below LGAs in Nigeria is NOT MAJOR.

Comment Your arguments about whether LGA's should be considered a 'major subnational level' would make great fodder for the Local government areas of Nigeria Talk Page, to get the LGA's reclassified IN THEIR ARTICLE as a 'major subnational level'. Editors will disagree but that does not mean they don't understand. It means they disagree. The article on Nigeria states that "Nigeria is divided into thirty-six states and one Federal Capital Territory, which are further sub-divided into 774 Local Government Areas(LGAs)" - this clearly puts the LGA's down one layer from the major subnational category of "State". For notability purposes, that layer matters.EBY (talk) 22:28, 20 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]

For the record, I am in no way a deletionist. But I would vote to delete any local politician anywhere at lower than state/province level. Think about it: sub-national refers to American states (50), Canadian provinces (10), Australian states (6), German states (16), Indian states (29), yes, and Nigerian states (36), etc. That's a bit different from the 774 LGAs! These are closer to British and American counties, which are also collections of towns and villages, usually several hundred of them in a British county (yes, counties have elected councillors and chairmen too - we don't have articles on them! Why do you think Nigeria should be different?). You say that LGA chairmen "form an integral part of the State House of Assembly". However, this gentleman does not appear to be a member of the Oyo State House of Assembly. -- Necrothesp (talk) 14:33, 26 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Keep: i believe the subject has met the criteria for notability. First, talking about Oluyole Local Government, it has a size and population bigger and even double some countries of the world. Therefore trying to see it as being insignificant will not be fair to the over 200,000 people living there. But that may not be the issue for discussion here, the major issue here is whether the subject has met the criteria for notability. According to WP:GNG i agree the subject has enjoyed significant coverage from reliable and secondary sources which include Nigerian Tribune </1 </2 Nigerian Tribune you will agree with me is one of the most reliable sources in the country</3

The newspaper is also independent of the subject.

The subject also distinguished himself from other chairmen by implementing environmentally friendly and people oriented programes in his local government and worthy of being awarded in that regard. </4

I agree with those who say the article should be kept.user:lagelu75 12:35, 21 November 2014(UTC)

Well of course, you created it; we would assume you support its retention. Noble and notable are not the same thing - the fact that he has done good things is irrelevant, unfortunately. Local coverage in local papers of a local politician doesn't do much to get us over the WP:GNG line. St★lwart¹¹¹ 23:50, 27 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Delete Subject fails on notability in several criteria. The LGA is not a major subdivision. --Mevagiss (talk) 14:41, 22 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]
Delete As I read this his positions have been appointed, not elected. In addition, his "jurisdiction" does not meet the qualifications of a notable political subdivision.131.118.229.17 (talk) 21:29, 25 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Can naive editors stop spewing this AFD with false claims???? How the fcuk can you possibly say he was not elected but appointed!!!! With such comment, it is clear you are totally in the dark as regards the Nigerian electoral process. I hope you know it is not compulsory to comment on all AFDs here. As for your second claim, I have said all I can say about it, am fed up with the bureaucratic approach on Wikipedia. Darreg (talk) 21:59, 25 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Darreg, the "false claims" are set out quite plainly in the article - "Governor Abiola Ajimobi appointed him as the Caretaker Chairman of Oluyole Local Government". It says nothing about his being elected. That might be wrong, but then the answer is to correct it, not to accuse people of "spewing ... false claims". It may well be that those who wrote the article are completely in the dark as regard the Nigerian electoral process, but that's not the fault of those commenting here. St★lwart¹¹¹ 23:54, 27 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached.

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Michig (talk) 09:52, 27 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Delete - as far as I'm concerned, claims against WP:NPOL are kind of irrelevant anyway. There are plenty of mayors, elected to lead municipalities, that have had articles deleted for failing WP:GNG. Per the policy itself - "People are likely to be notable if they meet any of the following standards [but] meeting one or more does not guarantee that a subject should be included" and "Just being an elected local official [...] does not guarantee notability". Where there is an issue with those criteria, we defer to WP:GNG anyway. A 200,000-person electoral region (regardless of what they call it) is not significantly bigger than municipalities in other countries where being an elected representative is no guarantee of notability. We have similar anomalies in Australia where State MPs representing 50,000 people are presumed notable but mayors of councils two, three or four times that large are not. St★lwart¹¹¹ 23:44, 27 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Delete: Subject of the article obviously fails WP:POLITICIAN. His achievement has nothing to do with meeting WP:POLITICIAN. Wikicology (talk) 10:47, 2 December 2014 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.