User talk:Fenix down/Archive 2

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Talkback

Hello, Fenix down. You have new messages at SGGH's talk page.
Message added 12:18, 21 May 2010 (UTC). You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

SGGH ping! 12:18, 21 May 2010 (UTC)

Worcester Royals Page

Hey Fenix down. I am the creator of the Worcester Royals page and I was planning on making a copy of all the text on the page prior to its deletion however I didn't manage to get it all done. In one of your posts on my talk page you mention that the page isn't gone for ever and I assume this means that it is archived for further use. Do you, or could you find the archive folder so I can copy the text to put on a Website we are trying to start up for the team. Many thanks Stuart699 Stuart699 (talk) 15:26, 4 June 2010 (UTC)

ANI discussion

I am placing this notice because you initiated the prior discussion on this user. You may wish to contribute to the new discussion. I am simply inviting you to participate. I am not seeking to influence any content of your contribution. Fiddle Faddle (talk) 17:23, 21 June 2010 (UTC)

Mistaken tags

Thanks I'll fix them. —Justin (koavf)❤T☮C☺M☯ 14:30, 7 November 2010 (UTC)

Villages and relocations

Glad to see your work on the native villages. In this regard, you should definitely take a look at

Also, in Providensky Districtyou give a Chukchi meaning for Kivak, but the form of the name appears Yupik. Is it a cognate or is there a Chukchi name for the village that has fallen through the cracks?

Regards, Dankarl (talk) 15:59, 12 March 2012 (UTC)

One step ahead of you! I got a copy of all the articles for that journal as they are free! There is a very interesting one on religious behaviour in Naukan. Going through the sources I have one by one to expand these. Am going to address Chukotsky District soon too, and was actually drawing up a rough flow diagram to illustrate the migration of people from over twenty villages into just four extant ones today when you sent me the message.
If you have access to Google Earth, you may be interested in this which provides a plugin that shows all the abandoned villages and camps, often with photos and brief notes too. I am also going to make use of thisresource of free books dealing with archeological investigations in Chukotka.
Best wishes, Fenix down (talk) 17:02, 12 March 2012 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for March 13

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Hello

Hey mate. This is Arsenalkid700 (talk · contribs) and dont worry, I will only use this account to talk to you and then I will serve my month suspension. Anyway I saw what you said to Wilkins. I think you have me wrong. I did do more than just revert. I said on here that I needed help. I even requested that the page be blocked here. So while you did call me a troll I would like to inform you that I am not. Please check my contributions (on my Arsenalkid700 account) [[1]] and you will see that I am not a troll and never was. My main intention on wikipedia is to edit pages pertaining to Indian Football (Soccer) and that still remains my goal. Now I am done, ready for my vacation from wikipedia. If you want to continue this then you can continue the conversation here and I will reply. Other than replying to you I will not use this account. Cheers. --IndianFootballPlayersWiki (talk) 21:27, 15 June 2012 (UTC)

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Te Atatu Squad

I have not placed the Squad on wikipedia, I think that someone of the club or a supporter of Te Atatu that information on has done. I now that play Alefaio for this club, because its former coach has that our told us. We Dutch Support Tuvalu cooperate with the football association of Tuvalu, and know that. But you the club himself are able mail or this information really is correct. --Klant01 (talk) 13:17, 30 June 2012 (UTC)

By the way

By the way, going back to last month. I was not being a troll. Yes I did forget our agreement that if I see that editor again I should report it and yes I went overboard once but that does not make me a troll. Anyway I have been back for half a month and I would like to keep it that way. Yes maybe I was wrong with obviously maybe I should have looked at google but those are mistakes and they happen. Just wanted to clear that up. --Arsenalkid700 (talk) 09:50, 1 August 2012 (UTC)

Chukotka

Hi Fenix down, I wanted to ask you how you got interested to Chukotka. Have you ever been there? Or have you been fascinated by what you could read about it on books (maybe Rytkheu?)/the internet? I'm curious, because I've got your same main range, but on the Italian wikipedia :). I'm not as effective as you are, due to school taking much of my time. I hope you can answer me soon. Thank you, --Agantacroxi (talk) 10:26, 4 September 2012 (UTC)

Hi Agantacroxi, good to here that there is someone else interested in Chukotka here! Ihave long been interested in places that are remote and cold and Chukotka is about as far away as you can get before you start coming back on yourself. I was looking for some information on Mys Shmidta and there wasn't an article, so that's how I got started. Then I found there was very little other than cursory articles on Anadyr, Pevek and Bilibino so I figured I would do something about it.
I have actually also been to Chukotka last summer and went to Anadyr, Cape Dezhnev, Wrangel Island, Herald Island and Kolyuchin Bay. There are some photos here if you are interested that I took which I have been meaning to upload to Commons to add to some articles:
Panoramio Photos
I have got a copy of A Dream in Polar fog, but I am more interested in the historical side of things, particularly Soviet expansion in the north. Some books I have read which I have found pretty interesting that you might like are:
I also use Google Scholar quite a lot as there is a surprising amount of free access journal articles on Chukotka's people and history if you just type in various settlement names. I have got loads of stuff, some on villages that don't even exist any more to update and create articles, it's just finding the time to get it all done!
One other thing, if you use Google Earth, you may be interested in this link to a kmz file. This maps all of the closed villages around the east coast and the north coast as far as Kolyuchin Bay.
Feel free to help out with any of the articles here as well as on the Italian Wiki and let me know if you need any clarification on bits I have written. Fenix down (talk) 12:08, 6 September 2012 (UTC)
I'm glad you answered me! Thank you a lot for the links, I will read those books when I have some time. Your description of how you got interested in this remote, but wonderful region is exactly the same for me. However, I'm more interested in the enthno-linguistic side of the region, meaning Chukchi and other native population's culture and language. Rytcheu's books describe very well how they live. Sadly, I can't fly there on my own (I'm 14). I wouldn't find someone around here who would come with me, anyway, so I have to wait a bit until I can finally go there.
Maybe you could find this link I found interesting: This is a very interesting description of the Chukchi language, which I'm planning to include in wikipedia.
I've actually already started with the translation of your articles into Italian, beginning from the it:Lorino page. I will go on doing this in the next weeks.
Thank you a lot :), --Agantacroxi (talk) 19:58, 6 September 2012 (UTC)

