Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Akhter Munir Marwat

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was DELETE. Consensus to delete. As to the references added, they are either 404's, do not include mention of Akhter, or do not show his position as notable. WP:NOT an agency for adjudication tribal vendettas. Herostratus 17:38, 15 September 2006 (UTC)

Akhter Munir Marwat

Seriously not an Important Person. It seems like a self-projection. There are thousends of Government Servants like him in every country and providing pages for each of them will undermine Wikipedia's credibility. Jfksog 22:10, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

• Delete, no evidence from reliable sources that this individual meets WP:BIO. --Kinu ^t/_c 23:19, 4 September 2006 (UTC)
• Speedy Delete, pure vanity. Nigar 23:49, 4 September 2006 (UTC)
• Keep. The title "additional secretary" is probably equivalent to "associate deputy minister" in Canada or "undersecretary" in the United States federal government. -- TruthbringerToronto (Talk | contribs) 02:21, 5 September 2006 (UTC)
• Strong Delete, I know for sure that the title Additional Secretary is in no way equivalent to "associate deputy minister" or "undersecretary". An additional Secretary in Pakistan is just a middle level Bureaucrat in the Civil Bureaucracy and thats all. And just in Pakistan there are more than 250 people in the same scale working for the Federal Government. This can be checked from the official website of the Government of Pakistan at http://www.pakistan.gov.pk/. Marwatt 03:23, 5 September 2006 (UTC)
• Delete. Lack of reliable sources makes this unverifiable; content must be verifiable per policy. -AED 06:02, 5 September 2006 (UTC)
• Delete per WP:V. --Satori Son 12:54, 5 September 2006 (UTC)
• Keep. This article be kept, as this is Bio-Graphy of Senior, reknown and famous bureaucrat of Pakistan, who is also the son of very famous person. Beside this in Pakistan Addittional Secretary is more powerful then Senior Ministers, U/C. Beside this there are many many articles here on WP those relates to some unknown people. Here I also would like torequest you that don't follow what Marwatt and Nigar opinioned here. They both are personally and politically against to this person. I also have an evidence for this. If WP needs, I will surely provide them confidentially. They are keep on editing his name in artilce "MARWAT". But they don't hesitate in mentioning some unknown personalities there and some Bureaucrats who are Juniors to Additioanl Secretary. I don't think that they have right to ammend this site inany direction they need. I would like WP to remain nuteral as there policy. Marwatt (user) himself first ask me to create a seprate site for him but here his condemning the site. I don't would like such people to play with Credible and our-own WP. Thank you. — Preceding unsigned comment added by A M. Khan (talk • contribs) 17:55, 6 September 2006
• Comment. The article needs verifiable sources. --TruthbringerToronto (Talk | contribs) 18:04, 6 September 2006 (UTC)
• Comment OK I will bring truth here, tell me how to verify sources and how to satisfy WP? I assure you, if you give me a bit of time, aftre explaining the nature of required information, I will verify this by reliablesources.—The preceding unsigned comment was added by 203.175.64.10 (talk • contribs) 21:11, 6 September 2006 (UTC).
  • Comment: All of the concerns from above are addressed at WP:V, WP:RS, and WP:BIO. --Kinu ^t/_c 21:21, 6 September 2006 (UTC)
• Comment Being a Pakistani myself I would like A.M.Khan to consider withdrawing his stupid statement that a "Government Servant in Pakistan is more powerful than a senior minister". This article is pure vanity and nothing else. Being a son of a famous person as well as one of the thousand officers in the Civil Bureaucracy of Pakistan does not entitle that person to fame. What’s the contribution as per WP:BIO? --Marwatt 01:54, 7 September 2006 (UTC)
• Delete as per Kinu. What kind of reasoning is: The title "additional secretary" is probably equivalent? If any editor is not familiar with the content and context of the article, then they should not be so quick to comment on veracity of these articles. --Shuki 05:44, 7 September 2006 (UTC)
• 'Strong Request I would like to make a strong request for keeping this article. I will shortly place some useful information here. Beside this, there are many articles that related to induvidual who have nothing to do other then being on WP. Marwatt you must not oppose someone personally, you are against him, I can prvide proofs if demanded. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.175.64.10 (talk • contribs) 06:43, 7 September 2006

• Comment: The decision as to whether or not to delete this article will be made by an admin on September 9, so you have 2 days to provide "credible, third-party sources with a reputation for fact-checking and accuracy." Otherwise, the article does not meet the requirements of Wikipedia official policy, specifically Wikipedia:Verifiability. Please don't waste your time alleging bad faith on the part of one or two other editors; the only thing that matters here is verifiability of the article itself. Thank you. --Satori Son 13:03, 7 September 2006 (UTC)

Agree I agree with you Satori Son but you must know that personal enimity createdmany problems weith those two editors. When I have proofs, so nothing to worry about.

