Talk:Ghazan

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Without him, the Middle East would not have become Islamic[edit]

It appears that this Mongol ruler, who decided to convert to Islam, had an enormous impact on history. Without him, the middle east might have become Buddhist. Appropriately, such an influential historical figure should have a better and expanded article. John Hyams 22:31, 6 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I think you overestimated him, he could only affected Iran if he had not converted to Islam, Iran may have large minority of Christians or Buddists if he continue to practice Christian. But remember this Iran had become part of Islam long before Mongol arrival and Mongol population of Illkhanate is small compared to local Persians. And the most important factor to me is that the Islam in 14 century is totally different compare to it today. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 221.220.20.100 (talk) 14:16, 1 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Arabic legend[edit]

Double silver dirham of Ghazan.[1]
Obv: Legend in Arabic: ﻢﻠﺳﻭ ﻪﻴﻠﻋ ﻰﻠﺻ ﻪﻠﻟﺍﻝﻮﺳﺭ ﺪﻤﺤﻣ ﻪﻠﻟﺍﻻﺍﻪﻟﺍﻻ/ ﺰﻳﺮﺒﺗ ﺏﺮﺿ/ ... ﻊﺒﺳ ﺔﻨﺳ ﻰﻓ Lailahe illallah Muhammed resulullah salli aleyhe. Duribe Tebriz fi sene xxx.
Rev: Legend in Uyghur (except for "Ghazan Mahmud" in Arabic): Tengri-yin Küchündür. Ghazan Mahmud. Ghasanu Deledkegülügsen: "By the strength of the Heaven/ Ghazan Mahmud/ Coin struck for Ghazan".
Tabriz mint. 4.0gr. Silver.

Would anyone be able to translate the legend in Arabic on the coin of Ghazan?:
ﻢﻠﺳﻭ ﻪﻴﻠﻋ ﻰﻠﺻ ﻪﻠﻟﺍﻝﻮﺳﺭ ﺪﻤﺤﻣ ﻪﻠﻟﺍﻻﺍﻪﻟﺍﻻ/ ﺰﻳﺮﺒﺗ ﺏﺮﺿ/ ... ﻊﺒﺳ ﺔﻨﺳ ﻰﻓ Lailahe illallah Muhammed resulullah salli aleyhe. Duribe Tebriz fi sene xxx
It also seems that the Arabic date on the obverse of the coin is 692 AH.
Could any Arabic-reading Wikipedian confirm? Thank you! PHG 21:41, 30 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I am a native speaker of Arabic. Such ancient fonts are not easily read by modern Arab. "There is no God but Allah, Muhammed is His Prophet" is written on the left coin. I can read only Ghazan Mahmoud on the right coin and can't read the rest. --Meno25 21:56, 30 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you!! I think the date is in the upper right corner of the face of the coin. Can you read 692 or something else? Regards. PHG 05:56, 1 December 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Mint: Bāzār. Date: AH 701 (AD 1301-1302). Aramgar (talk) 02:47, 16 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]


  • Thank you for the great info! Would you be able to confirm the exact legend? Is it:

ﻢﻠﺳﻭ ﻪﻴﻠﻋ ﻰﻠﺻ ﻪﻠﻟﺍﻝﻮﺳﺭ ﺪﻤﺤﻣ ﻪﻠﻟﺍﻻﺍﻪﻟﺍﻻ/ ﺰﻳﺮﺒﺗ ﺏﺮﺿ/ ... ﻊﺒﺳ ﺔﻨﺳ ﻰﻓ Lailahe illallah Muhammed resulullah salli aleyhe. Duribe Bāzār fi sene 701 If so, would you have the capability to fill-in the arabic as well? Best regards. PHG (talk) 05:41, 16 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

References

  1. ^ For numismatic information: Coins of Ghazan, Ilkhanid coin reading.

Article title[edit]

Wikipedia guidelines are that an article should be titled by the "most common name" that a subject is known. For this individual, I think that Ghazan or Ghazan Khan is more common. This would also bring the title into something more consistent with the other Ilkhanate leaders. What do other editors think? --Elonka 02:15, 6 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Ghazan is perfect --Enerelt (talk) 07:01, 16 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Image[edit]

Ghazan with wife at his court.

Here is a nice image of Ghazan with his wife at his court. Feel free to insert it in the article. Cheers PHG (talk) 12:35, 11 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Agreed, it's a beautiful picture, thanks.  :) I'll try to find a place for it on my next edit. --Elonka 18:45, 11 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
You're very welcome. Try not deleting too much content at the same time you insert the image :)) Cheers PHG (talk) 18:49, 11 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Does the source indicate which wife? Is it Kökechin? --Elonka 06:30, 12 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Whoahhh, this is a very interesting suggestion, I hadn't thought of that. My source only says "Ghazan with his wife at his court", but I guess it could well be Kökechin indeed in the picture. I don't know for sure that she was his first wife, but I suppose she must have been, as she was bethrothed by Kubilai Khan himself. Thanks for the great idea, although we must clearly remain cautious in the caption. Cheers PHG (talk) 19:43, 12 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Ghazan's mother[edit]

Bulugan was childless queen. But She good took care of Ghazan.I think some of European sources probably made a mistake. Gaikhatu was not his brother but uncle. --Enerelt (talk) 10:40, 14 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Coinage[edit]

Gold coin under Ghazan, Shiraz, Iran, AH 700, 1301 CE.

Here's a coin gold of the Ghazan period. Feel free to insert it into the article. PHG (talk) 19:18, 21 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

 Done Thanks! Phg (talk) 04:53, 16 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

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The Muslim sect that Ghazan believed in[edit]

@Behsudii: Also, actual WP:RS seems to contradict this alleged Shia belief of Ghazan. A source published by Brill Publishers; "In order to keep power in his hands, Ghazan converted from Buddhism to Sunni Islam in September 1295." p. 195, The Mongols and the Armenians (1220-1335) HistoryofIran (talk) 02:20, 6 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

More:

  1. "It needs to be kept in mind that the Shafiʿi convert from Judaism Rashīd al-Dīn, the author of the above narrative, followed with suspicion the ascendancy of the Shiʿa both ideologically and politically, and openly opposed Ghazan’s potential conversion to Shiʿism (as far as we know, Ghazan never adopted Shiʿism either as an individual, or as a state religion, as much as some of the sources may like to suggest as much)." - page 147, Politics, Patronage and the Transmission of Knowledge in 13th - 15th Century Tabriz. Brill
  2. "Although later Shī‛ī writers made out that Ghazan was a Shī‛ī, the most that can be said is that he was devoted to the family of the Prophet (ahl al- bayt; see below)." page 362, Jackson, Peter (2017). The Mongols and the Islamic World: From Conquest to Conversion. Yale University Press
  3. "For the Ilkhans themselves, their religious identity continued to be problematic. The Shi‘i exerted a powerful attraction. While Oljeitu was the only one who actually converted to Shi‘ism and embraced Shi‘i teaching (his son, Abu Sa’id, reverted to Sunnism)", page 27, Babaie, Sussan (2019). Iran After the Mongols. Bloomsbury Publishing.

I guess that settles it. --HistoryofIran (talk) 02:31, 6 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

And what about the fatwa of ibn tamiyyah calling the ilkhanate leadership to be of the rafidha and calling them kuffar because of that? And what about how he enriched the shrines of the Imams in Karbala and Mashhad? And how about him applying the ruling of Imam Ali in his government? Behsudii (talk) 05:01, 6 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Sorry, but in Wikipedia we follow WP:RS. HistoryofIran (talk) 12:21, 6 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]
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