Talk:Peter Wyngarde

"1 child" in Infobox

This has been recently added, but there is no source nor any other evidence that he and Dorinda Stevens had a child together. Delete? Theheartof (talk) 11:09, 21 September 2021 (UTC)

Have removed as unsourced. Was added here on 24 August, by User:Ecosseboy, who might care to explain further. Martinevans123 (talk) 11:35, 21 September 2021 (UTC)

It may be connected, although the date given is years after his purported marriage, to a baffling, and needless to say, unsupported claim under 'Trivia' on Wyngarde's IMDb entry that "He had one child -- born in 1977."Dolmance (talk) 14:27, 29 October 2021 (UTC)

I would assume that at least one of the regular contributors to this biog will have read the 'Life Amongst Strangers' biography(?).

On Page 381, with regard to the claim by the author that she and Wyngarde had discussed having a baby and buying a villa in Greece. Wyngarde is speaking. He lists a series of names for their child: "Here is a list of possibilities. Remember, he'll be called by his Christian name more times than he will his surname - unless he's in the Army - so we must call them out loudly and listen to how they sound. Here goes: Jason (my favourite), Justin, Jake, Togan, Sab or Seb, Jasper, Jonathan, Titus, Dugdale, Colwyn, Clayton, Vivyan (the male equivalent of my Vivien Leigh). One of these is what I'd like to call my NEXT son."

How did you miss that? TheWoolpack (talk) 19:33, 7 July 2022 (UTC)

Uh, so who exactly is this alleged firstborn son? Muzilon (talk) 11:21, 8 July 2022 (UTC)

This reeks of the same sense of entitlement many people seem to feel these days, which is to intrude upon and scrutinize every aspect of another person's life whether they ask for it or not. Perhaps the reason we have no knowledge of this "firstborn son" is because Wyngarde and the child's mother didn't want us to know, and because it's none of our damn business. He was a public figure who gave much of himself on stage and screen. Can't we just be grateful for that and let the poor guy rest in peace? TheWoolpack (talk) 13:19, 9 July 2022 (UTC)

The only reek seems to be he great smell of sockpuppetry Theheartof (talk) Theheartof 08:59, 10 July 2022 (UTC)

Is labelling someone a "sockpuppet" how you self justify any sort of decent or challenge to what you post on here? From the little experience I've had of Wikipedia, it would appear to be something of a closed shop and that if potential contributors (to this bio at least!) aren't willing to nod wildly in agreement with everything you say then they're either accused of deception or vetoed. In view of this, might I remind you of WP's own guidelines:-

"Assume good faith" and "Be welcoming to newcomers"

Is it any wonder that WP has such an atrocious reputation.

TheWoolpack (talk) 19:45, 11 July 2022 (UTC)

For the record, looking at the 'Trivia' section on Wyngarde's IMDb entry today (11th February 2023), the assertion that he "had one child" does not appear, now. Dolmance (talk) 14:12, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

"An obituary reported that he lived partly on social security benefits"

The phrasing of this seems to have an unpleasant "how the mighty have fallen" tone of schadenfreude, and I am minded to delete it. Don't most elderly or retired people have an entitlement to social security benefits, eg. the state pension? That's just life. Theheartof (talk) 13:21, 4 July 2022 (UTC)

This snipe came from probably the most roundly criticised obituary ever to be published by a British newspaper, namely that penned by Gavin Stewart Gaughan (A.K.A. 'Pete Stampede') which appeared in The Guardian on 18/01/22 and quickly replaced following a huge public backlash. Apparently he was sacked by the paper when they learned that he had been trolling the Peter Wyngarde Appreciation Society Facebook page by repeatedly posting homophobic slogans on it. From what I've been able to gather, he and a friend had been witnessed discussing his being banned from this FB group on his own Facebook page, where he'd vowed revenge by writing a scathing obit come Wyngarde's death. This was, I understand, back in 2014. The friend had responded with, "Why doesn't he [Wyngarde] just hurry up and die!" I was told that a screengrab was made of this conversation and latterly presented to The Guardian in 2018 after publication of the offending obituary. Several actors and directors including Mike Hodges (Flash Gordon, Get Carter etc.), Steven Berkoff, Brian Blessed, Jane Merrow and others also lodged complaints with The Guardian. According to Tina Wyngarde-Hopkins, author of the 2020 PW biography, 'A Life Amongst Strangers', she was told by The Guardian's Obituaries Editor, Robert White, that he "Could not foresee any situation in which this person would be asked to write for us again."