Anyhow, I am providing some refferencec about H.E Akhter Munir Marwat, as you demanded. I hope these refferences will solve the issue easily and the article be kept as it is.

• Sounds good - I'll try to check back and revise my opinion if warranted. Thanks again, Satori Son 19:11, 7 September 2006 (UTC)

• Refferences Added - Satori Son, you can now check the refferences, I tried to geta s many as I could, I will search some more, as am still trying my best to do so. Your positiveness shows sincerity with WP, that lead my Morals becoming high and produced an aim to work hard to work on this site. I would be glad if you could guide me about helping this site.

• 'Enormous plea; Keep it - I am a Ghazni Khel Marwat. Our tribe is having enimity with the tribe of Akhter Munir Marwat. But I still would like to make a plea to keep this article because he is famous man with extremely big-status in Pakistan's bureaucracy and materials provided in the article about him here are almost based upon truth. We should not call-in personal enimity here but we should respect the trues. Comeon end the enimity and spread love in Four day's lives

• Comment The article seems to include a fair share of hyperbole. Yes Mr. Marwat is a civil servant of some repute in Pakistan. Is he someone of enormous influence in the country? Hmm thats harder to say ..we'd probably have wikipedia flooded with loads of civil servants profiles if that was the case..yet (i am arguing with myself here) ..

DMG (district management group officers) in pakistan wileded enormous powers in the past and were essentially mini kings of their areas. I think more references are needed, has the man written any books? had any published work? been associated with any major development projects? besides that the article needs a bit of a rewrite ..it sounds like a press release in some parts. I would like it to stick around as long as it gets rewritten and is better referenced. --Zak 23:11, 9 September 2006 (UTC)

• Comments I would like to clear few thing, here, written in last two paragraphs.

1) Yes, he is really some one of enormous influency in Pakistan. Being on so many high-posts, first licenced private pilot of Pakistan, clearly proves that he is someone of high repute.

2) Zak demanded some refferences and also wr-writing of this article. Let me tell you that when ever new things are going to be added here in this article, I will surely add some refferences here, I promise. As far as re-writing is concernced, kindly, let me know what should be added and what should be deleted, thanks.

This artilce be remained here, as I provided the refferences, those were demanded by Satori Son, please.

• Comment. I usually don't do that but this is in defense of my vote to Delete. I am myself a Civil Servant and a member of the erstwhile “POWERFUL” DMG (District Management Group). There are more than 2400 Officers in this Cadre working all over the country and this is not the only Cadre in the Civil Bureaucracy of Pakistan. There are 12 other Groups which have their own Officers (their numbers running into thousands)[1]. Now turning towards this article, apparently this article on Mr. Akhtar Munir fails all the tests of WP:BIO. He has not written any notable books nor is he a recipient of national/international award. He hasn’t done a deed (association with a project of national importance) which should have been noticed in the national or international press. The supposition of the creator of this article that Mr. Akhtar Munir is the “First Licensed Commercial Pilot of Pakistan” is preposterous (seriously lacks credibility) because Pakistan came into being almost 59 years ago and I know for sure that Mr. Akhtar Munir is not the first person to obtain a Flying License. As a matter of fact a local son of the soil Mr. Qazi Sajjad (who unfortunately has no entry at Wikipedia) was the first man to achieve eminence for flying a glider (made entirely by him). This persistent love with flying earned Qazi Sajjad another distinction of being the first Civilian to teach at Risalpur’s Air Force Academy. My humble plea is that this article is nothing else but pure vanity and a self projection of a person whose only distinction is his ascendance to a senior middle level position in the civil bureaucracy of Pakistan but then so does thousand others. Should then they all be accommodated at Wikipedia? -- Marwatt 14:30, 10 September 2006 (UTC)
• Delete. As the article fails the tests of WP:V, WP:RS, and WP:BIO. -- Aiditor 15:01, 10 September 2006 (UTC)
• Aiditor Who are you an examiner? This is the job of Satori Son, the one you are doing, not yours!
  • Comment: Is there any legitimate reason why you think Aiditor's recommendation is not as valid as anyone else's? --Kinu ^t/_c 18:03, 10 September 2006 (UTC)
• Strong Request to Keep The Article Satori Son, you said you will finalise thearticle's status on 9th andtoday is 10th, where are you?

• Comment: I'm sorry, but you have misunderstood what I was trying to say. When I said, "The decision as to whether or not to delete this article will be made by an admin on September 9," I did not mean that admin would be me personally. I was just trying to be helpful and give you an approximate deadline for bringing the article up to standards. And my humble opinion is given no more weight in that decision than Aiditor's or anyone else's above. Again, sorry for the confusion. --Satori Son 18:14, 10 September 2006 (UTC)

• Yes I have a legitimate reason, concerning censuring Aiditor's remarks.

Anyhow, Satori Son, whatever it is, I am happy with it. Thanks

• Delete Unreferenced vanity article. ~ trialsanderrors 21:33, 14 September 2006 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.