- Falling In Reverse (talk|edit|history|logs|links|watch) (XfD|restore)
Please Restore this Page, it has met all the Requirements as set forth by WP:MUSIC:A musician or ensemble (note that this includes a band, singer, rapper, orchestra, DJ, musical theatre group, etc.) may be notable if it meets at least one of the following criteria:
Has been the subject of multiple, non-trivial, published works appearing in sources that are reliable and are independent from the musician or ensemble itself. - [Has Been Met.]
Has received non-trivial coverage in a reliable source of an international concert tour, or a national concert tour in at least one sovereign country. - [Has Been Met.]
Is an ensemble which contains two or more independently notable musicians, or is a musician who has been a member of two or more independently notable ensembles. - Has Been Met - See Ronnie Radke and Mika Horiuchi. Kygora 00:38, 14 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Keep deleted Nominators claims that this band meet the criteria of wp:NMUSIC are incorrect. The coverage on altpress appear to be reprints of press releases on a website of questionable reliablity. The criteria of coverage of a concert tour does ofcourse not include the website of the tour itself, besides the question whether it is a reliable source. (this appears to be an oversight in the wording of criteria, will be bold and fix it). The test to see if Ronnie Radke and Mika Horiuchi Kygora are independently notable is to check if they have articles on wikipedia, which they do not. I see no evidence of this article meeting any of the criteria, therefor the article should remain deleted Yoenit (talk) 09:04, 14 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Keep deleted - the nominator has not provided significant enough coverage for an undeletion to be appropriate. --Anthem 11:41, 14 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- User who posted this Reply, well they have been, Banned, which does not surprise me, which also makes this reply invalid. --Kygora 20:28, 14 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Here is more press [Kerrang] and it is Mika Horiuchi, kygora is my Screen Name, Also here is their Official page on Epitaph Records: [Epitaph Records] and also, the Alt Press Coverage is Official ALt Press, where do you find that they are Reprints from Questionable sources? and why would Alt Press Reprint is if it is Questionable? Your Criteria for Keeping it Deleted is Flawed more than My criteria for restoration. Ronnie Radke may not have a Wikipedia page, but he was in the well known band Escape the Fate like their page even states. Kygora 14:27, 14 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- The issue with Alt Press and by the looks the Kerrang piece you list, is they look like they are press releases. Press releases are fairly easy to get published far and wide, are not intellectually independent and don't show that those publishing have expressed any real interest in the band, such that they invest time in creating fact checked in depth articles. As such they don't demonstrate notability. Similarly the official site doesn't prove much, I can set up more own official site for my band... Your comment on Ronnie Radke shows the problem, the criteria was "two or more independently notable musicians", as Radke doesn't have an article that fails, there isn't independent notability, or "is a musician who has been a member of two or more independently notable ensembles", where you've listed one so misses that one as well. Have you also read or conflict of interest guidelines? If you are of general note, why do you need to pursue this yourself? --82.7.44.178 (talk) 18:27, 14 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Restore - The reason for this article to be requested for undeletion is because the article was of a notible band WP:BAND the article was put into the Article Incubator were contributors worked on the article the article passed because it cited enough infomation regarding the notible band Falling In Reverse. The article was moved from the incubator on the 12th June 2011 and the article title/name was renamed from Falling In Reverse (Band) to Falling In Reverse to resemble the notible band on Wikipedia. Although there has been previous version on this article which where deleted through AfD the article was recreated and passed the WP:BAND dated above to only have been deleted again by user User:Jayjg who is believed to be a Moderator on wikipedia. Although he has deleted severeal times he has not put valid reason why he had deleted and locked article Falling In Reverse without researching why the article was moved from the article incubator to wikipedia the article met WP:BAND there was no valid reason to the deletion but G4: Recreation of a page that was deleted per a deletion discussion: Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Falling In Reverse) even though a discussion was created for multiple articles of the band these article kept moving around and swapped, blanked and destory by guest edits. Therefore a request was made that the article was made semi protected and that only members could edit parts of article Falling In Reverse this faild the conclution in the discussion and there was no contribution by any moderator is regards of the article's that had been put up for AfD & MfD. I believe that the article Falling In Reverse should be undeleted and that the article to remain the main wikipedia article for Falling In Reverse to avoid the confussion of the article beiong deleted the article should be semi - protected to avoid page blanks or any kind of article destruction.— Preceding unsigned comment added by Smikeyy (talk • contribs)
- Comment the only real question I can see which needs answering at this time is was the restored article substantially the same as the original deleted article, if it wasn't then it probably wasn't eligible for speedy deletion and should be relisted for a fuller deletion discussion (That's where arguments about notability are best had, DRV is about the deletion process being followed). If it was substantially the same then moving it back to the incubator for further work maybe a reasonable option. --82.7.44.178 (talk) 18:41, 14 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- No it wasn't, The Only thing the 2 articles in question had in common were who it was about, the newer one was more thorough and had Better citing and more information. Kygora 18:46, 14 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- What they had in common was poor citing and a failure to meet WP:BAND. Jayjg (talk) 01:12, 17 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- This is my final conclution from what it looks like the article for this band has been created to many time and they were all AfD but from what the article looks like I think it should be un deleted and put back onto wikipedia the only reason being is that once this article has been what Ithink stupidly deleted for a article that shows citedsources notible band the article will only be created over and over again. From what it look like there has been some quite good contribution and some good sources cited.
- Comment. I believe members of this band or avid fans have restored it fifteen separate times following its deletion. The only thing they've actually failed to do is address the issues that got it deleted in the first place; that is, the fact that it still doesn't meet the notability requirements of WP:BAND. Jayjg (talk) 00:33, 15 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Your Entire Basis on Deleting this Bands article is based on a Deletion Discussion from nearly 2 years Ago before the band was even complete, and didn't have any actual music. and because you are Biased to this Aritcle for Deletion you are blind to the fact that they do in Fact meet the requirements. Which people used this biased Information to turn down the evidence that is there, that proves this band meets the requirements. So i ask you, and everyone else, to actually look into this bands notabillity. --Kygora 01:42, 15 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- You state its been remade Fifteen Times well, i have been watching these recreations and none have been as Full, Well-Cited and Completely within Wikipedian Rules as this last one was. --Kygora 01:52, 15 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Keep Deleted - Does not meet any criteria of WP:MUSIC that I can see, original AfD result is therefore still valid. They have one release on Epitaph Records though so if that charts it will meet MUSIC criteria #2, sells well and hit #3, or they' do a 2nd release with that label then it will hit #5. Seems like only a matter of time but as for right now, just short. Tarc (talk) 16:00, 15 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Did you ever look into Criteria #4 Has received non-trivial coverage in independent reliable sources of an international concert tour, or a national concert tour in at least one sovereign country. Their Coverage and Tour dates with [Warped Tour]/[Warped Tour Band Page] From August 10 - August 14 2011 Meets this Criteria. --Kygora 17:11, 15 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- erm, that isn't independent coverage, it's the tours promotional material. --82.7.44.178 (talk) 21:53, 15 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- This has been debunked several times now, most recently in the comment immediately above this one. Tarc (talk) 12:53, 16 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
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