Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Yacht rock (2nd nomination)

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. Consensus is for the article to be retained. Of note is that content-wise, this is not particularly a WP:G4 situation, based upon a comparison of article versions and content (example diff, example diff); the present version differs considerably. North America¹⁰⁰⁰ 20:44, 29 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Yacht rock

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WP:Neologism recreated in 2016 without discussion after 2006 deletion decision in Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Yacht rock (also Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2008 April 5#Category:Yacht rock). Now has an unsourced claim that it existed earlier than the series Yacht Rock, contradicting the AfD where the series creator says he "came up with the term". Closeapple (talk) 07:06, 22 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Music-related deletion discussions. Closeapple (talk) 07:07, 22 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Language-related deletion discussions. Closeapple (talk) 07:11, 22 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Television-related deletion discussions. Closeapple (talk) 07:12, 22 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Film-related deletion discussions. Closeapple (talk) 07:12, 22 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Speedy keep – Submitter failed to cite any specific reason for how exactly "yacht rock" is non-notable (WP:GNG). There are plenty of reliable sources discussing the "yacht rock" genre within the article. Does that 10-year-old AfD really matter at this point? The term has obviously caught on since then.
- "From Haim to Chromeo: The new wave of Yacht-rockers" (The Independent)
- "Sail Away: The Oral History of 'Yacht Rock'" (Rolling Stone)
- "Can You Sail to It? Then It Must Be ‘Yacht Rock’" (The Wall Street Journal)
- "Popsmacked: Yacht Rock drifts on the currents of uncool" (The Record)

And so on.--Ilovetopaint (talk) 09:06, 22 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

I nominated it because it's sort of a WP:CSD#G4 that might no longer meet the criteria for G4. A bit of history on this article/title: The article was born rotten each time it was created in the past, a blatant attempt by people attached to the series to get a fictional element (the phrase itself) into Wikipedia, written in real-world terms as if it was in real use, when it wasn't. Admittedly, the phrase has gotten some traction in real life now. But since this phrase was pushed by people with WP:COI, and has a history of editing and AfD input by single-purpose accounts, and was deleted per discussion anyway, and seems to have whatever creation story is most likely to make it sound legitimate from time to time (including that claim that just disappeared after this AfD started), the whole thing surrounding this phrase still seems like it's being artificially propped up. (I don't think User:Ilovetopaint is part of the artificial push, though.) I think it at least needs an AfD to get consensus about whether the phrase itself is now separately notable, or still just a backreference to the series Yacht Rock that isn't separately notable. --Closeapple (talk) 16:14, 22 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Keep: it might have started as a neologism (don't they all?) but honestly, I do think the term is now widely used across the media and general public. The sources cited above by Ilovetopaint are all very reliable, and even in the UK (hardly classic "yacht rock" territory) it's being used now in mainstream media: the BBC have broadcast a radio show on it, and the phrase is being used in newspaper articles from the left-wing The Guardian to the right-wing Daily Telegraph. Richard3120 (talk) 17:04, 22 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Keep Yacht rock has been the subject of various in-depth sources as pointed by Ilovetopaint and Richard3120. These sources discuss, in-depth, the genre itself and the reception it has received. The term was probably non-notable some 10 years ago, but that's not really relevant, as this is 2016, not 2006. Certainly meets WP:GNG. —Mythdon (talk • contribs) 17:33, 22 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Keep, sources meet gng. Pwolit iets (talk) 01:05, 23 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Keep. Sources listed above are compelling. To add to them, Sirius XM even gave the genre a (temporary) channel of its own, which [itself got citable coverage from the Wall Street Journal. There's plenty out there even from unimpeachable sources. At this point, I'm far from troubled if, ten years ago, this article had a dubious genesis. The content and sourcing now are surely not what they were then. Squeamish Ossifrage (talk) 17:20, 23 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Keep - I don't know why, but it looks to have received sufficient coverage to pass WP:GNG. — Rhododendrites ^talk \\ 18:07, 23 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Keep -Sources are sufficient to make this a notable topic. ABF99 (talk) 23:21, 23 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Absolutely keep Sources definitely established this topic....also see post by Mythadon. While not extensively detailed as an article on Wikipedia, it's received a lot of coverage by music journalists, and this page at least is a cohesive topic that details Yacht rock. Aleccat (talk) 16:53, 24 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Question (or maybe Merge to Soft rock): Is this a separate subject from Soft rock, or does the phrase "yacht rock" just sounds more clever/marketable right now? Soft rock's list of examples is 80% of what "yacht rock" claims, and cites P. Buckley, The Rough Guide to Rock (Rough Guides, 3rd edn., 2003), p. 378.), which predates the Yacht Rock series by 2 years. --Closeapple (talk) 18:11, 25 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

"Yes, they refer to different styles/eras of music. "Soft rock" is a generic, catch-all term while "yacht rock" is more specific.--Ilovetopaint (talk) 12:14, 26 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

DEVINITELY KEEP: The topic is notable and therefore the article should be retained. I do feel, however, that the article could use some changes in focus. Right now it reads more as a dictionary expanation--i.e. defining the topic as a linguistic term rather than as an actual musical sub-genre. So, it could be reworded to define the topic as a subgenre of soft rock (rather than as a term). It could also use some expansion, but those are just some constructive pointers. Keep the article. Garagepunk66 (talk) 04:14, 27 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.