September 2012

Hello, I'm GiantSnowman. I noticed that you recently made an edit to Rudi Gutendorf that seemed to be a test. Your test worked! If you want more practice editing, the sandbox is the best place to do so. If you think I made a mistake, or if you have any questions, you can leave me a message on my talk page. Thank you. GiantSnowman 16:55, 18 September 2012 (UTC)

Sorry, a misclick with one of the gadgets I have just enabled, my connection here is so slow that I didn't have time to go back and correct it! Fenix down (talk) 16:59, 18 September 2012 (UTC)
No worries, ho harm done! GiantSnowman 17:31, 18 September 2012 (UTC)

Reverting

Please take care when reverting another editor's edits: here you removed a tag corresponding to your edit summary of "unnecessary tag", but also removed {{stub}} which had been correctly added. PamD 21:43, 19 September 2012 (UTC)

sorry this user had been adding a lot of unnecessary tags which i was correcting, didnt notice that this included a relevant tag in this instance. i will be more careful in future. thanks for the heads up. Fenix down (talk) 22:45, 19 September 2012 (UTC)

Christian Storm

Hi Fenix, I hope this is the correct place in which to talk to you. You have recently flagged an article I put up about a Choreographer, Christian Storm for deletion. How can I prevent this? There are many choreogaphers on wikipedia which have not seen deletion. Can you please let me know how I can improve it so it stays? Thanks. The article is at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_Storm. Thank you. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Kurt K Hahn (talk • contribs) 11:33, 20 September 2012 (UTC)

You should look to establish notability along the lines of WP:ENT or WP:CREATIVE, however at the moment, the article doesn't indicate this person has done anything of note, one role in a musical, one music video, one fashion show party and some nebulous involvement in the Voice hardly establish notability. I think that you would need to establish a much greater body of work and reference this thoroughly for the article to stay. That said, the listing is to start discussion and is no guarantee it will be deleted.
In addition, the article has only one reference which is a primary source, so doesn't count. Read WP:BIO for more information. Really, the article as it is could be speedily deleted as it is essentially unreferenced.
Finally, you need to consider style, the whole section on "The Movement" is in its current form, essentially little more than an advert, see WP:SOAP for more information. Fenix down (talk) 11:50, 20 September 2012 (UTC)
Thank you for the feedback. There was initially a lot more content and references but these were taken away. I will do what I can to emulate other choreographer pages to ensure the tone is neutral and there are more proper references. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 109.231.201.34 (talk) 14:20, 21 September 2012 (UTC)
No problem, although I do agree with the comments of the person who stripped out a lot of the article, most of that isn't really encyclopaedic. the important thing to consider is what have other people been saying or writing about someone. an individual could have in someone's opinion accomplished a lot but if no one has written about it then they will not be considered to have met WP:GNG.
Please also remember to sign your responses with the four tildas. Fenix down (talk) 14:29, 21 September 2012 (UTC)
Hi Fenix,
I have rewritten the article to sound a lot more neutral, with no peakcock language or anything that sounds like an advert.
While it is true the the external links are primary sources, they contain all of the information needed to put together the article with his work. I have looked at other choreographer pages and have emulated their format and presentation as closely as possible and hope that this is more in line with wikipedia. All of the information can be checked via the external links which will outline work he has been involved with and will hopefully make things less nebulous. I will be undertaking an ongoing effort to find more specific, secondary sources for works he has been involved in.
I will be also getting a photo (with permission from the individual) to further legitimise the article.
I look forward to your feedback.
Kurt K Hahn (talk) 16:18, 26 September 2012 (UTC)
Unfortunately, I have had to revert your edit as it removed the AfD notification template (which is stated when you open the edit window in the text to not be removed until the debate is concluded. In addition, the article in its current state is now completely unreffed. All biographies that have no references run the risk of being speedily deleted. To rework the article you need to provide references from secondary sources. The external links to primary sources are fine, but they do not confer notability because they are self-authored. If you wish to rework the article, then please try to find secondary sources, such as newspaper / magazine articles to support the notability of the individual. Fenix down (talk) 16:27, 26 September 2012 (UTC)
Hi Fenix,
Sorry about that! Still learning how to do wikipedia articles, I did not remove the notice on purpose - I was working off a word-doc and simply copy pasted the content in and didnt realise. I have now put the changes back in with the notice and am actively seeking out secondary sources. I am unsure I will be able to find secondary sources for every single thing but will try to find as many as possible. Does this mean that anything without a secondary source is no good and will have to go?
Thank you for your patience and guidance.
Kurt K Hahn (talk) 08:13, 27 September 2012 (UTC)
That's Ok, we're all still learning! I only reverted to keep the tag rather than to get rid of the article. I don't think it is necessary to find secondary sources for each point, there are tags that can be added if someone feels more refs are needed but that doesn't mean an article would be deleted, although it is acceptable for someone to delete any unsourced biographical information. I would concentrate on finding as many secondary sources as possible. I would suggest national papers / magazines would be best, or really big websites (not just blogs). Also try to avoid using just a single source where possible as it can raise questions over notability. Fenix down (talk) 08:44, 27 September 2012 (UTC)

