Template:Did you know nominations/Eagle Peak (Wyoming)

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The following discussion is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by Allen3 talk 15:51, 2 August 2013 (UTC)

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Eagle Peak (Wyoming)[edit]

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Eagle Peak in Wyoming

  • ... that the Eagle Peak (Wyoming) (pictured) was named in 1878 by Jack Newell, who killed a golden eagle on the mountain that year?


Shouldn't there be a reference in the hook to highest point in Yellowstone? Billy Hathorn (talk) 21:21, 24 June 2013 (UTC)

Created/expanded by Gilderien (talk), MONGO (talk), Nvvchar (talk), Dr. Blofeld (talk). Nominated by Gilderien (talk) at 19:39, 19 June 2013 (UTC).

Isn't "highpoint" misleading? It could mean the highlight of a visit as well as elevation. Billy Hathorn (talk) 21:21, 24 June 2013 (UTC)

Well, "highpointing" is a common American term for climbing the highest point in states or national parks.--Gilderien Chat|List of good deeds 21:44, 24 June 2013 (UTC)
  • As the reviewer is banned from DYK, a new review is needed. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 23:06, 24 June 2013 (UTC)
  • When I found the article, it qualified as a 5x expansion, but my editing has unfortunately caused it to fall below the threshold. I removed the "Geology" section because it didn't make any sense and I couldn't find a valid replacement. The mountain is obviously formed of bedrock, not of recent glacial deposits. The surficial geology map of the Eagle Peak quadrangle shows the mountain to be "Rock". It's probably volcanic rock (tuff or breccia) because that's what this part of the Absaroka Range is mostly, but I've not found any source that specifically states that this peak is volcanic. --Orlady (talk) 05:13, 25 June 2013 (UTC)
  • I undid your edit because I think you mis-interpreted it. It does not state that the mountain is formed entirely of glacial contact residue, but just that there "is a layer of rock" formed this way.--Gilderien Chat|List of good deeds 18:26, 27 June 2013 (UTC)
  • No, I believe you misinterpreted the source. The source cited has no information about this mountain; the source is a report on the surficial geology of an adjacent quadrangle (meaning the area covered by a USGS topographic quadrangle map). The source does mention the Eagle Peak quadrangle, but not Eagle Peak. As for this business about a "layer of rock", it may be useful to recognize that not all "geology" consists of rocks. "Surficial geology" generally refers to unconsolidated material on the land surface. There is no layer of rock formed by glacial deposition. The report tells about glacial deposits, including glacial till and lake sediment, in the area surrounding the mountain. I did find an online map of the surficial geology of the Eagle Peak quadrangle and I found Eagle Peak on that map. It shows Eagle Peak as consisting of "rock", with tiny areas of talus (scree) and some glacial till on its slopes. The article's indication that Eagle Peak is mantled by a "layer of rock formed by the contact of ice and the ground" is nonsense. Furthermore, I don't believe there is any relationship between Eagle Peak and "the volcanic ash which was produced in successive eruptions of the Yellowstone Supervolcano." Eagle Peak is part of the Absaroka Range, which is mostly (but not entirely) volcanic in origin and is older than -- and unrelated to -- the Yellowstone Supervolcano, according to the Wyoming Geological Survey. --Orlady (talk) 19:22, 27 June 2013 (UTC)
  • It looks like the rewrite was completed shortly after the above post, but never announced here. Orlady, is this what you were looking for, or is more work needed? (The article is back above 5x expansion as it currently stands.) BlueMoonset (talk) 17:49, 8 July 2013 (UTC)
  • That edit was an improvement. I further revised the Geology section so that it now describes the rock that forms the mountain (and cites a good source) before it mentions that fact that glaciers were in the area.
Sadly, the closer I look at this article as a whole, the worse it looks. Much of the information in the article is not about Eagle Peak, but is about other parts of Yellowstone and the surrounding area (basically, this looks like padding inserted to make this a 5x expansion). Some of the information that is represented as being specific to the peak isn't; for example, the "sedges and rushes" described at the end of "Wildlife" turn out to be the lowland vegetation in the foreground of a photo that has Eagle Peak in the background (I don't know where the "tufted hairgrass" in that same sentence comes from). Other information (including the origin of the name) isn't in the sources cited. It's not clear that the main source for Eagle Peak being the tallest point in the park (i.e., Peakery.com is a reliable source, and the single most-cited reference in the article turns out to be a work of fiction published by a vanity press (i.e., lulu.com). --Orlady (talk) 02:41, 10 July 2013 (UTC)
I shall address your points as I can. I agree that Peakery is not a reliable source for it being the highest point in the park, but I would certainly think that 3, the NPS one is, which is cited in the lede.--Gilderien Chat|List of good deeds 08:47, 13 July 2013 (UTC)
The first given origin of the name isn't in the source, the second is. I shall see who added the first one and ask for clarification.--Gilderien Chat|List of good deeds 17:34, 13 July 2013 (UTC)
The etymology is covered by the source I added, confirmed by the editor who added it. I have removed the unreliable sourced statements, except from a direct quote attributed in the text.--Gilderien Chat|List of good deeds 22:20, 13 July 2013 (UTC)
Gilderien's efforts have successful resolved the etymology issue. Also, as Gilderien notes, all but one of the citations to the fictional work have been removed; however, the factual information that was sourced to that work still remains and is not supported by any other sources.
I have to ask someone else to pick up the rest of this review, essentially due to recent interactions between Dr. Blofeld and me (at [1] and other places). --Orlady (talk) 04:36, 14 July 2013 (UTC)
Not worth it Gilderien. I'm withdrawing our involvement with it, we'll still be here next month arguing the same points.♦ Dr. ☠ Blofeld 18:25, 13 July 2013 (UTC)
Gilderian, since you're the nominator, it's up to you whether the article is withdrawn or not. Given your subsequent posts above, after Dr. Blofeld's talking about withdrawing, I'm guessing that you want to continue with it; please let us know either way, and we'll be happy to look for another reviewer if you'd like. Thanks. BlueMoonset (talk) 03:43, 16 July 2013 (UTC)
I would like to continue with this nomination if it is possible. Thank you :) Also, it's Gilderien --Gilderien Chat|List of good deeds 10:03, 16 July 2013 (UTC)
Great! Have you addressed that one remaining citation to the fictional work that Orlady mentioned was still extant? If so, and it's ready for a re-review, I'll put out the icon in the hopes of attracting a new reviewer. (Apologies, Gilderien; I'm usually better about spelling people's usernames.) BlueMoonset (talk) 03:13, 20 July 2013 (UTC)
I have left it in for now as I think it acceptable - it literally says "according to so-and-so Eagle Peak is X, Y, and Z".--Gilderien Chat|List of good deeds 17:42, 20 July 2013 (UTC)
Do consider whether Fred Whissel is a quotation-worthy source on the topic of Eagle Peak. According to his LinkedIn profile, he's the owner of an audio-video store who has a side business as a consulting writer/editor and self-publishing specialist. He's also a self-published author. In additional to the fictional work quoted in the article, his publications include "Save Yourself! How You CAN Troubleshoot Your Own Audio/Video Problems", several anti-Barack Obama books, and "In Light of Fires and Foggy Mornings: Stories from a Small Town in the 1950s That Are Absolutely, Positively True". It's not clear what it is that makes him a source of quotable quotes about this mountain. --Orlady (talk) 04:44, 21 July 2013 (UTC)
Point taken. I have removed the quote.--Gilderien Chat|List of good deeds 12:56, 21 July 2013 (UTC)
  • Need new reviewer to pick up the review and bring it to a conclusion. Thanks. BlueMoonset (talk) 18:18, 20 July 2013 (UTC)

