Talk:List of Chris Evans performances

This Page contained mistakes. (Now resolved).

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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This list contains two errors of a basic nature. I have been unable to correct these mistakes because of editors who stand by the reliability of the sources.

I refer specifically to Perfect Assassins 1999 and Cherry Falls 2000. Chris Evans did not appear in either of these films. The sources for these entries either say the role is credited to Christopher Evans who is a different actor or to two other online newspaper sources, which refer mistakenly to Chris Evans. The presumption that Christopher Evans and Chris Evans are one and the same person is wrong. Chris Evans has never used the name Christopher Evans professionally. He would certainly never alternate between the names switching them as many as five times as implied by this list. Actors register the name they use professionally and do not use two different ones especially in the early stages of their career. There is actually no credible evidence that Christopher Evans and Chris Evans are the same actor but I have below pointed to much evidence that prove they are not. The two online newspaper sources quoted which credit the roles in these two films to Chris Evans stand in opposition to all other reliable sources and even general knowledge about Chris Evans career. The editors of this page have chosen to go against the broad balance of informed opinion and stick with two anomalies, which I personally believe were probably based on the misunderstanding I mention above.

When you actually look at the sources provided in the list next to these two films they are cause for concern. The TV Guide source quoted for Perfect Assassins when followed actually makes no reference to Chris Evans at all so cannot be offered as a source. I would add that the IMDb cast page for this film again mentions only a Christopher Evans whose linked filmography is clearly not that of Chris Evans

The TV Guide source for Cherry Falls only mentions a 'Christopher Evans' with no photo so is not acceptable as a source as it's the wrong name. IMDb's page for Cherry Falls mentions only Christopher Evans. If you actually click on Christopher Evans name (again there is no photo) and follow the link it lists the actor as appearing in only Cherry Falls and a film with no association to Chris Evans called No Retreat From Destiny . It is clear again that Christopher Evans is not the same actor as Chris Evans.

The wiki page for Cherry Falls makes no reference to the actor Christopher Evans at all. I realise that a wikilink cannot be used a reliable source but none of the 18 'reliable sources' accepted for use throughout that article actually link to any information suggesting Chris Evans was in this film. This would seem unlikely if the Christopher Evans in it were the same as Chris Evans. Somebody at some time would surely have mentioned it.

Therefore of the 4 sources offered only two makes the claim that Chris Evans (not Christopher Evans) starred in these two films. Taken on balance their inclusion of these two films stands out against the overwhelming majority of published filmographies of Chris Evans which make no reference to them. I include as examples the Chris Evans filmography on his IMDb page , a different filmography by TV Guide , Rotten Tomatoes , Fandango , Book My Show etc

Wiki encourages people to make changes when they see mistakes or if they can improve an article . Consequently, I tried to to delete these mistakes but my edits were undone on the grounds that there are 'sources' which mention these films.

I don't intend to attempt to edit this page again only to have my edit undone. I do call upon the compiler of this otherwise excellent list to do further research and, having now been challenged as to the reliability of their sources, to come up with more credible proof or hopefully to just delete the mistakes themselves.Blotski (talk) 10:11, 24 January 2020 (UTC)

Hello @Blotski:! Your points reference alot of IMDb which Wikipedia does not constitute as a reliable source - please see WP:CITEIMDB. There is a reliable source here, that mentions he was in Cherry Falls but does not give a character name. Where as TV guide mention both his character name and movie title. Same for the references on Perfect Assassins - The New York Times lists it as part of his filmography, and TV guide cross references it with his character name. All of those references are from reliable sources, where as IMDb is not which is why your previous edits have been reverted. Wikipedia does encourage editors to WP:BE BOLD but not when it goes against content guidelines and reliable sourcing. If you have any other questions or concerns, please feel free to address them here. LADY LOTUS • TALK 21:02, 24 January 2020 (UTC)

Hi @Lady Lotus: Surprising that IMDb is not a reliable source. The problem is how to refute claims which justify themselves with references to sources which themselves contain an error. You referenced TV Guide as some justification for your support of the undoing of my edit. These refer to an actor called Christopher Evans not Chris Evans so I would say their inclusion is inadmissable and unless you can prove beyond doubt that Christopher Evans and Chris Evans are the same people your TV Guide sources are unreliable. I included IMDb because the person who deleted my edit quoted them as justification, whereas in fact they back up my argument as IMDb never refer to Christopher Evans and Chris Evans as being the same actor.

This just leaves us with the the NYT and the Scotsman (not readable without registration) which I believe contain errors most likely based on this same mistaken presumption that the actor Christopher Evans is Chris Evans . I point out that the vast body of reliable information on Chris Evans' career, such as the ones I mention above and many others make no reference to either film. If you claim the two sources are correct then presumably by implication all the other filmographies of a far greater number which do NOT mention Perfect Assassins and Cherry Falls are therefore incorrect. Can one prove they are incorrect? I am being asked to prove the NYT and the Scotsman article are incorrect so it is only fair that others come up with evidence of equal validity that all the other sources are incorrect by omission. It's not easy to do. However, I have contacted the author of The Scotsman article and she admits her mistake and offered the BFI links I use below . I presume Twitter is not a reliable source but she does have a verified account as you can see.

I can now therefore offer these two further sources from the British Film Institute. One for the actor Christopher Evans who was in Cherry Falls and another for the Chris Evans of this article which makes no mention of Cherry Falls Along with the separate Rotten Tomatoes sources for Christopher Evans and Chris Evans , the former mentioning Cherry Falls and the latter omitting it, these throw sufficient doubt on the sources quoted to question their reliability.

Would I actually have to find a reliable source specifically stating that he did not appear in these two films? How and why would such an article exist?

