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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was Delete

Two Finger Test

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This I think is speedy material. Somebody delete it quick! --L33tminion | (talk) 06:19, Jan 15, 2005 (UTC) 06:18, 15 Jan 2005 (UTC) (Oops, forgot to sign in... edited)

Note: I'm not the origional poster. This was unsigned.

Votes

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  • I didn't start this VfD page, but it should be speedy deleted as patent nonsense. --Kelly Martin 06:18, Jan 15, 2005 (UTC)
  • Indeed, it's complete nonsense. I've made it less crapulent with a strategic "not", but it's still ripe for deletion. - Nunh-huh 06:25, 15 Jan 2005 (UTC)
  • Technically, it isn't patent nonsense. Patent nonsense is random characters. This is just nonsense which should be deleted. PMC 06:57, 15 Jan 2005 (UTC)
    • Patent nonsense can also mean "Stuff that, while apparently meaningful after a fashion, is so completely and irremediably confused that no intelligent person can be expected to try to make head or tail of it." But this doesn't meet that definition, either.
  • Delete or maybe this is a candidate for BJAODN lol ÅrУnT†∈ 07:59, 15 Jan 2005 (UTC)
  • Delete Any lawyer or doctor can tell you that this is NOT a test approved by a court in a western country in recent memory. Any person with some sex education would know that this test would be of questionable scientific validity. All around this article reeks of misinformation and innaccuracy. Could be saved if the jurisdiction and/or era in which this was followed were cited --Rexrexilius 10:50, 15 Jan 2005 (UTC)
  • Delete this nonsense. Rje 19:31, Jan 15, 2005 (UTC)
  • Delete. No verifiable source given for this (and none will be given because it is misinformation). Dpbsmith (talk) 22:06, 15 Jan 2005 (UTC)
  • Delete. Nonsense, but not patent nonsense --Carnildo 01:43, 16 Jan 2005 (UTC)
  • The test is used in courts to verify if a virgin or rape victim is telling the truth. It is the only way Doctors can tell.—the word hymen must mean nothing to whoever came up with this test. Delete and have a word with Supercool Dude's parents check the rest of the Dude's contributions carefully. —Charles P. (Mirv) 02:20, 16 Jan 2005 (UTC)
  • Just for the heck of it, I've done a Complete Rewrite of the article to discuss the various actual two-finger tests that there appear to be, retaining only the debunking of the original quackery. Weak Keep. Uncle G 05:48, 2005 Jan 16 (UTC)
    • Your complete rewrite was reverted by Supercool Dude to an abbreviated version of his original article. Does your weak keep still stand? -- Curps 02:36, 17 Jan 2005 (UTC)
      • I'm not particularly attached to the notion of there being a "Two Finger Test" article per se. The only real expansion potential that I see for this article is the inclusion of yet further tests that people have that involve the use of two fingers in some way. I haven't found one that is individually notable. Collectively, they aren't particularly notable, either, given their diversity and the tautology of what is common to all. It's a test, that involves the use of two fingers. Gosh. Uncle G 05:11, 2005 Jan 17 (UTC)
  • Weak Keep, article needs cleanup and expansion. Megan1967 01:48, 17 Jan 2005 (UTC)
  • Someone has googled for "two finger test" and linked all the results. Please redirect to Google. I mean: DELETE. JFW | T@lk 20:46, 16 Jan 2005 (UTC)
    • At Dpb's request: a two finger test must be unreliable due to the size difference in fingers. A doctor with acromegaly would find the woman a virin, while his colleague with Marfan syndrome would find the opposite. Visual inspection of the introitus is probably much more informative, and requires no fingers. JFW | T@lk 21:46, 16 Jan 2005 (UTC)
  • Delete. None of these is notable, and we don't even have articles for them. JoaoRicardo 05:30, 17 Jan 2005 (UTC)
  • Keep. I'm guessing that someone has tidied the entry after most users here posted. However the article does require clean-up, a disambiguation header and Wikipedia articles for each of the tests described. Axl 11:47, 19 Jan 2005 (UTC)
    • Seriously, are all (any?) of these "two finger tests" encyclopedic in their own right? They're just a grab-bag of Google results for the phrase. Even the "adolescent folklore" bit has no source for it... Supercool Dude is not an adolescent according to his user page, and "S.A. Suriano" may not even exist (see discussion below). Is there a need to keep even the modified article? -- Curps 17:16, 19 Jan 2005 (UTC)
      • No. It should not be kept. Uncle G who turned up all the other "two-finger tests" was making an interesting and valid point, but none of them is worthy of a whole article and collecting them into a list is no more encyclopedic than a list of rules of thumb would be. (I'm typing this in, don't know yet whether rules of thumb will turn out to be a redlink or not!) And you're right that the phrase "adolescent fantasy," which is my language, is just my surmise, I was trying to reword that paragraph to be less tendentious than Uncle G's original language, "What the Two Finger Test is not, is a test to see whether a woman is a virgin." Nobody has yet given any source other than Supercool Dude himself for the existence of any real or mythical "two finger test for virginity." As of now, it remains unsourced and unverifiable. Dpbsmith (talk) 02:54, 20 Jan 2005 (UTC)
  • Delete. —Ben Brockert (42) 01:22, Jan 21, 2005 (UTC)