Uelen - Deshnevo trail or road

Historically there was a dogsled trail across the neck of land joining the Cape Dezhnev headland to the mainland, the trail running from Deshnevo to Uelen. This is specifically mentioned in Rasmusson and is implicit elsewhere. I have found no modern mention of the trail or a successor road, but have not looked very hard. The existence of such a road is implied by the use of Deshnevo as a harbor when Uelen is stormbound. Regards, Dankarl (talk) 00:40, 11 October 2012 (UTC)

Hi Dankarl, I would agree that there are tracks and regularly used pathways connecting not just Uelen and Dezhnyovo, but many other settlements and camps. However, I personally don't count them as they are not official roads and in this instance, as Dezhnyovo has been abandoned since the 50s and is now only used as a fishing camp, I would not classify it as a place from a Wikipedia standpoint. You do however, raise a decent point, perhaps I should clarify the roads as "permanant"? Fenix down (talk) 09:45, 11 October 2012 (UTC)
Could be a solution. Or "official" if that is your actual criterion. I think what distinguishes the Deshnevo trail is that it was a well established route in both historic and pre-historic times; see for instance Krauss, Michael E. (2005) Eskimo languages in Asia, 1791 on, and the Wrangel Island-Point Hope connection Études/Inuit/Studies, vol. 29 (1-2), 2005, pp 163-185, where it accounts for the continuity of Eskimo language north and south of the cape, with Naukanskii separate and distinct. Dankarl (talk) 13:05, 11 October 2012 (UTC)

Xavier Vijay Kumar

I added two refs to this page. One of them shows he played in I-League. However I have kept the PROD in case you think the article still fails WP:GNG. --Arsenalkid700 (talk) 10:33, 22 October 2012 (UTC)

Okay, once and for all, sorry about that

Sorry about the original, harsh tone in my first reply back to you. I did not want to do it. I have just woke up and feeling under the weather and to be honest, after July, you are one of the last wikipedians that I want to be involved with right now. You have to understand what happened that month was a huge blow to me and was part of the reason for my section blanking. Yes, my weak point is that I am quick to undo an edit or get rid of something and give other editors the impression I own a page. I will admit that at first that was the case because when I first started on here it was just me and some other user doing Indian football articles. He left and I started to do work on other topics (Arsenal etc) and eventually I had to work with other editors and it was tough. I did get used to it but I would agree if you did not agree with that. Now from your edits I can see that you to are also pretty pissed at what happened around that time (mainly because I would not notify you if that vandal came to the Gomes page and I take full blame for that. I said I would revamp the page but I did not.) That is my fault and I will take all the blame for that. Now I do not want this to hit me back and nor do I want you to be pissed at me because that is not why, as a volunteer, I am here. I am here to try and improve pages, create some history (you know what I mean :D ) and maybe make some friends on here. I have not done any of those three but I hope to as time goes by. Now I wish to get back into the good side of you that I was in before the Manuel Gomes incident. Please, that was a long time ago and should not be referenced anymore. Cheers. --Arsenalkid700 (talk) 10:57, 22 October 2012 (UTC)

Vilamu Sekifu

Hi.Can you answer why you delete the height of Viliamu Sekifu,this information was get on Facebook,This information is important to because,for people know about the height of Viliamu Sekifu height and other tuvaluan player height.Thanks,Faldipratama (talk) 12:04, 21 November 2012 (UTC)

Hi, I deleted it because it was unreferenced. It is extremely important that all biographical information is sourced. I would also suggest that Facebook is not a reliable source for such information, particularly if it is the person in questions facebook page. Fenix down (talk) 11:12, 21 November 2012 (UTC)

Nukufetau

Hi Fenix_down, Nukufetau is not a former club from Tuvalu, it is the club Tamanuku, all 8 islands have a team,Tofaga, Manu Laeva, Tamanuku, Nauti, Haapai United, FC Niutao, Lakena United and Nui. I have examined that, and have contact with the Tuvaluans. Nukufetau A is Tamanuku A. cheers, --Klant01 (talk) 19:23, 22 November 2012 (UTC) ;)

Hi Klant, no problem, I won't revert again. Do you think you could find a source and add it to the Tamanuku page? Fenix down (talk) 10:58, 24 November 2012 (UTC)

License tagging for File:Ulaanbaatar University Logo.jpg

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License tagging for File:Selenge Press Logo.png

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No tit for tat policy

N. P. Rajendran is a notable person in India. Kerala press academy is not a press agency where as it is government organization. The article which I have nominated for deletion Sergei Kochetov contains image which is copied from the source. This place is not to take revenge or competitive editing by selectively picking up the article. --atnair (talk) 16:48, 20 January 2013 (UTC)

My Prodding was not tit for tat, I had no idea you had nominated an article for deletion as I have never heard of that subject, nor had it on my watch list, I merely left a message on another subject on your talk page, saw a link to an article, went to it and felt that it was on a non-notable subject. The article has been there for some months and appears to be about an individual who is of regional prominence at best and therefore in my mind fails WP:GNG. In addition, the one reference that attempts to show notability is a primary source as it is from the website of the organisation he is / was deputy editor of and is therefore notan acceptable source for establishing GNG. I still believe this is a non-notable individual and so feel it should go to AfD following your contest. Please make any further comment on this subject on that AfD page. Thank you. Fenix down (talk) 16:54, 20 January 2013 (UTC)

Agreed he is the editor of the news agency from which one of the reference added. But also note the citation is news article form a reputed daily newspaper circulated. One more reference is there which is secondary source of reference. --atnair (talk) 17:02, 20 January 2013 (UTC)

My point is that the reference about him taking over the Chair is from a newspaper for which he worked and so does not count in establishing notability. As I said, I have raised an AfD for this article about which you have been informed. Please post an additional comments there so all editors who wish to join the discussion can see them.Fenix down (talk) 17:04, 20 January 2013 (UTC)

Nomination of List of foreign football players in Vodafonedeildin for deletion

A discussion is taking place as to whether the article List of foreign football players in Vodafonedeildin is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

The article will be discussed at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/List of foreign football players in Vodafonedeildin until a consensus is reached, and anyone is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on high-quality evidence and our policies and guidelines.

Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion template from the top of the article. GiantSnowman 09:36, 21 January 2013 (UTC)

File:Royal Bhutan Army FC.gif listed for deletion

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Speedy deletion for Adam Tse

I don't understand the reason for the speedy deletion for the article Adam Tse. He is a member of notable hong kong and asian football club South China and even played once for the club since he joined the club on 20 January 2013. There are several reliable sources to prove that he joined the club as well as played for the club. Fabregas0414 talk 15:34, 14 February 2013 (UTC)

It was speedied because it had been deleted through AfD literally five minutes beforehand, you would have been informed of this when you recreated the page. To address your points: Being a member of a notable club, does not make a player notable. Playing once in a professional league does technically fulfill WP:NFOOTY, but this is always trumped by WP:GNG and there is simply nowhere near enough out there to fulfill GNG. Perhaps in a season or two if he establishes himself then there is a chance he might. Fenix down (talk) 18:59, 14 February 2013 (UTC)

Orphaned non-free media (File:Suva FC Logo.jpg)

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Snezhnoye

Funny you should mention this one, because I added it to my review list just a couple days ago :) I'll try to take a good look at it in the next week or two. But I must say, for a half-dead village in the Extreme North of Russia, the number of sources you've been able to dig up is truly amazing. I'm sure some cleanup will be required, but with this amount of material (and considering the obscureness of the topic) the article should easily pass the GA requirements (although putting it through a peer review first should indeed lay way for other articles you worked on). Thank you ever so much for your interest in this subject and for the amount of effort you put in! I only wish we could order the likes of yourself in triplicate :)—Ëzhiki (Igels Hérissonovich Ïzhakoff-Amursky) • (yo?); July 10, 2012; 13:19 (UTC)

As promised, I gave that article a read and made a few changes (which are by no means exhaustive). My overall impression is unchanged—the article has lots and lots of good material, addressing the verifiability and broad coverage requirements of GACR in spades. However, I've also noticed some problems with readability. The amount of material is great, but there seems to be a fair amount of repetition, jumping back and forth, restating the same fact more than once, and other similar things. I revised the Prehistory and Soviet history sections to show what I mean. In other words, the article is a great first draft, but I'm afraid it might fail the "well-written" criterion of GAN if nominated in its present state.
I will be more than happy to assist with copyediting, but you should probably go through the article as well (perhaps after taking a short break so you could read it on a fresh head), since at this point you are the person most familiar with what the sources say. After the readability concern is addressed, I think the article has a very good chance of passing GAN.—Ëzhiki (Igels Hérissonovich Ïzhakoff-Amursky) • (yo?); July 26, 2012; 16:46 (UTC)
Absolutely! I'll probably get to it after the holiday weekend. Thanks again!—Ëzhiki (Igels Hérissonovich Ïzhakoff-Amursky) • (yo?); August 29, 2012; 13:49 (UTC)
I know it has been a while, but I was wondering whether you had had a chance to give the revised version a quick scan? I would appreciate any comments you had before taking it to peer review. Fenix down (talk) 16:14, 21 February 2013 (UTC)
Sorry to have ignored this like that! When are you planning to take this article to peer review? Knowing this would at least give me a deadline. I'll make a point to review it soon.—Ëzhiki (Igels Hérissonovich Ïzhakoff-Amursky) • (yo?); February 21, 2013; 16:55 (UTC)
No particular deadline, would like to in the next few weeks though. I actually got contacted by the woman who wrote a lot of the sources I have used expressing considerable surprise anyone had read her work! She might be able to suggest a few more bits I have overlooked, but I think I have pretty much exhausted all available sources, although I am going to see if she has any photos she would not mind releasing to commons which might brighten up the article a touch. Fenix down (talk) 16:59, 21 February 2013 (UTC)
Oh wow, that's exciting! Any chance she'd be interested in becoming a Wikipedia editor? :) I'll try to go through the article next week; please come bop me on the head if I don't!—Ëzhiki (Igels Hérissonovich Ïzhakoff-Amursky) • (yo?); February 21, 2013; 17:10 (UTC)
I've been gently suggesting comment on other Chukotka articles. I've been meaning to email her for a few days, so I will suggest it. She's moved on from Chukotka in terms of her study but it would be good to have someone with that level of expertise involved. Will give you bop if I don't hear anything from you in the next week or so! Fenix down (talk) 17:13, 21 February 2013 (UTC)
I've gone through the article again and made some edits (by no means extensive). I still believe this article is a great candidate for becoming a GA, but it will require more work before it reaches this status. Things which were most obvious to me included:
Prose. There are a lot of repetitions, and some sentences are overly long. I did correct a few which I found especially clunky, but more certainly can be done. In a few paragraphs I saw a tendency to digress—one sentence discussing Snezhnoye in the beginning ends up with the discussion of the intricacies of the abandoned localities throughout Chukotka, for example. If you could tighten up the prose, the article will only win as a result, even if it becomes shorter. Also, in some places there are way too many details (but I realize not everyone will agree with me on that). For example, is the detailed discussion of the unfilled technical positions really necessary? Do we care what the streets are called and what the meanings of their names are? And so on.
Sources. Or their formatting, rather. I know that formatting all those ref tags in a consistent manner is a menial task, but it does help a lot in the long run. I started to work on this last time, but the remainder still needs to be combed over. Since you have access to all those sources, there really is no one else better suited for this task than you.
Images. You addressed this in your previous comment above, but I guarantee that it will also come up during the peer review. If you could add one or two pictures at least, that would make all the difference. Of course, if there are no images available at all, then that's going to be that :)

