Talk:Manchester United F.C. Under-21s and Academy

Academy article

Does http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manchester_United_F.C._Academy not fit in with this. There seems to be edits to the squad in the other page which then are missed out of this one and visa-versa. -

You've got my support on this one. The info in the two articles is largely the same anyway. - PeeJay 07:02, 14 June 2007 (UTC)

I am largley responsible for creating this page, and would agree with joining it with the academy page as long as it was titled the same to include the resreves. - consulrjo

Delete it

I think we should just delete the academy page, everything on there is on the reserves/academy page so it is no longer needed.

I'd concur. I've been responsible for creating/updating the academy page and it makes no real sense having that separate. One other thing I would say is that on this page, there seems to be a strong desire to only make changes that are confirmed by the official club website - i don't really see the need for that, especially when the official site is so slack when it comes to updating the reserve/academy sections (example - the club confirmed a couple of weeks ago they'd offered pro deals to a few of the academy graduates, so there's no reason why these shouldn't now be added to the reserve squad, but the official site haven't got round to doing so yet.) - NickOGS20

40 & 41

Anything I submit will inevitably be deleted so I will direct you to United's club page on uefa.com, where you'll find two new squad numbers listed JPMJPMJPM 21:40, 14 September 2007 (UTC)

Looks pretty official, but would you mind if we waited until the new numbers were confirmed by the club themselves? - PeeJay 22:10, 14 September 2007 (UTC)

Looks even more official now, but unless he gets on, this is not sufficient as evidence, no? Excuse me if I am not familiar with every clause and subclause of your rulebook. JPMJPMJPM 19:18, 26 September 2007 (UTC)

Rhain Davies

Well? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 124.184.156.108 (talk) 16:40, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

Well what? Rhain Davis is not in the Manchester United Academy. – PeeJay 16:48, 22 December 2007 (UTC)

What is the deal with him anyway, is he "signed" to Manchester United for the future? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 58.168.94.143 (talk) 10:25, 5 March 2008 (UTC)

He's currently training with the club's Under-10s, IIRC, and due to his age, he can't move to another club for a few years. – PeeJay 10:49, 5 March 2008 (UTC)

Notable former Academy and Youth Team players

I believe this section could do with trimming, as I'd argue against the notability of some of the listed players. However, rather than just doing it, can we come to some sort of consensus on who to include? Darkson (Yabba Dabba Doo!) 10:47, 10 March 2008 (UTC)

I see no real reason to trim this personally - all of the retired players on there certainly merit inclusion for their achievements, while the vast majority of current players listed have played/are playing at the highest level in club football and/or are full internationals. Of the few that don't meet this criteria (and I believe we're talking 3/4 at most), the likes of Blake and Shawcross have been recently voted as among the very strongest players outside the Premier League in England and (in the latter's case) have recieved under 21 honours for their country. Nick OGS20 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.67.123.204 (talk) 22:47, 1 April 2008 (UTC)

Cameron Stewart

Have reverted his nationality to English, couldn't fit an explanation into the edit summary box so i'll put it here - Stewart is English but qualifies for Scotland via a parent/grandparent. He has recently been named in Scotland under-17 squads but hasn't taken up the invitation to join up with them, instead preferring to continue representing England at that level (and indeed he played for England u17's last week, check www.thefa.com for details). - NickOGS20 23:55, 1 April 2008 (UTC)

OK, I've changed Stewart's nationality back to English, as I reverted a big edit a few mins ago. However, I couldn't find any evidence that Tom Cleverley or Chris Fagan are officially in the Reserves, or that anyone named Joshua King or Oliver Brady were in the club's youth squads. – PeeJay 23:07, 1 April 2008 (UTC)

Hi. I'll copy over what I just wrote on your talk page, save me typing it again:

Re: Reserves & Academy Edits:

Edit 1 - Tom Cleverley being added to the reserve squad. Cleverley is the current United reserves captain whilst Kieran Lee is out on loan. A quick check of the match reports on the official site will show he has been practically an ever-present in the last few months. He has also yesterday been nominated by the United reserves coaching staff for the Reserve Player of the Year Award, as shown on this page of the official website - [1]. Surely being nominated for that suggest he is a member of the reserve team squad?

