Talk:2021 Mexico City Grand Prix

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First running[edit]

I find the claim that this is the "first running" of the event to be quite dubious. A large number of prominent sources, such as the Guardian, the Independent, the Telegraph, Autosport, Motor Sport magazine, and The Race all continue to refer to this event as the "Mexican Grand Prix" regardless of what the official title might be. I don't see any indication that this is a different event any more than the French Grand Prix is a different event to the Grand Prix de l'ACF. Indeed, the press release from Formula One (cited in the article) in which the change of title was announced essentially says (to paraphrase) "from 2020 the official title of the Mexican Grand Prix will be the Mexico City Grand Prix". HumanBodyPiloter5 (talk) 05:37, 8 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

"First running" of the Mexico City Grand Prix basically retcons any history behind the Mexican Grand Prix. The Mexico City Grand Prix and Mexican Grand Prix are one and the same Grand Prix with the rename from the latter to the former. Hansen Sebastian^Talk 06:43, 8 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]
That is exactly why the lead is currently misleading. It should read: This was the xth edition of the Mexican Grand Prix, and the first time the race has been run under the "Mexico City Grand Prix" moniker. - or something to that effect. SSSB (talk) 10:41, 8 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Clarified. Island92 (talk) 11:43, 8 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

We had some instances in the past where the renaming was not treated in the same way: e.g. an event being called European Grand Prix in Baku one year, and the very same event (same venue, same organizers, etc.) being called Azerbaijan Grand Prix the very next year. Why should we treat it differently this time around? cherkash (talk) 12:04, 8 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Because the reliable sources did when we first discussed this (some time ago). The way the sources treated this at the time looked more to me like the time the "Malaysian Grand Prix" became the "Malaysia Grand Prix". The sources may well now say something different, in which case I am more than happy to discuss (espaically as I agree with you in principle). SSSB (talk) 12:07, 8 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Not sure what you mean by "treatment by reliable sources". I don't think the renaming is contested in any reliable sources. Since the fact the event was renamed is not contested, then the matter boils down to whether the principal entity (after which the Grand Prix is named) is the same or not. In case of Malaysia, it is the same (the difference being purely grammatical: whether to use an adjective (Malaysian) or a noun (Malaysia) to refer to the very same entity, the country of Malaysia). In Mexican case, it is NOT the same entity (before 2021, it is a country, but starting in 2021 it is a city). So the title has changed, and it's a new Grand Prix title for which the 2021 event was the first running. cherkash (talk) 10:46, 9 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]
It is not a question of what the event is named after - it is a question of what reliable sources have to say on the subject. Reliable sources (that I have seen) consider the Mexico City Grand Prix and the Mexican Grand Prix to be the same Grand Prix. If there are reliable sources which state the opposite, please share them. Without reliable sources supporting your position, your position is WP:OR. SSSB (talk) 14:31, 9 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]
@SSSB: Um, I'm not sure what is this distinction you are trying to make. Actually, what matters IS the title, and not whether some "reliable" sources say that different titles really meant to be the same. You will find plenty of sources that said something like "European Grand Prix is renamed Azerbaijan Grand Prix from 2017", "German Grand Prix at Nurburgring is renamed Luxembourg Grand Prix", etc. Does this also mean we should start treating European & Azerbaijan GPs as synonymous? Or German & Luxembourg GPs as synonymous? I don't think so - and this is not the consensus on WP:F1 project either. So why the special treatment for Mexico & Mexico City GPs? cherkash (talk) 20:34, 22 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I've started a thread on WT:F1, as I think it has wider implications than just a single race. I suggest we continue discussing this topic there. cherkash (talk) 21:28, 22 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]