Hope this helps!—Ëzhiki (Igels Hérissonovich Ïzhakoff-Amursky) • (yo?); February 27, 2013; 18:10 (UTC)

Let me intervene in the discussion! I noticed that many of the articles about Chukotka in enwiki more informative, than in ruwiki. And this is the merit of Fenix down! I will try to add content to the Russian section. I will use Frolova research work, You were talking about her? Also I note that the readers will be wondering how to translate the original names of the streets.

Ёжикам привет с исторической Родины! — LEhAN (talk) 00:36, 28 February 2013 (UTC)

Polyarny, Chukotka Autonomous Okrug

Hi! I invite you to write an article Polyarny, Chukotka Autonomous Okrug — LEhAN (talk) 18:41, 14 February 2013 (UTC)

Hi! It is definitely on my to do list. I have spent more time looking at football related articles, but I do intend to come back to Chukotka ones very soon! I'll let you know when it is done! Fenix down (talk) 19:00, 14 February 2013 (UTC)
Consider it done! Fenix down (talk) 15:00, 25 February 2013 (UTC)
Thanks for your participation! I am a resident of Chukotka, if you have any questions on the subject - you can contact me, I will be glad to help! LEhAN (talk) 19:34, 26 February 2013 (UTC)
No problem at all, I like writing about places in Chukotka! Where abouts are you from there? I was in Chukotka on holiday a 18 months or so ago and visited Anadyr, Wrangel Island, Herald Island and the north coast. I would love to visit Pevek and the abandoned mines around there, Mys Shmidta and Iultin too. Thinking about it, I should probably make some of my Panoramio photos of Chukotka available under CC license. Fenix down (talk) 15:38, 27 February 2013 (UTC)
I was born and grew up in Polyarny, when the settlement was closed, I moved to live in the Leningradsky, and then in Mys Shmidta. In 2008 I leave Chukotka, but continued to come almost every summer at the gold mining enterprises - Shakhtar and Polyarnaya (Kuvet). Also several times vizited Pevek, Billings, Keperveem, Iultin, Egvekinot, Gudym, Anadyr, Seymchan, Magadan. Unfortunately, most of the photo archive was lost :( Well, how you came to Chukotka? Kupol Gold Project? — LEhAN (talk) 00:36, 28 February 2013 (UTC)

Tuvalu National Team

He just got selected but his name has been put forward for the team in the next 2015 squad but at the mean time hes still in the squad at late notice. that why im trying to make him a page with his information and everything. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Lwayz (talk • contribs) 20:45, 13 March 2013 (UTC)

Orphaned non-free media (File:Phnompenhcrown.png)

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Μετάφραση από ελληνικά

Γεια. Έχω μεταφράσει 2 άρθρα από τα ελληνικά. Θα ήθελα να τα διαβάσεις και να κάνεις μερικές διορθώσεις, αφού οι γνώσεις μου στα αγγλικά δεν είναι τέλειες. Τα άρθρα είναι Nea Salamis Famagusta και Nea Salamis Famagusta FC. Είναι ακριβείς μεταφράσεις των αντίστοιχων ελληνικών. Αν δεν μπορείς να βοηθήσεις, απολογούμαι για την ενόχληση. Xaris333 (talk) 21:44, 30 March 2013 (UTC)

Persija Jakarta

I wrote that because I know the history, that's my lovely team and I know why I'm created that. What you know about Persija Jakarta? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Bogororange (talk • contribs) 09:28, 31 March 2013 (UTC) This is irrelevant. I have not reverted because the information is wrong but because you have provided no sources. Add appropriate references and there is no problem. This has been noted in every edit summary reverting your edits. Why have you done nothing about this? Fenix down (talk) 09:32, 31 March 2013 (UTC)

Former players

HI, Thankyou for your message. Notable former players for non-league teams has been discussed on the non-league task force (of which we need more members) : Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Football/English non-league task force but there is no concensus to one rule or another. You can bring this up on WP:FOOTY but according to the standard recommended template found here Wikipedia:WikiProject Football/Clubs notable players are allowed as clear criterai for acceptance is given, and players mentioned do not have to have references if they already have Wiki page, as its assumed theiy already meet notability criteria. As regards Banstead athletic I have put this criterai in place, as they will not be able to have more than a dozen players elligible due to their lowly nature. I will reapply the edit unless the criteria is changed on Club template.

HI,

I have checked the references(and added some new ones for one of the players), for each of their own Wikipedia profiles. The Banstead article does not require these refernces as per template,[[2]] and many other non-football relatedarticles as it has to be assumed referencing is done via the individuals wikipedia profile. Babylon77 (talk) 13:21, 1 April 2013 (UTC)

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Nomination of Oyunbat Bayarjargal for deletion

A discussion is taking place as to whether the article Oyunbat Bayarjargal is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

The article will be discussed at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Oyunbat Bayarjargal until a consensus is reached, and anyone is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on high-quality evidence and our policies and guidelines.

