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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. Arbitrarily0 (talk) 14:24, 11 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Stereotypes of French people[edit]

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Stereotypes of French people (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log)
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This is a low-quality article that is, presently, a brief list of vaguely-cited unencyclopedic views about French people with citations that rarely reach into actual discussions of stereotypes themselves and focus more on whether this purported stereotype is valid. I am unconvinced that this is notable, valuable, or encyclopedic. "Stereotypes of..." pages are something of a "bad edit magnet" in general, and I don't think this page has enough good edits to suggest that there is enough content to justify the existence of this page. It's had a "please improve" tag since last November, with no substantial improvements, and the content (and content quality) of the article appear similar throughout the article's life. Kistaro Windrider (talk) 17:56, 23 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Discrimination-related deletion discussions. Kistaro Windrider (talk) 17:56, 23 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Popular culture-related deletion discussions. Kistaro Windrider (talk) 17:56, 23 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Social science-related deletion discussions. Kistaro Windrider (talk) 17:56, 23 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Note: This discussion has been included in the list of France-related deletion discussions. Kistaro Windrider (talk) 17:56, 23 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
@Lugnuts: Please see WP:AFDEQ. Thank you. Paul Vaurie (talk) 23:47, 1 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • I think my argument was more along the lines of the two articles being duplicative and not seeing any reason not to merge. Your argument seems to be WP:ILIKEIT. GNG is really not a relevant rebuttal to this nomination. ‡ Єl Cid of Valencia talk 12:32, 24 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • I was addressing the nomination, specifically the statement "I am unconvinced that this is notable, valuable, or encyclopaedic", not your comment. I was making the point (albeit briefly) that the subject, Stereotypes of French people has significant coverage in independent, reliable, secondary sources, as cited in the article and therefore should not be deleted. Since you have raised your point with me, it should not be re-directed or merged for two reasons 1) the topic is independently notable (see here, here, and here) 2) French stereotypes do not have to have their origins in anti-French sentiment, such as the stereotypes related to romance and sexuality (see here). SailingInABathTub (talk) 13:41, 24 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Sandstein 15:33, 3 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Redirect to Anti-French sentiment, selective merging, does not need to be a separate (thin) article. CommanderWaterford (talk) 16:52, 3 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep The article is very poorly written as others have pointed out, but it's definitely fixable. As for notability, the topic is definitely notable, a google search brings up tons of results. I don't think it should be merged to the Anti-French sentiment article as it has received plenty of coverage on its own, and many stereotypes are of a comedic tone and not actually anti-French in nature. Pladica (talk) 02:13, 4 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Merge and redirect. Nominator. I'm ambivalent on what it should be redirected to, but I'm not persuaded this article is valuable. I could easily just not be imaginative enough to see what it could be if it was written well, though; I'd like to hear what folks who think "needs fixing, but keep" is the correct strategy think, vaguely, the article should look like after it's fixed. What presents the topic in a valuable way that isn't the current "list of stuff that just kind of exists"? It'd be a lot more interesting if this had history and cultural context, and I can see the value in a "Stereotypes of..." article in that context. But I don't see any reason to believe that this will ever become that article. I feel bad discussing the article I'd like to see and then not volunteering to write it, but I don't think of myself as good at, well, writing articles. Kistaro Windrider (talk) 03:22, 4 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep by gar. It is not the same as anti-French sentiment. Zut alors! Some stereotypes are quite flattering, e.g. great lovers, connoisseurs, suave, etc., n'est pas? Afd is not for cleanup. Clarityfiend (talk) 05:12, 4 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep per our policy WP:ATD, "If editing can improve the page, this should be done rather than deleting the page." There are numerous more sources available for this such as Of Stereotypes and of the French. Andrew🐉(talk) 21:39, 4 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Weak keep. A quick look at GScholar suggest the concept is discussed in scholarly works. There is likely more in French language. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 03:25, 6 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • If the current title is retained, then it should Redirect to Anti-French sentiment. There is a disconnect between the title, which is neutral, and current content, which is negative. Other stereotypes off the top of my head are: one of the world's top cuisines, high fashion, luxury branding, classic cinema and New Wave, film stars, world standard for wines, fashionably-dressed women, a vibrant night life, famous artists and museums, the standard for flirtation and seduction, public veneration and interest in intellectual currents, the birth of second-wave feminism and a vibrant feminist scene, a welcoming environment for American blacks discriminated against at home, the French Riviera, world-level engineering in high speed trains, fighter jets, jumbo aircraft, and aerospace; and so on. If the article is kept, either the title or the content has to change, because per WP:AT, "The title indicates what the article is about and distinguishes it from other articles," and currently the article fails that policy. Mathglot (talk) 06:51, 7 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep - well-sourced and whole books and libraries of articles have been written about it. Adieu! Bearian (talk) 16:08, 10 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep: I think the topic is notable without even looking and looking at sources in the article show this. I don't think this article should be merged or redirected to Anti-French sentiment, sentiment and stereotypes are two different things (eg: there are "positive" sterotypes such as in the High Fashion and romance sections, but anti-sentiment would obviously always be negative). The article defintely needs to be expanded  // Timothy :: talk  03:22, 11 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
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