Edit 2 - Chris Fagan being added to the reserve squad. Proof - [2]. Again, a quick read through a few match reports in the reserve section of the official site will confirm Fagan is a member of the reserve squad.

Edit 3 - Cameron Stewart's nationality being reverted to English - please see the explanation on the discussion section of the Reserves/Academy page.

Edit 4 - adding Joshua King and Robert Brady to the future scholars section. If you want to do away with the future scholars section then fine, but if not, I fail to see why these two can't be added. both players were relatively high-profile acquisitions (as far as youth players go) in January, they will be taken on on scholarships this summer and information on their acquisitions and presence at the club is easily available via google. Brady played for the reserve team last week, King for the under 18's on Saturday morning. Again with the greatest of respect, and this applies for the above edits too, this is pretty basic stuff and information I'd expect someone taking responsibility for moderating this page to have some knowledge of, or at least attempt to investigate before dismissing as incorrect. - NickOGS20 00:18 2 April 2008 —Preceding comment was added at 23:18, 1 April 2008 (UTC)

Cleanup Needed

I've just edited the positions to fall in line with the rest of the football world. Another think I'd like to be seen done is for the squad list of the Academy to be formatted in the way any other football squad is formatted using the relevant template. I also don't understand the need for players to be listed twice on this page..in both the Reserves and Academy sections e.g., Tom Cleverley. ForeverDevil (talk) 12:24, 30 July 2008 (UTC)

Was about to look at an audit of the Academy squad list. My assumption is that the only qualification for listing players under the Academy head are those listed as this on the official website? ForeverDevil (talk) 16:51, 3 August 2008 (UTC)

Yes, that's it. Unless you have a copy of the club yearbook for 2008, in which case you should use the list in there. – PeeJay 17:07, 3 August 2008 (UTC)

Reserve squad

What about the likes of Devlin & Dudgeon who have featured in many reserve games this season surely they should be added to the reserve squad list unless we are just going by who's on the roster on the reserve profiles page?? cooki2222 (talk) 13:25, 23 June 2009 (UTC)

Got it in one. We're going by the reserve team list on the official site. – PeeJay 12:02, 19 May 2009 (UTC)

Daniel Galbraith

What happened to Daniel Galbraith? RicoRichmond (talk) 13:43, 8 July 2009 (UTC)

IIRC, he's been sold to Hibs. – PeeJay 14:08, 8 July 2009 (UTC)

You sure? He's still listed on the Manchester United site. RicoRichmond (talk) 21:23, 8 July 2009 (UTC)

The Man Utd site is notoriously unreliable for up-to-the-minute info on the club's squads. Anyway, this BBC report would seem to confirm the matter. – PeeJay 21:30, 8 July 2009 (UTC)

Fair enough. RicoRichmond (talk) 23:49, 8 July 2009 (UTC)

Liam McClair

How do we know he's Scottish? Brian McClair was Scottish, but was Liam not born in England? How do we know that he has chosen to be identified as a Scottish International? Is there any sourcing for this? RicoRichmond (talk) 13:18, 9 July 2009 (UTC)

I don't think that Liam's place of birth has much to do with his nationality in this case. Brian McClair is one of the most Scottish people around, so it's fairly certain that Liam identifies as Scottish too. – PeeJay 13:49, 9 July 2009 (UTC)

Your probably right. I just thought there might be a source on it somewhere. RicoRichmond (talk) 07:15, 11 July 2009 (UTC)

Liam McClair should probably be removed from the page - he hasn't played for the academy since August 2007 and was removed from the official site academy player list months ago. Oliver Gill has also now signed professional (see news item on official site last week) so is no longer an academy student. - NickOGS20 (talk) 22:23, 11 July 2009 (UTC)

Is Liam McClair no longer with the club at all then? I can find him on any of the current squad pages on the club's official website. – PeeJay 22:35, 11 July 2009 (UTC)

As far as I know he left in 2007, very shortly after initially being announced as an academy student, but the official site kept his profile up for about a year, while last season's yearbook still inexplicably included him (no real shock given the usual lack of accuracy of both those). He was taken off the official site player list at some point last season and definitely isn't at the club now (or any other club as far as I know). NickOGS20 (talk) 22:46, 11 July 2009 (UTC)