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Wexford Youths notable former players

Hi, I see that you have removed the section on notable former players on Wexford Youths page, as there is no selection criteria. What is necessary to create a notable former players section on this page again? Backbeatlistener (talk) 23:52, 14 April 2013 (UTC)

Hi. I don't think there are any hard and fast rules, although there is a link in the conversation currently at the top of my talk page to an old thread from the football wiki project talk board which has some suggestions. Generally I would suggest either something like the all tome highest appearances or scorer perhaps a list of players with more than a given number of appearances (a minimum of one hundred usually but consider whether this would leave too long a list. The important thing is that there shouldn't be a huge list of players. I would keep it to no more than ten or so but exercise your judgement. They don't have to be sourced in the club article (though it is helpful) but you should make sure that the claim to notability is sourced in each player's own wiki page. Fenix down (talk) 21:45, 15 April 2013 (UTC)

ok

I meant to revert myself at Partizani Tirana as I did here, but you were faster. And you are right, and thanks. ZacTaylor (talk) 14:50, 25 April 2013 (UTC)

No problem mate. I don't have an issue with these sort of sectionsi n club articles, but where they are unreferenced they can slant the article more towards a fan page than an encyclopedic entry. Happy to see it back with refs if poss. Fenix down (talk) 15:24, 25 April 2013 (UTC)

Famous category

Please don't add famous category to Azerbaijani football articles, especially when it includes this message, under that part of article

EDITORS: You can ADD only ESTABLISHED PLAYERS, which played more than ONE SEASON, that HAD IMPACT in the club and MORE THAN 30 GAMES unless PLAYER is SEASON'S GOALSCORER. DON'T ADD EVERY FOREIGN PLAYER that played FEW games. Thank you.

--NovaSkola 19:40, 26 April 2013 (UTC)

Firstly that is a message that does not appear in any article itself secondly it has the appearance of consensus which it .most certainly isn't and thirdly 30 games is ridiculously low as an inclusion criteria. That essentially means anyone who is a regular for one season could be added. You need to address these points I think. Fenix down (talk) 22:24, 26 April 2013 (UTC)

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Bosnia stats

In my opinion, if it is indeed a record, it should simply be stated as a record in a list of other records and stats related to the team; there is no need for the list of teams below it. If there is no list of records and stats, there's no reason for the stat to exist on its own, and certainly not puffed up to make it look important. – PeeJay 14:43, 30 May 2013 (UTC)

I suppose so, it's not like it is a world record. Fenix down (talk) 14:52, 30 May 2013 (UTC)

Bhutanese Players

Hi Sabri, I notice you added some tables to a variety of Bhutanese footballers for goals scored. Unfortunately they do not seem to have any reliable source, so I have reverted them for the time being. None of them appear to be supported by the pre-existing NFT links in the articles and the only link in the tables is one to another WP page, where unfortunately, any source present seems to be a dead link. I am not saying that these tables are wrong and should not be restored, but it would be better if they are able to be linked to a reliable source (match report from AFC?). Fenix down (talk) 10:28, 27 May 2013 (UTC)

There're some different sources from different websites but I accept that it's hard to find a source for them. It's easy to find any source for all European and North/South American countries but we've a problem with some unfamiliar countries like Bhutan. I think NFT (Nationalfootballteams.com) isn't enough for national football team data. RSSSF is better than that. However, sometimes even RSSSF remains incapable to find some data. Also it's impossible to find friendly match reports in AFC website. I don't know why I'm dealing with Bhutan :D Anyway, I'll consider your kindly advices and I'll solve this problem. Best regards.--Sabri76'talk 21:37, 30 May 2013 (UTC)

Question about KÍ Klaksvík and flp

Hi. I am writing to you because you removed some of the names of former KÍ Klaksvík players from the article about KÍ Klaksvík, explaining in you edit comment "playing in a fpl is not really a valid criterion. cannot be reasonably applied to clubs that are already in an fpl". I would like to know, what you mean about that? Do you consider KÍ Klaksvík as a fully pro league? Because the English Wikipedia does not regard the Faroese football league Effodeildin as a fully pro leageu, only as a semi pro league. Articles can not be written here about Faroese football players, unless they have played for the national team (not U21 or other youth teams) or for a foreign fpl. That is why I thougth, that the foreign players who were mentioned there were more notable than the Faroese players who didn't play for the national team or any foreign flp. I didn't add the names to the list I would like to say. Best regards EileenSanda (talk) 07:13, 13 June 2013 (UTC)

Hi, sorry if my edit summary was a bit vague. The reason I removed a number of names is because I don't regard simply having played in a fully pro league at some point in a players career to be enough to justify their inclusion in a "notable players" section. Firstly, because someone could play for KI when they were, say, 16, then leave the club, go through a number of clubs not in fully professionsal leagues, but end up playing once in a fully professional when they were 32 and they would fulfill your criterion. As such, it is difficult to see how such a criterion would be useful to a reader. Furthermore, once the player has left KI, I am not sure how anything they do at other clubs makes them notable for KI. The games played in an FPL were for a different club, not KI. Sure, appearances in an FPL would increase the notability of an individual player, but I do not see how this would increase the notability of the player's association with KI. Fenix down (talk) 07:23, 13 June 2013 (UTC)
Ok, so this means, that there can only be one reason which makes a former KÍ player notable, and that is if he has played a number of matches for the national team. EileenSanda (talk) 10:05, 13 June 2013 (UTC)
Oh no, not at all, there can be many reasons (e.g. intl caps, most expensive player bought / sold, most trophies won, longest time at club), my point regarding playing in a fully professional league is that playing for FC Foo in an FPL does not make someone a notable player for FC Other simply because they played for them previously. The notable act of playing in a FPL occurs after they left FC Foo. Many players will play in a non-professional league and then go on to make appearances in a FPL. Whilst the same criteria do not need to be applied across all clubs such "Notable Players" sections should be kept brief and only include the most notable. A link to Category:FC Foo Players would suffice to cover players who go on to make appearances in FPLs, without creating a list that would become very cumbersome over time. This is just my opinion though. Fenix down (talk) 10:33, 13 June 2013 (UTC)
Ok, thanks for your explanation :). EileenSanda (talk) 16:24, 13 June 2013 (UTC)

