Talk:Kasta Tomb

Hades vs. Pluto

The reference to Pluto was recently modified towards Hades, under the assumption that Hades is the classical Greek name, and Pluto is the Roman name. This is wrong. Pluto and Hades are both Greek names. Just read the Pluto wikipedia article. The Greek article I inserted refers to Pluto rather than Hades, but that does not mean it is correct. I'd appreciate guidance to figure out which of the two Greek names is correct in the context of a Macedonian tomb/cenotaph. Thanks! Vincent Lextrait (talk) 11:37, 18 October 2014 (UTC)

The similar name in Greek is Plouton which stands for Hades while the Roman equivalent is Pluto. I had a look at the Pluto article you are suggesting but I really think it needs some work to correct the ambiguities it introduces. When it comes to Greek mythology Hades should be the established name for the particular deity; e.g. in Persephone#Abduction_myth the whole article refers to the god as Hades in accordance to the myth. And to the best of my knowledge Hades is very rarely referred to as Plouton in both ancient and modern Greek. Furthermore, Hades is a less ambiguous term than Pluto(may refer to the planet or other topics as per Pluto_(disambiguation)

User:Gts-tg (talk) 11:51, 18 October 2014 (UTC)

Also have a look at the talk at Talk:Pluto_(mythology)#Merge_with_Hades where it is evident that Pluto is the Roman counterpart; actually the entire talk page there is one huge succession of arguments and counterarguments on whether Pluto is Roman only or not!

User:Gts-tg (talk) — Preceding undated comment added 11:55, 18 October 2014 (UTC)

And about the Greek article source(in English), it does state the god as Pluto but I do believe it is wrong to do so as Pluto instead of Plouton as a spelling

User:Gts-tg (talk) 12:12, 18 October 2014 (UTC)

Thanks, George! I had read the section on Persephone abduction, and if you look at the section right after it: Persephone#Interpretation_of_the_myth, it refers to Pluto, not Hades. I am no expert whatsoever, I just want to point out possible inconsistencies. Vincent Lextrait (talk) 12:49, 18 October 2014 (UTC)

Yeah I know...It looks like a very consistent inconsistency! I'm no expert either, but it just feels strange to me to see Pluto instead of Hades when it comes to Greek mythology. The closest I would think of would be Plouton but this name redirects to the Pluto article in Wikipedia. User:Gts-tg (talk) 13:13, 18 October 2014 (UTC)

It seems that the announcement from the Greek Ministry of Culture here: [1] talks about Pluto rather than Hades? I do not read Greek, but I know the alphabet, and "Πλούτωνα και την Περσεφόνη" sounds very much like "Pluto and Persephone", rather than "Hades and Persephone". Vincent Lextrait (talk) 14:16, 18 October 2014 (UTC)

The Greek version should be transliterated to Plouton and Persephone I think rather than Pluto which I still believe is wrong. I think it's a case where in the English language the Roman names are used more often than the Greek ones(E.g. Hercules instead of Herakles). If you feel strongly about it though can we instead of making it Pluto change the name in this article to Plouton instead which is correct? It will redirect to Pluto_(mythology) which may or may not be correct but at least Plouton is more suitable User:Gts-tg (talk) 15:32, 18 October 2014 (UTC)

Hi there. The preference of Pluto over Hades can be explained because Hades is also used for the underworld itself, as a location. Nevertheless, as the source (the Ministry of Culture) says Pluto, then Pluto (mythology) it is... --FocalPoint (talk) 15:08, 28 October 2014 (UTC)

Although I believe Pluto to be incorrect and Plouton the more correct version with regards to Greek Mythology(btw Hades is being referred to as a god as well, not just the place), unfortunately I have to agree to follow the standards of the Greek Ministry of Culture translation which mentions Pluto. As a last effort I am asking to at least consider having Plouton instead of Pluto(it will redirect to Pluto) Gts-tg (talk) 18:46, 31 October 2014 (UTC)

I agree that Plouton is the more accurate transliteration for the Πλούτων, but it is very rare in English, even among people who use "Herakles", "Hephaistos" and "Ganymedes". If accuracy is to trump common usage, then we should probably go all the way and use "Ploútōn". Furius (talk) 18:58, 2 November 2014 (UTC)