Jack Dean

is now at fulham. he should be deleted. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.60.246.109 (talk) 20:49, 7 January 2010 (UTC)

Can you prove that? – PeeJay 21:37, 7 January 2010 (UTC)

sorry. here is his profile. http://www.fulhamfc.com/Club/Academy/PlayerProfiles.aspx and to make sure, its really our jack dean, hes also in this article about josh pritchard (who also is a former manutd scholar) http://www.fulhamfc.com/Club/News/NewsArticles/2009/November/ThroughTheRanks.aspx —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.226.86.243 (talk) 17:20, 9 January 2010 (UTC)

Academy Section

What are we using as a source for this? Surely players like Macheda are no longer academy players. And why are we using a different table to that used above in the Reserves section.

I would have though we would have used: http://www.manutd.com/default.sps?pagegid={A4EE59F6-31C1-4AAB-8038-9EF74A45166F}&teamid=437&page=2 as a source? Tom (talk) 16:26, 22 July 2010 (UTC)

I've been using the list of academy students that can be found in the official club yearbook each year. – PeeJay 16:53, 22 July 2010 (UTC)

Cameron Stewart

Just wanted to explain an edit I've made to the reserves squad concerning Cameron Stewart - while he is on loan at Yeovil, that deal is a 'Youth' loan, which means he's still eligible for our reserves. As he appears to be a regular for the reserves (report from last night's match here) I thought it was better to show that he was still part of our squad. —Preceding unsigned comment added by RSB689908 (talk • contribs) 15:49, 24 September 2010 (UTC)

That's interesting. I'd never heard of a "youth" loan before today! – PeeJay 22:39, 24 September 2010 (UTC)

Loans ended

According to the "on loan" section, it says that Corry Evans is at Carlisle United until the 21st of November, and that Oliver Norwood is also at Carlisle, although his loan ended on the 17th of November. Shouldn't we remove them from the "on loan" section because their loans have ended? Velociraptor888 07:40, 23 November 2010 (UTC)

If you think something needs changing, just bloody change it! – PeeJay 01:36, 25 November 2010 (UTC)

Manchester and Lancashire Senior Cup

In the beginnings, these two cups were played by the senior team, not by the reserves. I would suggest putting the early cup winnings in the senior Manchester United FC article. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.217.160.189 (talk) 12:09, 25 December 2010 (UTC)

Section Notable former Academy and Youth Team players; Take 2

I think we should reword the area and have only players who represented their country in senior international game. We can remove the "...regularly at a high level of club football.", almost all United players who been in the academy end up playing in one team or another, and also in thier country in those under-XY teams. Right now the list is incomplete with at least more than 50 years of missing players. What everyone else think? maybe even remove it completely? as its far from been an encyclopedic table and adding of needed citations.
  – HonorTheKing (talk) 15:37, 11 August 2011 (UTC)

100% agree, I was thinking the same thing a few days ago. doomgaze (talk) 15:44, 11 August 2011 (UTC)

I am glad you think the same, Do you think the first option of rewording is better than the second option of removing it entirely?
  – HonorTheKing (talk) 16:40, 11 August 2011 (UTC)

I also agree. If we limit it to players who have made an international appearance, that would probably be sufficient, although it may end up including some randomers and excluding some fairly prominent players. – PeeJay 18:32, 11 August 2011 (UTC)

I think we should at least give the only-international-apps criterion a shot. I'm not sure how long the list would be, might be a bit trickier for older players. When was the academy even founded? The article doesn't say. doomgaze (talk) 21:50, 11 August 2011 (UTC)

I think we'd be looking at the 1930s, when the MUJAC (Manchester United Junior Athletic Club) was founded. – PeeJay 21:52, 11 August 2011 (UTC)

Ok, I will redo this tonight and will see how it will look.
  – HonorTheKing (talk) 09:40, 12 August 2011 (UTC)

Gyliano van Velzen

Shouldn't he be in the current squad? The official site lists him in the under 21s profiles. (KOwool (talk) 06:42, 12 February 2013 (UTC))

Blackett And James

Where have they gone/ They aren't listed in either the under 21's or first team squad.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.234.75.43 (talk) 14:43, 24 July 2014 (UTC) 

First team or Reserve squad

Sean Goss and James Weir are listed in both the 1st team and reserves. They are different teams that train separate therefore they need to be in one or the other. The same can be said about Marcus Rashford and Axel Tuanzebe in the 2nd year scholars so why are these listed twice when they have progressed into the first team.

