Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Ben Briley (2nd nomination)

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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was no consensus‎. Ritchie333 (talk) (cont) 16:13, 16 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Ben Briley[edit]

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Ben Briley (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log | edits since nomination)
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I had redirected this article, but it was reverted. Fails WP:NSINGER. Bgsu98 (Talk) 03:33, 21 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Sure, but that's in addition to a wealth of news coverage about his time on Idol. Briley clearly meets the WP:GNG criteria, and he's recieved some news coverage for his own music career after Idol. This article serves a purpose for anyone who wants to know about that career, and I guess I just don't understand what's accomplished by turning this into a redirect. --Jpcase (talk) 04:57, 21 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Keep: per arguments presented by Jpcase Jack4576 (talk) 05:18, 21 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment There seems to be quite a bit of coverage about him online, including from The Hollywood Reporter[1][2], The Portland Leader [3](Part 1, Part 2) and The Tennessean[4] Alvaldi (talk) 10:29, 23 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
A view among many editors is that American Idol finalists need to recieve some sort of additional news coverage after their time on Idol to recieve a standalone article. I don't necessarily agree with that view though. The sheer amount of news coverage and cultural impact of Idol during its Fox iteration was so much greater than that of any other reality series that I feel it should be a unique case where news coverage related to the series is enough to display individual notability for the finalists. That said, I recognize that some editors would like to see news coverage for each finalist that is unrelated to the finalist participating on Idol. Briley has such news coverage from the three articles I shared above about his EP. It's not a lot, but the bar for establishing individual notability in this case should not have to be especially high, since Briley already meets the GNG so easily. --Jpcase (talk) 13:50, 23 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
If the individual passes the general notability guideline then the article should not be deleted. Per WP:SINGER Wikipedia should not have a separate article on a person, band, or musical work that does not meet the criteria of either this guideline or the general notability guideline. However, GNG requires WP:SUSTAINED coverage. That is, not just a brief burst of coverage over a relatively short amount of time. The coverage I found is from February to December 2014. The only source that covers the subject significantly in any other year is a [5] which is a blog and should not be used per WP:SELFPUBLISH. As it stands, I feel the subjects needs at least one other significant source that is from at at least 2013 or 2015 for him to pass GNG. Alvaldi (talk) 14:54, 23 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Idol Chatter is published by The York Dispatch, so while it's in the format of a blog, it wouldn't actually be considered self-published. --Jpcase (talk) 15:33, 23 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
The Hollywood Reporter is a few sentences about him, nothing extensive. A RS, yes, but not extensive coverage. Oaktree b (talk) 02:34, 31 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete not notable, borderline BIO1E. Appeared on a few episodes of American Idol, but no other substantial coverage. (The Lebanon Democrat piece is extremely local, and reads like a press release.) Walt Yoder (talk) 22:48, 29 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Barkeep49 (talk) 01:28, 31 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]

  • Delete "Local person gets featured on national TV show" is about the extent of the coverage for this individual. Delete for not meeting GNG or any musical notability (no charted singles, no national awards, no tour reviews in the national press). Oaktree b (talk) 02:32, 31 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Oaktree b When it comes to his American Idol appearances, there's a ton of national news coverage, so I don't think it's fair to characterize the coverage as just "local". I do still feel that the article should be kept, on the basis of coverage from publications like The Hollywood Reporter, Entertainment Weekly, Tvline, etc. But if others disagree, would you be willing to at least switch your vote to redirecting the article to American Idol (season 13)? --Jpcase (talk) 03:06, 31 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
A !redirect is fine if it goes that way. Oaktree b (talk) 03:08, 31 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep per the significant coverage in multiple independent reliable sources. The subject passes Wikipedia:Notability (people)#Basic criteria, which says:

    People are presumed notable if they have received significant coverage in multiple published secondary sources that are reliable, intellectually independent of each other, and independent of the subject.

    • If the depth of coverage in any given source is not substantial, then multiple independent sources may be combined to demonstrate notability; trivial coverage of a subject by secondary sources is not usually sufficient to establish notability.
    Sources
    1. Tong, Holly (2014-02-27). "Living the dream one song at a time". Lebanon Democrat. Archived from the original on 2023-06-04. Retrieved 2023-06-04.

      The article notes: "Before Ben’s rise to fame, the 24-year-old who graduated from Gallatin High school in 2007 was working as a server at Olive Garden while pursuing his music and enjoying life with his wife Courtney. ... Though he’s a strong UT fan, he went on to college at MTSU due to them having the best field of study for journalism. He focused on Broadcasting and PR. While there he became the anchorman for the campus sports, and got some experience with channel 10 in Murfreesboro."

    2. Wadhwani, Anita (2001-06-05). "Gallatin boy promoting national day for siblings". The Tennessean. Archived from the original on 2023-06-04. Retrieved 2023-06-04 – via Newspapers.com.

      The article notes: "A Gallatin boy wants to make sure that siblings get their due by adding a Brothers and Sisters Day to the national calendar. Benjamin Briley, 12, hopes that June 2 — a date sandwiched between Mother's Day and Father's Day — will become that new holiday. Gov. Don Sunduist has agreed. Twice. ... said Benjamin, who is a sixth-grade honor student at Shafer Middle School and brother to 8-year-old Meggie."

    3. Tong, Holly (2014-12-26). "Briley releases 'Outlier' EP". Lebanon Democrat. Archived from the original on 2023-06-04. Retrieved 2023-06-04.

      The article notes: "In fact, he just released an EP entitled “Outlier” which showcases his individuality and versatility. Briley’s latest music can be found on iTunes, Amazon and Spotify, among others. Hard copies of the EP will be available in 2015."

    4. Bronson, Fred (2014-03-14). "'American Idol' Eliminated Contestant Ben Briley: 'I Was One of the Weakest'". The Hollywood Reporter. Archived from the original on 2023-06-04. Retrieved 2023-06-04.

      The article notes: "Briley was a waiter at the chain restaurant. ... Briley was also very young when he performed the first time for a large audience. ... Although music is in Briley’s DNA — he explains that his great-grandmother was the first woman to sing at the Grand Ole Opry and his mother writes songs and was president of the Barbara Mandrell fan club — while he was growing up, he thought of music as a hobby, not a profession. ... Briley had a third option for a career – he majored in PR."

    There is sufficient coverage in reliable sources to allow Ben Briley to pass Wikipedia:Notability#General notability guideline, which requires "significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject".

    Cunard (talk) 08:48, 4 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]

  • Comment I want to re-affirm my delete vote in response to this comment. If the best coverage is super-local coverage of him saying something about "national siblings day" as a 12-year-old (plus already-discussed coverage of his short time on American Idol), there is clearly not enough coverage to justify an article. Walt Yoder (talk) 13:32, 4 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment: I maintain that nearly a full year's worth of significant coverage from national news outlets about his time on Idol, plus a little bit of coverage about his EP, should be reason enough to discount deletion as a proper outcome, when redirection or merging are also options. And I really do feel that this article should be kept. I feel even more strongly about this in light of the Tennessean news article found by Cunard, which was published years before Briley ever appeared on Idol. It should be noted that Briley didn't simply "say something about National Siblings Day", he originated the idea for the day, which was officially adopted as a holiday in the state of Tennessee. Jpcase (talk) 17:21, 4 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, - 🔥𝑰𝒍𝒍𝒖𝒔𝒊𝒐𝒏 𝑭𝒍𝒂𝒎𝒆 (𝒕𝒂𝒍𝒌)🔥 01:19, 8 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
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