English latinizes common Greek names, as with Aeschylus, not Aiskhulos. But we should avoid this form more than most; it begs to be confused with Ploutos and the nymph Plouto. But then I was just listening to a classics professor recall how, when he was young, he thought Arkhilokhos cool; he doesn't now. Septentrionalis PMAnderson 23:08, 10 November 2014 (UTC)

And we have guidance on this. WP:Naming conventions (Greek). Septentrionalis PMAnderson 23:11, 10 November 2014 (UTC)

Confusion with Ploutos, being common in Ancient Greek would be a feature not a bug, while confusion with Plouto would be fairly unlikely owing to her relative obscurity, but I agree that Plouton is simply un-English (Or do you mean "Pluto" by "this form"?). I don't think the link offers much guidance on the question of Pluto vs Hades, which are both in common use in English.

Did your professor offer any rationale for changing his opinion on Arkhilokhos, or has he just forgotten what it is like to be (k)hip and (k)happening? Furius (talk) 01:16, 11 November 2014 (UTC)

In an encyclopedia, confusion is never a feature. It's doubtful that hipness is. If you want happening, Urbandictionary is the third door on the left. Septentrionalis PMAnderson 05:28, 11 January 2015 (UTC)

Head of one of the sphinxes found

The head of one of the two sphinxes was found in the 4th chamber. This is the reference from the greek ministry of culture. http://www.yppo.gr/2/g22.jsp?obj_id=58894

Maybe on of the editors could add this info. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2001:648:2800:85:183C:467A:249D:352F (talk) 10:59, 22 October 2014 (UTC)

Hi, I've been working mostly on the Greek article that has a wealth of information at el:Τύμβος_Καστά. Once there are a few more findings and I get some time I will update the English one too, if one doesn't do so before. For the time being I'm just placing whatever pictures I find in here as well. But when it comes to editing, you can edit the article yourself too. Hope this helps User:Gts-tg (talk) 11:03, 24 October 2014 (UTC)

Btw, I've added the marble head info for the time being User:Gts-tg (talk) 11:05, 24 October 2014 (UTC)

SVG graphic

With regards to this edit the discussion is at the Wikimedia Commons talk page User:Gts-tg (talk) 14:03, 28 October 2014 (UTC)

I see that the issue has been resolved, but the image is a hypothetical sketch. I believe that since there is a lot of concrete information about the issue, we should leave out such guesswork. I am, therefore, deleting the picture from the gallery. --FocalPoint (talk) 15:00, 28 October 2014 (UTC)

Kasta Tomb vs Casta tomb for the article's name

What do you guys think about the more "Anglicised" term Casta Tomb that is used by the international media (alongside with the term Kasta Tomb)?

In Greece, most places of prominent international value, which start with the letter 'K', are often named with the anglicized 'C' rather than the traditional Greek 'K'.

For example, several places in Greece have anglicised names such as Costa Navarino instead of Kosta Navarino, Crete instead of Krete, and even people names such as Constantine instead of Konstantine, and even last names such as Callas instead of Kallas, etc. Shouldn't the Amphipolis tomb's area fall under the same category? I think Casta Tomb for the article's name could be more "appropriate" for use, although Kasta Tomb is absolutely valid and very original. -AuditoreEzio (talk) 04:29, 23 December 2014 (UTC)

Erm, no. "Costa Navarino" is supposed to be an Italian name, not a Greek one; "Crete" is an anglicization of the Latin name "Creta", not directly derived from the Greek form Krete; likewise with "Constantine", and the Greek form is Konstantinos, not "Konstantine". So the examples are simply wrong. Common practice with modern placenames is to simply transliterate them, so the "K" should stay. Constantine ✍ 22:09, 23 December 2014 (UTC)

I am very new at this - but for those of you that might have missed it - the Amphipolis tomb aka Kasta tomb was built by Deinocrates, other arcitects of that period were Dimocrates, Cheirocrates and Stasicrates - now the measurements of this tomb is very similar to that of the footprint at Stonehenge? As well as many others... if there is a code to be broken or looked into further it is that of 1580, 1.580, 15.80, 158.0 - it keeps coming up in different areas I research... as well as 5, 7, 12, 13...

Further more - the half man half animal depictions thru-out Egyptian and Greek art is leading me to the connection between humans and astrology ie; signs of birth. sometimes the answer is very simple... I consider myself as such! Simple common sense without outside input is objectivity.

Thought?!?! — Preceding unsigned comment added by MyMoJo.mbs (talk • contribs) 18:44, 28 December 2014 (UTC)