'A Life Amongst Strangers' also states that Gaughan had contacted Wyngarde's agent, Thomas Bowington of Bowington Management https://bowingtonmanagement.uk/ to request assistance in penning a "Peter Wyngarde biography" (P.449), but was thwarted by Wyngarde-Hopkins trademarking Wyngarde's name. It's just a suggestion, but it might be worth someone contacting Bowington to get his take on all of this: [email protected]

I have to say that I find it rather distasteful that the main contributors to the biography on this website are still quoting from Gavin Gaughan's obituary given the criticism that's been levelled at it both by the public and those within the entertainment industry. It's evident that Gaughan had a vendetta against Wyngarde and/or his appreciation society and that almost all of his obit was made up of unsubstantiated tittle-tattle and his own undisguised venom (the "in the manner of a cat walking on tiptoe, with an air of self-satisfaction", line being a case in point). As one member of the public so aptly put it, this "obituary" had saved Gaughan the trouble of having to locate Wyngarde's grave and pissing on it!

Returning to the barbed comment about social security: The newspaper article that Gaughan is said to have taken this assertion from was supposedly published around the time that Flash Gordon was in cinemas, which was late 1980. Wyngarde would only have been in his fifties then and therefore not eligible for a state pension. TheWoolpack (talk) 19:14, 7 July 2022 (UTC)

Woolpack, are you sockpuppetting? ColinProbert (talk) 20:01, 13 July 2022 (UTC)

ColinProbert, this talk page is for discussion on improving the article, not about editor conduct. If you have evidence of socking that you feel is enough to file for a SPI then I encourage you to do that, otherwise, offer something constructive to the conversation and please stop being disruptive. Thank you. --ARoseWolf 15:17, 14 July 2022 (UTC)

ARoseWolf, apologies for childishness will behave better in future. ColinProbert (talk) 17:06, 14 July 2022 (UTC)

Just to say, I have now deleted this information. It did always seem to have a tone of not being neutral. Theheartof (talk) 08:35, 19 July 2023 (UTC)

Peter Wyngarde

I think reference to Peter Wyngarde as a possible homosexua/Bisexual l fair enough but in reference to actor Alan Bates seems to depend on only 1 source there needs to be at least 3 sources I would have thought . So I would drop the references to Alan Bates as it can't be the case that there is only 1 source and just keep the rest about him.

Andrew Dock Andrew Dock 65 (talk) 23:11, 7 February 2023 (UTC)

Disregard and pardon of 1975 conviction

I am told that yesterday his appreciation society's Facebook page (members only) announced the very good news that his 1975 gross indecency offence has been disregarded and posthumously pardoned by the Home Office under this scheme:

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/disregarding-convictions-for-decriminalised-sexual-offences

Nothing is in the public domain, but if and when there is, it will be important to rewrite and explain the events in the "Personal life" section in order to be respectful (which I would say it already is) and lawful, and to meet the Home Office's requirements for discussion of disregarded offences.

While there may be a question over how his offence could be disregarded when sexual activity in a public toilet is still an offence under the Sexual Offences Act 2003, and is specifically excluded from the system for disregards, the important and very welcome takeaway is that a disregard and pardon for this victimless crime appears to have been granted by the Home Office. It is both noteworthy and very long overdue. Theheartof (talk) 15:50, 6 July 2023 (UTC)

His official website now includes a report on the disregarded offence, and a screenshot of the confirmation email from the Home Office.

https://peterwyngarde.uk/2019/05/09/news/ [Second news item at time of writing]

Any thoughts on whether and how this update should this be brought into the article? Or does doing so just draw more attention to a matter that is now disregarded? Or is it a moot point because of the type of source? Theheartof (talk) 14:17, 14 August 2023 (UTC)

No specific views on this I guess. I will go ahead and add it to the Personal Life section as something that has been asserted, not proven. In the context I think it's worth noting, but I'm also happy to bear other editors' views on that. Theheartof (talk) 10:23, 21 August 2023 (UTC)

Sources clarification

What's the connection/ distinction between peterwyngarde.uk and the wordpress site (which, per https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reliable_sources/Perennial_sources, shouldn't be cited anyway)? If the former is, as mentioned above, his "official site" (run by whom?), what is the other? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.24.233.100 (talk) 03:48, 13 January 2024 (UTC)

There's also a lot of direct citation of B/M/D certificates rather than secondary sources discussing them, which is also deprecated on Wikipedia. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.24.233.100 (talk) 03:51, 13 January 2024 (UTC)

On examination, the reliance of this article on the Wordpress source is staggering... it seems totally unofficial, a "fan-blog" run by someone who wrote his biography based on anecdotes with no reference to anything official at all or that one might check for corroboration (as many Amazon reviews observe), and therefore unreliable- this in line with the concept, per the Reliable sources guidelines as above, that Wordpress allows anyone to type up anything. For it to be cited here in Wikipedia is... very much NOT to the project's credit. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.24.233.100 (talk) 04:29, 13 January 2024 (UTC)

Also, WAY too many primary sources- meaning original research which is against Wikipedia guidelines- lacking any published sources for corroboration... — Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.24.234.167 (talk) 05:17, 3 February 2024 (UTC)

They are the same site. It was built with Wordpress but now uses that URL peterwyngarde.uk.

The unreliability of any published source about this subject is part of the story, it seems, hence the (over) reliance on primary sources. Theheartof (talk) 16:31, 22 February 2024 (UTC)