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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. Sourcing offered after the relists pushed the discussion towards keep. Xymmax So let it be written So let it be done 04:19, 11 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Travis Banks

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Travis Banks (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log | edits since nomination)
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Fails WP:SIGCOV. No signicant coverage nor reliable sources. scope_creepTalk 10:22, 12 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

All those are routine annoucements of work or scheduled work and don't constitute significant coverage for what a BLP. We will go through each and every one of them. The fact there are routine annoucement of wins or loses or annoucements of being out of contract is no different to the same kind of scheduled safety documentation that for example a rig work gets. It all routine annoucement. None of it secondary. scope_creepTalk 09:02, 13 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
These are secondary sources focusing on him, not routine like cagematch (which doesn't focus around him, just results of every wrestling event). He is a wrestler, so his work is to wrestle and many of the sources focuses on his work as wrestler, like an actor which work is to appear on movies and TV. Get a contract with the biggest promotion in the world, being released after sexual allegations against him and being contracted by other promotions after the incident while other wrestlers complain is notable, supported by reliable sources. --HHH Pedrigree (talk) 09:31, 13 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
WP:NACTOR is fairly specific and the definition as used by Afd in a rough consensus has tightened in the last few year. That doesn't seem to have happened with sports folks although there has an external update by the VP rfc. The routine coverage as evidenced by yourself, wouldn't be accepted at an actor Afd as WP:RS sources. They are true definition of what constitutes annoucements. They are not RS. It is a BLP. scope_creepTalk 11:06, 13 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
"Has had significant roles in multiple notable films, television shows, stage performances, or other productions", Banks has performed and won titles in WWE, PROGRESS, RevPro, IWRG, among others. All of them, notable promotions. Also, there is the speaking out allegations, which are covered in several sources. Sources provided, again, are not routine. --HHH Pedrigree (talk) 11:30, 13 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete - routine coverage, wouldn't class as notable in the case of referring to WP:NACTOR, as i cant see any notable significant honour. The sites referred to as "notable" above look like Pr articles for small wrestling leagues before his stint in the WWE. I could be wrong but from what i can see i'm not entirely sure it meets the requirements needed.
Melancholyhelper (talk) 11:26, 13 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz Read! Talk! 21:39, 19 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The editor above has a long history of adding unsourced content to wrestling articles and I now happily believe the editor doesn't care one way or the other about it. scope_creepTalk 23:59, 25 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz Read! Talk! 22:18, 26 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Keep Per reasons above and meets criteria in wp:PWBIO (specifically appearing in multiple NXT UK PPV’s). RF23 (talk) 20:47, 31 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment I forgot about this again. I will do it in the morning. I'll set it an alarm. scope_creepTalk 21:49, 31 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep. The thing with WP:SIGCOV is that a topic is "presumed" to be suitable for a stand-alone article or list when it has received significant coverage. Just because it doesn't have sig cov doesn't mean it isnt suitable for a stand-alone article. Besides the article in question passes WP:PWBIO, and WP:BEFORE should've been carried out before nomming the article. Lee Vilenski and HHH Pedrigree have argued some valid points on why this article should be a keep. GR86 (📱) 13:42, 2 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    "Just because it doesn't have sig cov doesn't mean it isnt suitable for a stand-alone article." I have to say, that's a first for me! What valid points? That he passes WP:NACTOR??? Also, there's no point going after the nominator - the nomination's valid and that's a clearly ad hominem argument. Best Alexandermcnabb (talk) 13:49, 2 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment A WP:BEFORE was done for this article, for the N th time. If the article doesn't meet WP:SIGCOV, which is another name for WP:GNG, then its not notable. Lastly an approach was made to an experienced editor in good standing, who is a sports expert and he said its perhaps borderline but he couldn't see much on it at all. If that expert had a said, he is definently worth keeping, then would have been no Afd. scope_creepTalk 15:13, 2 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment Lets look at the reference, starting with the blocks above, to tell the new audience why its notable. References need to significant (indepth), independent, reliable and ideally secondary.
    Ref 1 [20] This is a list of stories on Banks. The first one is 2 small paras, the second is routine annoucment, the third one is annoucement, the fourth is passing mentions and so on. They are profiles.
    Ref 2 [21] Small story about abusing his girlfriend and being dropped.
    Ref 3 [22] Is non-RS.
    Ref 4 [23] "Appears at ‘Big Lucha’ show in Mexico". Another routine annoucement.
    Ref 5 [24] Is non-RS.
    Ref 6 [25] "seven more announced for WWE UK tournament" Annoucement of matches taking place.
    Ref 7 [26] Out with injury. Not significant.
    Ref 8 [27]] Pretty decent match report.
    Ref 9 [28] Routine annoucement of being dropped. Same as ref 2.
    Ref 10 [29] Duplicate of above. "Appears at ‘Big Lucha’ show in Mexico". Another routine annoucement.
    Ref 11 [30] Three small paras. A routine annoucement.
    Ref 12 [31] Abusing his girlfriend story and being dropped.
    Ref 13 [32] Reports a statement by Banks. WP:SPS source.
    Ref 14 [33] Being dropped. Routine annoucement.
    Ref 15 [34] Annoucement of a match. 3 small paras.
    Ref 15 [35] Non-RS.

