Talk:William Grayson

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Grayson and Slavery[edit]

I don't know when or if I'll be able to travel to the Prince William County Virginia room at the main library building in Manassas to clean up this article. I believe Grayson freed his slaves, and also held several offices in Prince William county not yet mentioned. In fact, Grayson may be the reason why the Prince William country register of wills for the period lists a number of manumissions, unlike those for Fairfax County of the same period, if I remember correctly.Jweaver28 (talk) 13:31, 5 February 2014 (UTC) Annoying that no-one has managed to follow up, though Grayson might've been one of Virginia's most important politicians to become an abolitionist. Now COVID has closed local history sections of libraries, ....Jweaver28 (talk) 18:34, 25 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

  • I'd be interested in what you find Jweaver28, but from my 'digging in', I don't think that the term abolitionist applies at all. Like a lot of the members of the Virginia planter class, he put some limited manumissions in his will; I believe that Washington and Jefferson did the same. His will stipulated from this source --> http://freepages.rootsweb.com/~geneal/genealogy/src/Grayson/william.html say that upon his death slaves born post-independence be free. The theory most planters at the time felt, I believe, is that upon their death only old slaves would remain in servitude, and that over time the plantation would become slave-free. There were two holes in that theory regarding Grayson. The first is that in the 19th century slave labor became more and more prevalent due to the economics of southern plantation. I'm not entirely sure that this applied to Belle Aire but I hope you can dig it out. The second problem is that William Grayson died in 1790, which I'm sure he didn't plan on. As a result, using July 4, 1776 as the date his will stipulated, he 'freed' kids from newborns to 14-year-olds. My guess is that because of their young age, they stayed with their parents, and their status as free blacks would be in jeopardy as a result. My guess is that they never knew they were freed. Further, although I'm almost certain that his will's intent was to reduce slavery by keeping elderly slaves, perhaps for their own security, but his estate left all adult slaves in servitude. I'll keep an eye out, and hope to see the slavery issue fleshed out. I'm looking at raising the standards of this article (his impressive military service from 1776-79 is one large missing area), but I cannot talk to slavery without bias. He's a fascinating man with a wikipedia page that could use some help. Happy hunting. Bill McKenna (talk) 13:21, 18 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]
    • Thanks for the link. I'm most definitely not in a library on Sunday, and have no idea when I'll be able to work on this. One of the articles says Grayson freed all his slaves in his will, not just those born post-independence, and I dimly remember looking at a copy of his will several years ago, and that was, in fact, the case. That article or another in the link mentioned George Mason and Robert Carter as clients of this Grayson. As you may be aware, Robert Carter did free his slaves during his lifetime, not very far away in Westmoreland County, Virginia, but had a lot of difficulties enforcing that manumission, despite his wealth and power. This Grayson predeceased George Mason, whose heirs only submitted a 1773 will which freed no slaves. That will was very lengthy and transcribed into the Fairfax County deed book; no evidence would exist if the testator in fact marked "revoked" or otherwise altered it. Chatting with the Fairfax historical records clerk recently, she has noticed several cases in which executors failed to carry out a testator's instructions to manumit slaves. Some became the subject of freedom suits, though of course slaves might not know they were freed in a will, which was not in the heirs' economic interest. Plus, as time went on, even testamentary manumission became more and more difficult. From what I've seen, Virginians of a certain class developed a tradition of "forgetting" those who disfavored slavery, and I wrote this note because Grayson may well have fallen into the "forgotten" category. As time went on, manumissions became rarer, and generally wills or codicils thereto were executed within a year (if not just months) before a death. I believe many records were burned at the Prince William County courthouse during the civil war, which would complicate matters. The source I consulted most recently said it was Union forces that did the burning, though I also remember sources that claimed that Union forces burned records when Richmond fell, when in fact the arson was part of a Confederate military tactic, and some records of counties sending records to Richmond for "safekeeping" during the conflict were in fact found in odd places in the 1950s!Jweaver28 (talk) 15:53, 18 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]
      • This ALWAYS happens when I post! I found another really good source. I think you'll like it. I doesn't get to the issue of manumission, but it shows his slaves' names. Weirdly repetitive but it gives you the basic idea that between he and his wife they probably had 10-12 slaves. His brother the minister had more. https://genealogyresources.org/Index-Ldtt-v2.pdf. Bill McKenna (talk) 18:36, 18 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]
    • It's been over a year, but I managed to find not only his grave site which I couldn't several years ago, but a librarian who found the link to William Grayson's will, which I posted as a ref during this latest round of cyberbullying. There were anti-slavery Virginians at the time, and in the interval I found out about Townsheld Washington, who died childless but whose slaves were really freed. It turns out that his principal heir was Robert Townshend Thompson who served in the Virginia House of Delegates and who returned to Fairfax County (albeit lost at the other end) after his argument that the child born to one of Bushrod Washington's slaves in the Fairfax jail should be freed proved politically and socially unpopular so he and his wife moved to the newly established federal city for a spell. Of course, wikipedia has a policy against original research, so I'm doing my best to fix this article from published sources, which is a slow process made slower by my cyberbullies, who might be responsible for this new laptop being unable to download and install several updates since the 15th. FYI the Grayson family source on the Wayback machine archive I deleted from the article incorrectly listed the family's other plantation as Belmont, which actually was across the river and the very plantation inherited by Robert Townshend Thompson as a boy (subject to its slaves being emancipated on a schedule which was actually carried out). FYI2, note that Spence Grayson (who died shortly before the President and whose will seems lost) officiated at the wedding of George Augustine Washington who also was pro-manumission like the President and even Lund Washington) but died of tuberculosis before the President. The problem IMHO was that clerks might have some discretion (or abuse it) as to which wills were admitted to probate (and thus could later prove testamentary manumissions) and/or which inventories were accepted and filed. I keep being impressed by how small and convoluted was the oligarchical world of the First Families of Virginia. IMHO, George Mason's will and estate might be the epitome or apogee of that process. Now I want to see whether this laptop's restart will actually complete one install of the 4 that have repeatedly failed.Jweaver28 (talk) 23:18, 19 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified[edit]

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Belle Aire vs. Bel Air[edit]

Just leaving a note here as it seems to have caused some confusion: I find no evidence that the Grayson family's "Belle Aire" is the selfsame "Bel Air" which is on the National Register of Historic Places. Frankly, I can't find any information about Belle Aire, and it looks like the house is no longer standing. Furthermore, the burial vault in which Grayson is interred (according to Google Maps via Findagrave) is nowhere near Bel Air, which at cursory glance appears to be at least a couple of miles away. So I suspect the two properties were different. Further investigation is warranted, certainly. Two things I can say: Grayson was not a prince, and he appears to have been no fresher than other senators. Take that for what you will. --Ser Amantio di NicolaoChe dicono a Signa?Lo dicono a Signa. 19:56, 20 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]

I actually managed to read the 1976 register listing for the correct Bel Air, after confirming the correct address (and viewing the tomb) last week. I included both refs.Jweaver28 (talk) 23:19, 19 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified[edit]

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Classifications[edit]

With sincere apologies if I have overstepped, I have raised the classification of the article to "B", and given all categories a "mid" importance. I have taken the liberty as it is my experience that governance of categories is infrequent or non-existent. Should I be mistaken , let me know via my talk page, and please peer review the article. Much of my re-assessment is in the wake of my own clean-up, and addition to the military section (with citations). Kindly, Bill McKenna (talk) 15:33, 20 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]

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