Supercool Dude's idiosyncratic definition and the existence of "S. A. Suriano M.D. Surgeon"

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  • Back in the early 1990's I saw a woman (Kimberly Bergalis) who testified in a Florida Court of Law that she was still a Virgin and they proved to the Judge that she was not. I asked my Surgeon who was a Board Certified Urologist how they could tell!
    He told me of this TFT and said that a woman who has repeated Sexual Intercourse will become "loose" and stay that way.
    I asked my Sister an Brother In Law who are physicians and they said yes it is true! Are there any MD's here in Wikipedia?
    I stand for speaking the Truth! You guys are politically correct children!
    Supercool Dude 01:47, 16 Jan 2005 (UTC)
    • No problem, then. Under "references," or on Talk:Two Finger Test, give the names and professional contact information of the doctors who told you this, so the information can be verified. "Dr. so-and-so, (year), thus-and-such clinic, city, state, personal communication." I'll call when I get a chance this week and if I can verify the information I'll change my vote to "keep." One of them can probably give me a relevant citation to whatever code specifies that this is the legal definition (in whatever state this applies to).
    • The information may be true, but we have to have a verifiable source for it. See Wikipedia:Cite your sources. Verifiable means that someone else can check it. It can't just be "I heard it from my brother-in-law." Dpbsmith (talk) 02:14, 16 Jan 2005 (UTC)
      • The only listings Anywho has for "Suriano" in New York State are:
        Suriano Costantino P Attorney
        1 Battery Park Plaza
        New York, NY 10004

        Suriano Photo Studio
        3009 Stillwell Avenue
        Brooklyn, NY 11224

        Suriano R Home Improvements
        156 Barrett Street
        Schenectady, NY 1230

        Is "Suriano" the right spelling? What hospital, clinic, or office does he practice at? Can't tell from your user page what state you were in when you worked for him. Dpbsmith (talk) 02:24, 16 Jan 2005 (UTC)
      • Empire Blue Cross/Blue Shield, http://www.empireblue.com/member/universal/providerfind.shtml , "find a provider," has no listings for either "Siriano" or "Suriano." Dpbsmith (talk) 02:29, 16 Jan 2005 (UTC)
      • Superpages, nationwide search, type in my personal physician's surname as keyword and it finds it. Suriano yields only two MD's
        • Suriano Catherine MD, 401 10th Street, Berthoud, CO 80513
        • Suriano Kimberly MD, 501 North Graham Street, Portland, OR 97227
      • Neither of these sounds like an "S. A. Suriano" Dpbsmith (talk) 02:38, 16 Jan 2005 (UTC)
      • There is an S. A. Suriano in this 1935 New York medical directory, apparently at that time an assistant in the urology department... that's doesn't sound right, either... Dpbsmith (talk) 02:42, 16 Jan 2005 (UTC)
  • The story about Kimberly Bergalis is false, in any case. She was, as per my memory, but more importantly, as per the Washington Times (09/17/91), p. F2, a "nonhemophiliac virgin" who contracted AIDS from her Florida dentist Stewart Acer. It was the first case of such transmission, and her virginity was certainly not "disproved", no matter what one's brother-in-law says. - Nunh-huh 02:30, 16 Jan 2005 (UTC)

S. A. Suriano M.D.

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S.A Suriano M.D. is buried in Woodlawn Cemetery Bronx New York.

He was born in 1903 and died in 1997 of congestive Heart failure.

His office was at 1130 Pelham Parkway Bronx NY.

He became a doctor in 1927. He was a General Surgeon and Urologist.

Regarding verifying the Two Finger Test, If you know a doctor, why don't you ask him if its true.

This article was Medical Information, not nonsense.

Supercool Dude 03:48, 15 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]


The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
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