Melbourne Victory FC

Edits to Melbourne Victory FC were not good faith by me, I was reverting what the previous person had done, section blanking. EzPz (talk) 08:09, 15 June 2013 (UTC)

Even so the previous editor did not leave a clear reason but I feel the removal of those sections that were arbitrary stats was justified. Fenix down (talk) 08:11, 15 June 2013 (UTC)
Fair enough. I just wanted you to know what I was doing. EzPz (talk) 08:13, 15 June 2013 (UTC)
that's cool. I think in many instances where I.p.s blank sections it is not appropriate especially when they don't leave an edit summary. Fenix down (talk) 08:14, 15 June 2013 (UTC)

Re: Palau Soccer League

Okay, I understand what you are saying but the previous winners section did not need to be reverted, and the top scorers section just needed the unknown seasons removed. I think the page deserves too look more professional, like Maltese Premier League, thats all I was trying to achieve. Could I revert the 'Past Winners' section to this: User:KHarber/sandbox#Palau Soccer League? Also, the Current Champions/Most Championships part of the infobox would, (I feel), look better if it corresponded with the one on the Premier League page.

KHarber- GBR 10:34, 16 June 2013 (UTC)

No problem at all with the past winners format in your sandbox although I would be careful about over linking. Each club only really needs to linked once in the section I think otherwise every word is blue. Fenix down (talk) 21:40, 16 June 2013 (UTC)

About you revert

I'm sorry that I added unnecessary tags to T. I. and Power(maybe {{one source}} will be appropriate?).

I'm a newcomer(although I joined 6 months ago,but I started editing only recently) and now I contribute by both editing pages and patroling pages.But recently I read something which says only experienced editors(for example,1000+ mainspace edits) should patrol pages,what's your opinion?Do you have any suggestion about patroling pages(I have read tutorials such as WP:NPP,WP:CSD)for me?Or anything else about how to contribute better,is also appreciated.--Lsmll 09:51, 17 June 2013 (UTC)

That's no problem, you shouldn't worry about being new when it comes to getting involved in things. I would advise that perhaps you try to review pages in subject areas that you are familiar with (apologies if you do know a lot about football!) so you get an idea of what common sources are used in articles. In this instance I would not agree that a one source tag is appropriate either, this is more relevant where the article is quite long and so using just one source might present a skewed view. In this instance, RSSSF is a stats database and the elements referenced are essentially facts from a source that is generally considered very reliable. Fenix down (talk) 10:51, 17 June 2013 (UTC)
Thank you very much,I'll keep learning through editing,and try to become a good editor on Wikipedia.--Lsmll 11:08, 17 June 2013 (UTC)
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Edits reverted on Wangay Dorji

You removed the flag, which is correct, but I was making it fit in with articles that you have created, i.e. the articles for all of the players on Template:Kiribati squad for 2011 Pacific Games!

KHarber- GBR 15:51, 22 June 2013 (UTC)

Ha! The lesson there is not to copy what I do, I make loads of mistakes. I think I just copied the initial template from a pre-existing article that included it. Thanks for bringing it to my attention I have corrected the articles. Fenix down (talk) 17:28, 22 June 2013 (UTC)

Unnecessary football navboxes

Can you help me discuss all football discussions in two articles: Wikipedia:Templates for discussion/Log/2013 July 12, Wikipedia:Templates for discussion/Log/2013 July 13? Banhtrung1 (talk) 12:12, 18 July 2013 (UTC)

Introduction

Yeah, the SAFF competition is a full FIFA intl. You can check it from Fifa.com ;) I've added all references. Best regards...--Sabri76'talk 13:50, 21 July 2013 (UTC)

Melbourne Victory

Why do you want to delete the following articles:

-Melbourne Victory Notable Players -List of international Melbourne Victory players

I'd like to have a specific and genuine reason as to why this 'must' be deleted. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Crelache (talk • contribs) 01:08, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Please see the AfDs for my comments, any discussion should take place there. Fenix down (talk) 10:18, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Club Colón

Hi, I saw you reverted all the changes I had made to Club Atlético Colón page. You did it wrongly so I just had added information taken from the club's official site (with the source cited as reference) and other sources such as the RSSSF site. The changes made include the Liga Santafesina titles won by the club before 1947 (when Colón affiliated to AFA starting to play at Primera División). If you have some disagreement with some of my edits, please tell me but don't revert "everything" before taking a look at the changes. I'm able to discuss any issue if you wish to do so. Thanks, Fma12 (talk) 14:08, 22 August 2013 (UTC)

You're right, I didn't see the RSSSF refs in the text at the time. Apologies. Fenix down (talk) 14:10, 22 August 2013 (UTC)

Contested deletion of Svay Rieng FC

This page should not be speedily deleted because... this is an actual club as per this ref that passes WP:GNG as they play in the top flight of Cambodian football. Fenix down (talk) 15:58, 5 September 2013 (UTC)