So looking at these sixteen reference that have been produce in response to the question is he notable. Of the 15. 3 are Non-RS, leaving 12. 3 are being dropped, which is taken from a press-release, leaving 9. Two are duplicated, routine annoucements appearing at ‘Big Lucha’, taken from a press-release, leaving 7. Three are 3 or 4 small paragraphs which are not significant, leaving 4. One is reporting an injury, leaving 3. One is list of small listicle articles, 1 is injury which is also a 4 small para article and 1 is fairly decent description of the match, but with no analysis.

All of these articles are churnalism and true WP:MILL listicle articles that constitute routine annoucements, being merely present and reporting that presence or lack of presence. None of them satisify WP:SECONDARY for what is a WP:BLP after all. Satisfying the criteria here, is as equally valid as if it was somebody like Obama. If the man is really notable, where is significant coverage. It's not in one of these 16 refs. When you see the same stuff recorded in multiple sites, then you know its driven by press-releases. If may be considered WP:SIGCOV by the quantity by fan folk, but the references are stonkingly bad. If they're odd bits of quality here, then fine. But they're isn't, they are atrocious and unacceptable in this day and age. Not one of them is valid. scope_creepTalk 15:54, 2 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Guerillero Parlez Moi 10:52, 3 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

here are some additional sources that establish notability. RF23 (talk) 13:58, 3 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

  • Keep Nice HTML people! A WP:BEFORE in proquest turns up these articles of SIGCOVand more in the Manawatu Standard about Travis Banks, among other sources. These are NOT WP:MILL. An Early life and education section could be developed from these.

1. Wrestler home to show skills RICHARDSON, Daniel.  Manawatu Standard; Palmerston North, New Zealand [Palmerston North, New Zealand]. 13 Aug 2009: 18. https://www.proquest.com/internationalnews1/docview/314387795

2. Travis has dreams of ring perfection RICHARDSON, Daniel.  Manawatu Standard; Palmerston North, New Zealand [Palmerston North, New Zealand]. 12 Aug 2010: 14.

https://www.proquest.com/internationalnews1/docview/744506774

3. Piledriving his dreams Kilmister, Sam.  Manawatu Standard; Palmerston North, New Zealand [Palmerston North, New Zealand]. 25 Mar 2017: 1.

https://www.proquest.com/internationalnews1/docview/1880506145

4. From Bulls to; Y; bodyslams Manawatu Standard; Palmerston North, New Zealand [Palmerston North, New Zealand]. 25 Mar 2017: WM.17. https://www.proquest.com/internationalnews1/docview/1880527946

5. Bulls wrestler taking on the UK's best Kilmister, Sam.  Manawatu Standard; Palmerston North, New Zealand [Palmerston North, New Zealand]. 03 June 2017: 3. https://www.proquest.com/internationalnews1/docview/1904940926

6. In this Wall Street Journal article about Spirit Airlines, Travis Banks is cited and quoted. C-Suite: Travel -- The Middle Seat: Furor over carry-on baggage fees --- Many in U.S. pay the surcharge because fares are low; even Ryanair hasn't gone that far McCartney, Scott.  Wall Street Journal, Europe; Brussels [Brussels]. 15 Oct 2010: 27.

https://www.proquest.com/europeannews/docview/758026025

While SIGCOV has already been established, 7. Wrestling stars join Download line-up Loughborough Echo; Loughborough (UK) [Loughborough (UK)]. 06 Mar 2019: 36. https://www.proquest.com /europeannews/docview/2188088056

Superstars Trent Seven, Walter, Rhea Ripley, Jordan Devlin, NXT UK Tag Team Champions The Grizzled Young Veterans, Travis Banks, Gallus and many more to be announced, will descend upon Download for a weekend of high flying manoeuvres, action-packed matches and unexpected surprises. NXT has made a massive impact at the festival in previous years, performing to capacity crowds throughout the weekend, featuring impressive debuts, shocking returns and exciting moments. Joining headliners Slipknot, Tool and Def Leppard and a host of acts already announced for the annual rock spectacle 

8. WWE star Travis Banks backs British Bulldog for Hall of Fame as campaign grows

Holloway, Henry.  Daily Star (Online); London (UK) [London (UK)]. 17 Jan 2019. https://www.proquest.com/europeannews/docview/2167997172 

WWE star Travis Banks has backed The British Bulldog to go into the Hall of Fame as the Daily Star Online campaign rolls on.

NXT UK wrestler Banks - known as the Kiwi Buzzsaw - hailed Davey Boy Smith as an “amazing” talent when asked about the WWE Hall of Fame bid by Daily Star Online. Banks said he fondly remembered his tag team matches alongside Dynamite Kid as the The British Bulldogs. Entire story in Manawatu Standard about Travis Banks: 9. Wrestling superstar heads back home July 8, 2019 | Manawatu Standard, The (Palmerston North, New Zealand) Author/Byline: JOHN WEEKES | Page: 002 | Section: NEWS Kleebis007 — Preceding undated comment added 05:25, 10 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

  • Keep. Unless I am misunderstanding how RS works in wrestling (which very well could be), it seems to me like RF23's additions (or at least three out of the four) add up to GNG, even without taking a close look at what was provided by Kleebis007. Arbitrarily0 (talk) 03:28, 11 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
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