Wikipedia:Suspected sock puppets/VinceB (5th)

The following discussion is an archived debate of the case of suspected sockpuppetry. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page. All edits should go to the talk page of this case. If you are seeing this page as a result of an attempt to open a new case of sockpuppetry of the same user, read this for detailed instructions.

User:VinceB

Suspected sockpuppeteer

VinceB (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · page moves · block user · block log)

Suspected sockpuppets

Squash Racket (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · page moves · block user · block log)

Report submission by

Tankred 22:51, 5 October 2007 (UTC)

Evidence

All the evidence can be found at Wikipedia:Suspected sock puppets/VinceB (4th). Squash Racket was blocked indef as a sockpuppet of a banned user. But, later, The Random Editor decided to unblock him "on a probationary basis".[1]. This unblock only encouraged Squash Racket to resume his disruptive activities (he has launched edit war over several articles today) and patterns of VinceB's edits are now only more obvious. Please compare this edit by VinceB[2] with this edit by Squash Racket[3], this edit by VnceB[4] with this one by Squash Racket[5], this edit by VinceB[6] with this one by Squash Racket[7]. All of them concern quite obscure articles (about ancient noble families) and both VinceB and Squash Racket share the same, very specific POV: there were no Slovaks before 1918, only Hungarians, so there is no way these families could be Slovak. Since The Random Editor has left Wikipedia, I cannot ask him to block this sockpuppet again. That is why I filed this request. Please see Wikipedia:Suspected sock puppets/VinceB (4th) for additional evidence.

Comments

I've already clarified this, so please read the talk page of The Random Editor, I don't want to repeat myself again. Also please read my talk page, I don't want to repeat those facts either. And for the past false accusations of Tankred see[8]. The edits mentioned above are not identical, so please also check those. Thank you.

Tankred will get away with this every time he tries it? How many times will he try to associate me with a user who did not respect any WP rules without being held responsible? Please also look at his edits just after he posted this next accusation and also the edit summaries while reverting to a false statement[9],[10],[11]. I will have to call an RfC (see that one) every time he decides to act in an unacceptable way? That seems the only way to silence his constant POV pushing.

The Random Editor promised to follow my edits closely and when I yesterday asked him why he was not doing it[12], I found out he had left Wikipedia. That's when Tankred decided to attack me again. Squash Racket 05:44, 6 October 2007 (UTC)

As an established Hungarian editor since 2005 I would like to express my opinion that in this case Tankred tries to solve a content dispute with force and sockpuppetry charges, intimidating a relatively new user. I think WP:BITE but also WP:HAR should be cited here because this is not the first such attack against the same user. I think that Squash Racket is not VinceB. He is a Hungarian, who is obviously interested in Slovakia related topics (among others), but this not enough reason to call him sockpuppet. It seems to me that the real aim of these kind of constant sockpuppetry charges to make Slovakia related articles a no go area for Hungarian users and transform legitimate content disputes into "disruptive editing" which are actually not. Zello 23:24, 6 October 2007 (UTC)

Zello, you share Squash Racket's POV and that is totally cool with me. I do not know whether you genuinely believe Squash Racket is not just another sockpuppet of VinceB or you are doing this because of our recent disagreement or you are trying to protect a user supporting your POV. But the rules prohibit banned user to edit Wikipedia. As I know VinceB's style of editing and communication better than I ever wanted, I am certain he is VinceB. Several other editors agree with me[13][14][15] and other people are more than welcome to check the evidence. I encourage other editors to compare Squash Racket and VinceB and decide this matter. Tankred 23:55, 6 October 2007 (UTC)

Obviously anybody can make mistakes but I don't think that he is VinceB. He made many edits not related to Hungary or Slovakia. I don't remember that Vince was interested in the history of Catholicism, Izrael or car manufacturing. Squash Racket edited these topics and engaged into discussion with other users without conflict. Zello 00:22, 7 October 2007 (UTC)

The first two editors you mentioned have not voiced their 'agreeing' with you on that since they read my answer for your accusations on my talk page. They made those comments after reading your POV accusation without asking me. They thought you were acting in good faith. MarkBA is a user supporting your POV, so according to your remark above you won't accept his opinion on the matter. Squash Racket 04:17, 7 October 2007 (UTC)

In fact, VinceB and Squash Racket also share their interest in the Jewish history.[16] Tankred 16:31, 16 October 2007 (UTC)

An IP address makes some wikifying in an article I never edited(!) and you even want to use that against me? Based on your next accusation anyone could be associated with anyone here, especially those from the same nation. Who do you think is disruptive right now? You still don't understand WP:HAR and you won't stop. What if we started to talk a bit about your similar editing patterns with banned user Juro?? You defend articles right now made up by this vandal!