That doesn't change the fact that it was created in violation of block. If your prepared to take the article on and make substantial edits to it, the criteria will no longer apply, but otherwise it should clearly go. Sir Sputnik (talk) 16:04, 5 September 2013 (UTC)
The page having been deleted, I'm moving a copy of this discussion to both our talk pages in the interest of maintaining a record of it. Sir Sputnik (talk) 19:01, 5 September 2013 (UTC)

Atlético Madrid B - Famous players

Hi there FD, AL from Portugal here,

please accept my reasonings to allow this section to stay, i'll elaborate now: it's not ORIGINAL RESEARCH because B-teams have this approach to them, even if a player does not reach the 100-game mark (or is an international), if he goes on to be an important first-team player i think he merits to be a FAMOUS PLAYER in both squads, in the B's to show he was homegrown there. For example Guti (alright bad example, he's a Spanish international), even if he had not played with Spain, i think he should be a Real Madrid Castilla player, he was a legendary youth graduate at Real Madrid.

However, if you still feel the above is POV (i respect your opinion), please allow me to at least reinstate the others (the 100+ games guys and the internationals), that's not POV or OR. Thank you, sorry for any inconvenience. --AL (talk) 17:02, 29 August 2013 (UTC)

Hi AL, thanks for your message. I agree in part and disagree in part also! Firstly, I agree, a 100 game mark could well be sufficient inclusion criteria. My view on this is that this should be league games only (partly as this ties in with the requirements for player infoboxes and so can be checked readily back to each players article so it doesn't need to be referenced) but you should consider how many people would meet this criterion. If we are talking more than 10-20 then perhaps this is too low and you should consider 150-200, it's up to you there is no hard and fast rule. Where I disagree and where there is an element of OR still I feel is where players move onto the first team. Firstly, that is kind of the point of the B team, so anyone who doesn;t can be argued to have failed in some way, and secondly, their notability is attached to the first team, not the reserve team. Using Guti as an example, while he was in Castilla, certainly he was a promising player, but he became the player he is and the international he is after he left Castilla. Therefore, it would be appropriate that he was in a notable players list for Real Madrid, but not for Castilla as what he did that made him so famous was done really after he left Castilla. Fenix down (talk) 08:04, 30 August 2013 (UTC)
  • Thanks for the reply man. Per it, i have reinstated the section, without the controversial bit of course, the one that may be considered OR (players that made impact with first team, i'll have to agree with you it's 300% subjective). Regarding the 100+ official appearances' acceptance rate, i'd say is pretty consensual, in fact that's the criteria people suggested i should embrace when i first started cleaning this section up in the various clubs, some three/four years ago. Since then, i have encountered no obstacles.

Happy weekend, regards --AL (talk) 13:35, 30 August 2013 (UTC)

  • I thought we had reached an understanding following the above message, i see we have not (but, in the meantime, everybody is 200% happy with the "100+ official games/internationals" approach). Fair enough, it stays out at S.C. Beira-Mar. Why? Don't know why, you're more equipped to provide the answer, as you're the one removing it.

Happy week, from Portugal (ah, and i promise not to reinstate the section out of wiki-respect, it stays out even though it should not) --AL (talk) 18:57, 16 September 2013 (UTC)

Hi AL, we have reached an agreement, it's just that the article must clearly state what the inclusion criteria are, you can't just assume people will know. I am happy for you to add back the list with the inclusion criteria (although I still feel it should be 100 league games, not 100 official games) but you should check that all players conform to it. Fenix down (talk) 19:01, 16 September 2013 (UTC)
  • Done - but feel free to correct language and/or grammar when you see the criteria written - i will refrain from adding further players until i know for sure they meet the criteria (for instance the new guy i added, Dinis Silva Gomes Resende, is not an international but he has 131 league appearances as you can see per his WP article). And yes, i AGREE WITH YOU 100% (slip of the tongue earlier), i meant to say "100 league games", not 100 official ones. Cheers! --AL (talk) 00:07, 17 September 2013 (UTC)

Upon further inspection (AFTER i reinstated the section with the criteria), removed two guys that did not meet criteria. Thank you for your tips, nice teamwork --AL (talk) 00:24, 17 September 2013 (UTC)

No problem mate, thanks for helping out. Fenix down (talk) 08:01, 17 September 2013 (UTC)

Have been adding the inclusion criteria in several clubs. Not that it will deter: 1 - anyone from adding the players of their preference even if they do not meet the criteria; 2 - vandalism, including the removal of said note. That's WP for you, but we try.

Until some other time, take care --AL (talk) 01:51, 18 September 2013 (UTC)

You too, although you may wish to get involved in this discussion at the WP:FOOTY talk page where we are talking about whether any such lists without reliable external sourcing should be allowed. Fenix down (talk) 09:30, 18 September 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for the tip. Not feeling very optimistic after what I've read there and all my hard work of the past weeks, but, as we say in Portuguese, we all have to row in the same direction (meaning i'll have to abide by whatever the outcome of the discussion is). Cheers --AL (talk) 14:25, 18 September 2013 (UTC)

Your mass deletions of former players lists are disruptive

Your mass deletions of former players lists in articles are disruptive. If you have an issue regarding OR then post it on "No original research noticeboard"; and you should seek consensus from other editors. STSC (talk) 22:53, 20 September 2013 (UTC)

Check the WT:FOOTY talk board. You will see a lengthy discussion there. My edits are not disruptive. Any section claiming a list of players is famous or providing a selective list of former players that are not linked to reliable sources explaining why those players in particular have been given prominence is WP:OR. Simple as that. Fenix down (talk) 22:57, 20 September 2013 (UTC)

Talkback

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