I have now offered at least 8 sources to show Chris Evans and Christopher Evans are not the same people.

The reliable source rule is intended to keep Wikipedia accurate. Used as an inflexible algorythm without common sense it can become the opposite.

Blotski (talk) 22:17, 24 January 2020 (UTC)

Hello @Blotski:,@Lady Lotus:

I believe that blotski has proved beyond any reasonable doubt that the actor in those two films was Christopher Evans who is someone other than Chris Evans. He has quoted many sources to prove this. Therefore the other point is also proven - that the NYT and Scotsman articles must be mistaken. If Christopher Evans and Chris Evans are two different actors then those other two other sources are wrong. I also saw the tweet by the author of The Scotsman article who seems to admit her mistake. Evansarmy (talk) 12:55, 25 January 2020 (UTC)

@Evansarmy:, I understand that both you and Blotski are fans of Chris Evans and have a passionate interest in his Wikipedia pages but I would like to remind you both to WP:BENICE. I never said it was a closed case, that those 2 films would stay on his filmography for ever, I merely explained why they were included and kept. Alot of new users think that IMDb is the end-all-be-all source for movies but it’s the fact that it is user based and not checked that makes it not reliable. I can look into this situation deeper with the references you have given but the editor who got this page promoted spent a great deal of time and effort into referencing it appropriately as they are probably a Chris Evans fan themselves so I would just ask for patience while this is resolved. LADY LOTUS • TALK 13:09, 25 January 2020 (UTC)

@Lady Lotus: I apologise that my irritation is so obvious. You're right that I am an Evans fan. I have been following his career for over ten years and have been an active member of purely career based 'fansites' (I'm a straight male) for as long. Frustratingly, although many sites contains the most thoroughly researched material they are not admissible as a sources by wiki criteria. On the other hand, one article written by a journalist who is far from an expert carries more weight. Whilst I fully understand the reasons, it can be a weakness in the system. I did check to the point of finding a copy of Cherry Hills and watching it all the way through to make sure Chris Evans wasn't in it. He isn't. I don't know anything about the compiler and I don't doubt their good motives and I congratulate them for the rest of the list. Blotski (talk) 13:55, 25 January 2020 (UTC)

@Blotski:,@Lady Lotus: The reason for the irritation on my part is the resistance to advice and the constant harking back to sources which don't stand up to scrutiny. If blotski's actually sat and watched Cherry Hills I would like to ask the compiler if they have done the same. It's a real shame because this list is otherwise really extensive and could gain a really good reputation. Evansarmy (talk) 19:23, 25 January 2020 (UTC)

I've removed Perfect Assassins and Cherry Falls. There is no film called Perfect Assassins released in 1999. There is a television film from 1998. The NYT source is actually sourced to AllMovies per the bottom line, which currently does not list the film in his filmography, [[1]]. The TV Guide source only indicates a person called Christopher Evans appeared in the role but not necessarily that it's the same person. I fear it's a case of mistaken identity. For Cherry Falls, as described above The Scotsman article seems to have been poorly sourced as the author has now retracted that bit, the TV Guide again only indicated a person called Christopher Evans. As an aside, I have a copy of Cherry Falls and the relevant scene which is a disturbing flashback sequence does not contain Chris Evans. In both cases, I would expect more corroborating evidence than the TV Guide sources as these are earlier more obscure films and they allegedly have him under different name (per TV Guide) to the rest of his filmography.

Finally, a word of advice to both Blotski and Evansarmy, it's good that as fans, you're attentive and want to help ensure accuracy of an article. However the conduct you've shown above is unbecoming. Throwing insults and showing haughty disdain towards people will serve you poorly in interactions on here and in real life. Try to take a step back and consider how best to communicate ideas rather than typing out your thoughts without a filter. Cowlibob (talk) 00:15, 26 January 2020 (UTC)

Many thanks to Cowlibob for this. I agree 100% with everything you say and accept all your criticisms. I apologise unreservedly for the tone of some of the things I said. Well, maybe I have one reservation. I am less experienced on how to actually use wikipedia than many others. When I originally deleted Cherry Falls and Perfect Assassins, which I knew to be mistakes I wish I had laid out my reasons in the way I did and now you have on the talk page but to be honest I didn't really know at the time how to do that. My irritation never stemmed from the original mistakes. It was due to my deletions being undone with the original sources being quoted as reasons for the retention of the mistakes. This was in a conversation which did not take place on this page. I was called upon to prove what I felt had already been proven. I thank you for your excellent reasoning above which aligns with my own minus a few other sources I mentioned such as the British Film Institute. I note my screenshots of Christopher Evans and link to a video of the scene in Cherry Falls have been deleted. If anybody wishes to see the screeshots they are here https://imgur.com/a/PnAz1y7 and the video is here https://imgur.com/radLYJ2. Let's hope your edit is not undone as happened to me. I am explaining my irritation not excusing it. I apologise and will be sure to be more patient with my tone in future. I should add that ironically I was trying to avoid an 'edit war'. Having had my edit undone I felt nervous about just repeating my deletion so I resolved to prove on this page that sources used to justify the 'undo' were unreliable in the hope that somebody else would delete the two errors. This is finally what has happened thanks to you. Blotski (talk) 10:10, 26 January 2020 (UTC)

Yeah, I likewise apologise for my tone and will delete some of my remarks. I would hold off being too harsh on Blotski until you're sure your well argued and logical edit is has not been undone in a similar way. In the end, had he not started this discussion and made the points he did the mistakes would still be in place. Again, apologies for my previous tone. Evansarmy (talk) 12:09, 26 January 2020 (UTC)

References

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

He was born in 2340

He was born in 2340 5.179.181.140 (talk) 11:31, 24 January 2023 (UTC)