Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Abdul the terrible

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete & redirect to Billy Sing. KTC (talk) 20:22, 18 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Abdul the terrible[edit]

(Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)

I do not see any sources cited. Barney the barney barney (talk) 14:23, 9 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Turkey-related deletion discussions. Rcsprinter (parlez) @ 21:43, 9 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of People-related deletion discussions. Rcsprinter (talk) @ 21:44, 9 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Redirect to Billy Sing. He's not independently notable. Deletion is also acceptable. NinjaRobotPirate (talk) 00:03, 10 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Comment appears to have been the top Turkish/German sniper at Gallipoli, a front known for sniping. Most sources in English deal with his duel against Billy Sing but that doesn't make him non-notable just because he lost. "Abdul the Terrible" is a nickname given by the Australians so we need to research non-English sources which doubtless have something to say about this hero, just as English-language sources say much about Bill Sing. Seems one sided, the winner gets a Good Article, the looser gets a redirect (at best). Both were known in their time for being top snipers, I'm a little suspicious of a winner take all version of notability. --Green Cardamom (talk) 01:25, 10 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

That would be an excellent argument if this were a history textbook, but it's Wikipedia. Unless someone shows that Abdul the Terrible is independently notable, it doesn't matter how we feel about the matter. According to several newspaper articles I found, Billy Sing himself was not notable until recently. With Billy Sing's newfound popularity, perhaps interest will follow Abdul the Terrible, as well. Until it does, there aren't enough reliable sources on him. As far as Turkish sources, there isn't much people on English Wikipedia can do about that. NinjaRobotPirate (talk) 19:29, 10 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Google Translate is your friend in AfD. His name translates as "Abdul korkunç". A google search shows few hits. This page[1] says "The real identity is not known with certainty." No apparent tradition of writing about him outside the Bill Sing incident so not independent notability confirmed (probably). -- Green Cardamom (talk) 07:05, 11 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Military-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 18:53, 10 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Comment The original article (although I hesitate to use that word to describe this) is bad. It would be good if there was some additional verification if only to avoid another König incident. Was Abdul real, or was he a composite of a number of Turkish and/or German marksmen? Intothat darkness 19:23, 10 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Delete, although I'd be ok with the redirect as well. Article can always be recreated if or when reliable sources appear. Intothat darkness 21:51, 10 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Delete The article has no sources in it at all.John Pack Lambert (talk) 04:13, 15 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Delete or redirect to Billy Sing. Not independently notable. jni (talk) 07:25, 16 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.