I'm going to have to say no to this one. I've made some minor edits (in particular, I culled a short list of names of creeks and removed a sentence that was left over from an earlier revision) and the article is a few hundred characters below the 5x expansion, and I still see a few things that don't really pertain to the actual mountain (in Wildlife and Geography). I'll leave a note for BlueMoonset, and I'll ping Gilderien as well--with my apologies. Drmies (talk) 03:19, 31 July 2013 (UTC)

  • I have acquired a new source - Kelsey, Michael R. (2001). Climber's and Hiker's Guide to the World's Mountains and Volcanos (4th ed.). Provo, Utah: Kelsey Publishing. ISBN 978-0-944510-18-6. - and I believe it is now long enough.--Gilderien Chat|List of good deeds 18:33, 31 July 2013 (UTC)
  • Ping BlueMoonset, Drmies.--Gilderien Chat|List of good deeds 18:54, 31 July 2013 (UTC)
  • DYKcheck gives the size now at 3454 prose characters, which is more than the 3205 required for a 5x expansion. However, the other new source, the "Coverill" (the guy's name is "Covill") has been questioned as to its reliability by Orlady, and I have to add my skepticism as well, beyond the fact that it doesn't really support the information there: a 2000 report of a Park Service register doesn't mean one's there in 2013 (there had obviously been a recent change prior to this source's climb), and "infrequently climbed" is quite vague. I'll leave the more general issues to Drmies. BlueMoonset (talk) 22:56, 31 July 2013 (UTC)
  • Thanks. Down to 3310 prose characters, which is still 5x. BlueMoonset (talk) 02:13, 1 August 2013 (UTC)
  • And run ALT1--"highpoint" strikes me as an odd term also, but it's borne out by a quick search of Google Books. Drmies (talk) 13:59, 2 August 2013 (UTC)
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