Jewish Colonization Association (the article I never edited) focuses on Jewish people moving to America anyway, as I can remember all my edits on the topic are Israel-related, but check this one too. Squash Racket 04:57, 17 October 2007 (UTC)

That IP was blocked because it belonged to VinceB. Tankred 15:32, 17 October 2007 (UTC)

You still call those few little edits of that IP a 'shared interest in Jewish history'? You still want me to know about all IP address edits that were made when I wasn't even here in articles I never edited? You start to be ridiculous now. Once you say I only edit specific articles (nationalism), now your problem is having a wider range of interest. And you bring your 'evidence' for both. Squash Racket 16:32, 17 October 2007 (UTC)

OK, look at banned user's contributions. Let's see some articles he was really involved in that I have not edited somehow: First Vienna Award, Vojvodina massacre, Ethnic cleansing, Fidesz - Hungarian Civic Union, 1944-1945 Killings in Bačka, Occupation of Vojvodina, 1941-1944, Slovenská pospolitosť - Národná strana, Busójárás, True Slovak National Party, Clash of Civilizations etc.
He edited a wide range of articles (and I know nothing about the IPs).
Should I mention all the articles that I have edited and he (at least his real account) did not? Squash Racket 17:00, 17 October 2007 (UTC)

People can form their own opinion after seeing Wikipedia:Suspected sock puppets/VinceB (4th) and this page. For me, all the similarities between you and VinceB can mean only one thing: If a bird looks like a duck, swims like a duck and quacks like a duck, then it's probably a duck. Tankred 19:07, 17 October 2007 (UTC)

If that is true, how do we know that you are not banned user Juro? You did not waste much time on analyzing the differences, even though you claim to be NPOV. People can form their own opinion after reading my talk page and The Random Editor's talk page, especially how this all started[17]. You did not answer if that 'duck' speaks German like me.

Also I would like to hear your theory about disruptive 'ducks' like Egapresu[18], Again444[19], Again44[20], and Bruce95bruce[21] who surprisingly jumped in recently supporting your POV without any previous edits on Wikipedia. Squash Racket 03:19, 18 October 2007 (UTC)

Look, other sockpuppets of VinceB have used the same tactics as you - to attack me and other editors as a means of their defense. I am somehow not surprised you are doing the same. Since you suggest there is some connection between me and four other accounts you mentioned, I encourage you to ask for a checkuser. Both their and my logs are fresh enough. If you wish, I will be even happy to assist you with your request for checkuser. But this page is about you and your connection to a banned user. So, please do not try to divert the discussion. Tankred 04:09, 18 October 2007 (UTC)

I denied your 'evidence' fair enough multiple times, so don't call me a sockpuppet neither here, nor in edit summaries, OK? Besides mentioning these 'new users', I defended my case in a number of ways, so please don't compare tactics here. I just wanted to point out that in obviously disruptive cases you did not report anything, while you can't stop abusing me.

As you said you knew everything about Vince, because you were here then. Don't you know if he spoke German? Squash Racket 05:03, 18 October 2007 (UTC)

Tankred, you posted this[22] at the 3RR board less than an hour after you asked me not to divert discussion and not to attack other 'editors' for my defense. Squash Racket 05:48, 18 October 2007 (UTC)

Conclusions

No conclusive evidence these two users are more than just interested in the same material. Is it possible Squash is a sock? Yes, but I'm not convinced of it. Random Editor changing his mind also make me hesitant. More solid evidence is needed to convince me. No tction taken at this time.Rlevse 16:21, 19 October 2007 (UTC)

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