They're listed twice because the sources (i.e. the squad lists on the club website) list them twice. How can you know which squad the players train with? The only reliable source we have is the club website. – PeeJay 18:32, 14 January 2016 (UTC)

Man Utd twitter tells when players are promoted to 1st team training. Such as for the Champions League last training session, Regan Poole and Sean Goss were promoted.

Training with the first team isn't always a permanent thing. How do you even know the first team and reserves don't always train together, with separate training for the under-18s? This whole discussion is moot anyway, as we have reliable sources for who should be included in each list. Please stop messing with that. – PeeJay 10:13, 15 January 2016 (UTC)

2016/17

The new players have been added to the official websites for the under 21's & under 18's wold you be kind to amend this page? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.100.171.185 (talk) 15:46, 1 July 2016 (UTC)

Done — Preceding unsigned comment added by RJ 97 (talk • contribs) 11:11, 3 July 2016 (UTC)

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Squad Numbers

Can we please only use the clubs official webpages for squad numbers? Dean Henderson, Joe Riley & Regan Poole have no official number listed on the website so why are we presuming they have the numbers 34,41,49

Because they were given those numbers last season and we have no reason to assume the number has since been rescinded. – PeeJay 16:22, 10 July 2017 (UTC)

By the way, those numbers came from UEFA.com, as the players were given those numbers for the Europa League campaign. – PeeJay 16:29, 10 July 2017 (UTC)

So are you saying that once the new squad numbers are out for 17/18 they may be removed? Also Max Johnstone the GK had the number 34 on his training top last week — Preceding unsigned comment added by 5.198.42.106 (talk) 17:48, 10 July 2017 (UTC)

Yes, it's possible that they may be removed if they're not listed in a few weeks. And training shirt numbers aren't related to a player's squad number; sometimes they're the same, other times they bear absolutely no relation. – PeeJay 18:01, 10 July 2017 (UTC)

Is it possible to add squad numbers to the U18 and U23 players. The official Man Utd website shows the players wearing their official squad numbers on the photos with-in their profiles, thanks — Preceding unsigned comment added by 5.198.42.106 (talk) 15:30, 10 July 2018 (UTC)

Those are just their training numbers. For first-team players, those numbers do match up with their training numbers, but unless a player has been officially registered with the Premier League or UEFA with a specific squad number, we shouldn't add it here. – PeeJay 16:07, 10 July 2018 (UTC)

Jacob Carney

Jacob Carney needs leaving as a 1st year scholar and not kept on moving to a 2nd year scholar.

The offical Man Utd website states Jacob is a 1st year scholar in the 2018/19 intake, for 2017/18 he was an academy student. This year he becomes a 1st year scholar — Preceding unsigned comment added by 5.198.42.106 (talk) 11:37, 8 July 2018 (UTC)

Thanks for the info. However, he did join the club in July 2017, so I've changed that back in the article. – PeeJay 20:35, 8 July 2018 (UTC)

First team, reserves and honours

The Manchester United Reserves won the Manchester Senior Cup for the first time in 1999. In this article there are titles won by the first team. The fact that some people considered "minor honours" doesn't allow them to misinform — Preceding unsigned comment added by Angel Millo (talk • contribs) 04:55, 26 November 2018 (UTC)

Agreed, have removed the ones noted before that. Govvy (talk) 09:14, 23 July 2023 (UTC)

Squad number columns

There is not a squad number column for the U18s some of these players have squad numbers due to playing in the EFL trophy, can a squad number column be added? 5.198.42.106 (talk) 15:21, 11 September 2020 (UTC)

info boxes

Why does the page have two separate info boxes on it? I am inclined to remove the second one as most of it is just repeated information from the top most box. Do others agree? Govvy (talk) 09:16, 19 August 2023 (UTC)

No, it's quite clear they refer to different aspects. – PeeJay 09:30, 19 August 2023 (UTC)